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So... N4 Hunh?

Discussion in 'News' started by AdmiralJCJF, Aug 4, 2019.

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  1. kanluwen

    kanluwen Well-Known Member

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    Better yet, how about just make TAGs into Hackers.
     
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  2. ThananRollice

    ThananRollice Your Friendly Neighborhood Locust

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    Or you could give them all repeaters
     
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  3. kanluwen

    kanluwen Well-Known Member

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    Nah. Make them Hackers, give them Defensive Hacking Devices and call it a job done.
     
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  4. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
    Warcor

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    Or allow defensive hacking to protect other targets, and give DHDs to all factions
     
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  5. scott581

    scott581 Member

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    Fix Sixth Sense L1. As it stands, it is kind of pointless. Drop the "must be attacked" clause.

    Allow declaration of "illegal" skills that rely on a contingency situation, i.e. declaring a MOVE order after a close combat action while engaged, relying on the CC to be successful in cancelling engaged.

    Give shooting while in the middle of a superjump some sort of penalty.

    Fix Multispectral Visors Level 1. Allow them to see through smoke, but suffer a -3 penalty while doing so.

    "Preferred Enemy" mechanics to represent in-game feuds? Small and limited in scope.

    Loosen the Failed Guts Check movement restrictions to allow simply falling back when you cannot completely reach total cover.

    Higher levels of Advanced Deployment scatter less distance?

    Condense some hacking programs. Roll the Guard and Protheion tables into Martial Arts, with a few modifications.

    Combine some already very similar weapons.

    New order color representing cheap, badly trained/undisciplined troops that may refuse to carry out the order.
     
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  6. kanluwen

    kanluwen Well-Known Member

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    I'm sticking with "Hacker TAGs".

    Makes far more sense, IMO, that the pilots(whether remote or physical) of these units would have to have some kind of cursory understanding of how to utilize/counteract Hacking measures beyond "Press Reset Button".
     
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  7. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

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    But that's what BTS is for.
    But instead of +1 damage just give them +1B.
    Then you might see them more often on the table.

    I'd say -6, but yeah, great idea!

    Like a Booty table to roll up what they will do?
    [​IMG]
     
  8. scott581

    scott581 Member

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    No table, just a wasted order.
     
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  9. Confusion

    Confusion Well-Known Member

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    Just allow premeasuring. The rules confusion forbidding it causes is absolutely not worth what range guessing brings to the game.

    I can usually estimate distances pretty accurately by comparing to ones I've already measured (deployment zones for starters). It just feels like being able to do that well is a skill pretty unrelated to the core fun of Infinity. People shouldn't be penalized for not having a good sense of what 8 inches/20cm looks like.
     
  10. gregmurdock

    gregmurdock Extremely Beloved Member

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    One thing I haven't seen mentioned is N4 will likely fulfill CB's promise on solving the intent dilemma.
     
  11. Confusion

    Confusion Well-Known Member

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    I haven't seen much of GitS: SAC, but I recall in one of the early episodes they were trying to stop a hijacked tank. They decided not to hack it because it had military-grade countermeasures that could fry the hacker's brain. I immediately thought "why don't TAGs have that? It would make total sense for TAGs to have automatic hacking defenses."
     
  12. Cothel

    Cothel Well-Known Member

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    N4 will be the switch to Aristeia dice.

    I also fear it will be a way to write off the Tohaa faction for good.
     
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  13. Spinnaker

    Spinnaker Vanguard Officer

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    Yup, large military mechs in that universe have powerful onboard computers so single individuals can't really hack into them. Section 9 also repeatedly makes use of its own mechs as support whenever they're hacking into places, which is just more proof that TAGs should be able to increase the infowar potency of their armies.
     
  14. Ogid

    Ogid Well-Known Member

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    So much this please. Stacking MODs is too good, with -2 it would be still very good while letting more counterplay.
    Agree, right now hacking is a niche mechanic.
    Cool idea

    I'd love to see the hard counters a bit lowered. Things like E/M or Monofilament that can destroy very expensive models like TAGs or HIs should have harder time affecting those targets, the counterplay is needed, but right now when you include a tag you can feel the enemy infiltrator/impersonator with monoflament or the guy with the E/Marat drooling;

