Shikami has always had a problem with deployment in my games. I think FD+4" will do the Shikami well, that is usually enough to find an aggressive spot that allows for a few angles, makes it slightly harder to accomplish a hard-contain with a MSV2 sniper. Previously I found Shikami had to choose between being aggressive/volatile or simply accepting a crap spot further back in the DZ which goes against its kit completely. At least in our meta, the good hiding spots tend to be just outside or a bit inside the DZ, seldom on the actual line (and I think this is a good policy to have). They've always been good Datatrackers, though, and once you get them across the middle line they start being real scary. They just never really got to that magic line most of the time, neither my Shikami nor the Shikami I faced.
Shinobi, Saito, Oniwaban, Ninja, Ryuken... I mean... really? Sure, they're not Vanilla Nomads or Ariadna, but really? That's not enough choice? N4 agrees with you though and adds a new Yuriko FD 8" *Ryuken* Profile, a Ryuken Specialist and Shikami with 6-2 and FD 4". The Shikami wasn't bad, heck almost nothing with C+ ever is. He was just inefficient and expensive to get where he could do work. He's much closer to a HI Dart now. Cheaper, faster, FD and Specialist on top - tradeoff is no Marker, but the Combi helps to be able to fight at longer Range than the Huntress. Most things with Superjump are hurt by the changes to Superjump and the removal of free falling distance. Shikami isn't because he wen't from 4->6 to compensate and can jump straight onto walls. If you haven't seen that in action, you can bypass a lot of stuff very fast. 6" Cautious Movement is great too, missing Stealth seems like a mistake considering he is supposed to be a sneaky dude, but he could honestly live happily without it. My Ryuken run into midfield problems a Shikami can easily solve or survive all the time. Verticality, opposing Mines and DTWs, failing to do damage beyond 8" against targets in Cover (3x9 ain't great in a FTF and that's if it doesn't have Mimetism or is in SF). With easier access to Cover, Shikami are also very nice SF turrets: - they don't go down in one hit, can 50/50 most DTWs, Normal roll the thing that tried and stay up - have a lot more choice in positioning to avoid getting 16-24ed or outranged altogether - can't be easily cleared by a CC dude with a Smoke either - JSA is starved for competent gunners, BS12 with ODD is (unfortunately) the best thing we get and can be used to deliver some CC, 6" Move matters a lot to a CC troop Really the thing they were bad at was price and Order efficiency. N4 is trying to tackle that and just might succeed.
Haha yeah I'm pretty spoiled, if my profile image wasn't enough of a hint. What I meant though was midfield 'specialist' - my bad for missing that detail at the start. In N3 we had Ninja hackers, and for a really short time, Saito. Now, it looks like we'll add Ryuken to the mix, and Shikami got better, so yeah. No complaints from me if those go through. Basically agree with most of what you said. Like you, I look forward to the changes making Shikami slightly less order inefficient, especially since it's primarily a CC guy and CC is obviously inherently order hungry to begin with.
Yea, but my point is...if I want to bring something durable to punch someone into face, you have 20pts domaru and 18-19 ps tankos...invest a bit more and you get ml/spitfire in link that eats that combi for breakfast. Well enemy has ARO pieces that can threathen you, well, you have smoke...so...but enemy has msv l2, well, then sure as heck that odd combi won't be of great use vs those target compared to linked spitfire/ml. But he doesn't have to fear mines...well yea, but it's not that you can't dodge mines or simply kill those guys that threat your specialist. And if enemy wants to waste orders going around board and sensoring trying to find your hidden deployment specialist, he is already wasting your enemy orders, which is great. He is more mobile, but yea, if there is dangerous stuff on field, they won't rly be scared of comby, they might even kill you in aro...you can come into cc but that's already order intensive and you have better and cheaper options that will bring not 1 dude into combat but your whole group of 5 angry HI guys...so..? Still don't rly see why invest almost 1/6 of your points into that single dude.
Just because you want and can obviously. Or when your core is keisotsus and you still need someone to push buttons and go an a rampage. Simply because it's fun?