    Hacking also need a new mechanics, since the KHDs hacking is in a hard spot.
    KHDs costing no SWC and only 3 points is a very efficient way to get an specialist and a counter to enemy hackers, so now AHDs are even more risky than ever. Plus if the other team have no hackable threats your expensive HDs and your hacking net are dead weight. Ways to solve this is giving hackers a extra niches; for example buffing HIs or meshing with command token kind of actions (hackers are inteligence agents after all).
    Plus right now offensive hacking usage is pretty order ineficient (1 or 2 orders getting that model into your repeater range and then hack), plus extending the repeater net offensively expose your hacker to enemy KHDs
    I'd split the KHD into 2 categories, KHD and KHD+; KHD+ would be like the one we have right now with some extra perks, but it would cost like an HD and 0,5 SWC; the KHD would cost like the one we have but it'd have access to only sword 1 programs and cybermask.
    Hacking need to be revised because right now is too niche imo.
    I had fun some time ago thinking about Hacking mechanics in N3, I'd love to see something along these lines in the N4 hacking.

    A new kind of order only for indirect warfare would be very cool. A lot of times doing shenanighans would be fun, but just unloading the fireteam buffed HMG in the head of every model in LoF is better.
    A new kind order that can only be expend in some models and which only let the model use non directly offensive actions (move, drop mines, sniffers, repeaters, pitchers, even medics and engineers...) would be cool; which would be also a way to give 1 combat group armies ways to play a non so direct approach.

    btw, in this thread there is also a wishlist about N4
     
  15. Superfluid

    Superfluid Welcome to Svalarheima

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    My order economy reform fantasy would be to allow units to be worth multiple orders but to take up as many slots in a command group as they contribute orders.

    Li and mi worth 1 order as per usual.

    35-60ish point HI worth 2 orders.

    Units that cost more than 60 like tags worth 3 and excessive units like avatar and cutters worth 4 orders.

    Why? Why would anyone want this?

    To mostly completely flatten the efficiency of large order lists.To make tags and HI core links viable.

    Imagine, a core of orcs at 200pts, that's your 10 order first combat group.

    Or a cutter that gives 4 orders (but also loses you 4 orders when it dies), means you don't have to spam chaff to get to 10 order, you can take some reasonable support for it.

    It's pretty out there, I know.
     
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  16. Superfluid

    Superfluid Welcome to Svalarheima

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    Id also love a recosting of impetuous so you don't have units that are 5 to 10 points cheaper for very little downside (if any in a link team)
     
  17. ijw

    ijw Wargaming Trader, Freelance Editor (UK)
    Warcor

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    For everyone talking about nested Skills, do you mean:

    A.You don't want Skill A to grant Skills XYZ.
    or
    B. You want all Skills to be visible on the unit profile, for example Martial Arts L3 (Stealth, V: Courage).

    Personally I think it should be B, because 'grouping' Skills helps enormously for memory retention.
     
  18. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't mind B, but I think some people want the flexibility to give someone MA without Stealth or Courage (for example).
     
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  19. krossaks

    krossaks Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion/whishlist:

    -Tags should br able to declare move and disengage from a CC fight)(ofc the oponent should be able to ARO).

    -KHD need a little Rework. No bypass if firewalls, except maybe with one program that shouldn't be redrum. They can have some other antihacker tools (a sensor that only works with hackers as a personal idea xd).

    -Give AHD more tools against non HI rem troops, like a buffed spotlight or a way to mark in ARO. A program to posses remotes should be fun to.

    -Some programs to buff Hi (shared line of vision between the hacker and the HI). An i will consider if some Medium Infantery should be able to be buffed or hacked to.

    -Fix some wierd interactions between link and specialovement skills (climbing plus for example).

    -Fix engage to be an hability usful in expensive CC specialist insted of a dumb tactic to stop tags engaging them with a basic troop or remote. Forcing pysics (12-14) in most CC especialist against CC of the enemy (15-20 in most HI TAGS)feels wierd.

    -Recost of all troops and sectorials. Having one scale of cost for all factions (except the new 0-12) seems desbalanced.

    -rework or buff of the old porfiles that everybody agrees that don't work (For exemple Baos, Zheydan, minutmen, Guijia, Hulang, Al Fasid, Ariadna's non kazak His in general).

    -Think if it can be ruled the relation between passages an siluet, beacuse in some metas to use a moto or a tag is just impossible.

    -More love to indirect combat and forward obervers.

    -Sorry i have to say it, nerf to posthumans and Darts. Those porfiles are cleary too strong and must play on every list.
     
  20. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    B. Show ALL the skills on the profile!!!!!
     
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