Don't worry, I get your point. For straight up fighting, there are better options; for straight up button pressing, there are better options; but things don't go your way all the time. Sometimes your specialist only has 2-3 orders to press a button and can't make it there without mobility skills. And obviously, sometimes you fail dodges. My point is that with profiles like the Shikami, you won't see their value unless you identify and apply their strengths, instead of comparing them to other profiles with a narrow definition of their role in ideal circumstances. You should honestly just try running one for a few games with an open mind, and there's a good chance you'll run into a situation where you're glad your midfield specialist has climbing plus and can open up an unexpected threat vector; or 2 wounds with which to simply walk through a mine and not give a crap; or AP+DA that can legitimately threaten a TAG. Don't just shoot at something with a combi and get disappointed that it does worse than a linked Spitfire, that's not what you're paying for. I'm not even saying the Shikami are amazing, I think they're situationally usable (your terrain will affect their performance a lot, for example). But just because they're not that good at shooting and more expensive than ninjas doesn't mean they're worthless, either; that's far too linear a view on evaluating the potential value of a unit in a game as complex and contextual as Infinity.
Domaru start in your DZ, have trouble getting on roofs and can't Spec Fire Camo Markers. Domaru are also locked at total BS12 before Link boni and Spitfire Ranges. Loving the changes but they're not gonna suddenly beat Kamau Snipers or other competent AROs reliably. The new and improved Shikami opens up a way to get around that (6" Cautious Movement is a lot) and mess with the rest of the Link, while being capable to clear a DZ guard or two on the way. Outside from letting the Oyoroi try on 11s, JSA isn't really big on ranged options. Played a lot of N3 JSA and can remember all the unsolvable problems that caused me to bench them for N3. 15 slot cap really helps JSA by reducing defensive layers of Warbands, Mines, Perimeter and CC capable throwaway units.
Best Enemy DZ Offense: Oniwaban. Best Midefield Offense: Domaru. Best Midefield Defense: Ryuken. Best DZ defense: Domaru. Best Midfield Objective Grabber: Ninja. Best Midfield Objective Holder: Karakuri. Best Midfield Troubleshooter: Nimbus(hoping...)Grenade Shikami Best Smoke: Yojimbo. Best Midfield Clearing: Yojimbo. My opinion. Aside from what I've listed above, everything else JSA will bring will be for flavor. I listed these as the best because they are the most effective AND efficient. JSA is not winning the gunfighting game but they can do some shit better than most. I say layer up your Ryuken, Skirmishers and Domaru and make your opponent come to you and focus on what they can see. Focus your Skirmishers on their Gunfighters so they have to get closer to kill you. Which makes Domaru and Ryuken shine more.
It depends on the board. We play with a lot of vertical space, 2, 3, 4 story buildings. Climbing Plus and Super Jump are both huge mobility multipliers.
This. If you play with boring 1-level terrain, Shikami aren't great. If you have a couple tall buildings on each table, and an opponent who knows how to use them well, Climbing Plus is really handy. Coupled with Super-Jump, you can also go -between- tall buildings. I love that even as ITS missions and dumbing the core rules down a bit for the general public will tend to flatten Infinity out a bit, specialized or varied tables can always keep things interesting. Looking at N4 so far, I think we're going to need to use terrain to keep it spicy. Stuff like the Shikami will come in handy there.
Well, what I intended to say was that he looks great compared to his current "N3 iteration"; Forward deployment and 6" movement are very needed improvements. It is still expensive, of course, but it'll be a very fun unit with unique skills that can surprise your oponent (as several other forum members have perfectly explained). As I almost never play in tournaments I have a lot of fun using the Shikami, although so far is a coin toss between being great and being useless. I'm eager to try this new and improved version.
That's going to be one of the weirdest changes in general in N4: a lot of previously stealthy dudes are probably going to be stealthy no more. I'm really worried about Yojimbo and his silent motorcycle.
Yeah I've noticed that Kuroshi has MA on her profile but no stealth. I'd actually be ok with impetuous cancelling stealth in general, not for balance reasons but for fluff reasons. Really hoping Shikami keeps it and it's just missing in the leaks, though, since an upgunned ninja that can't sneak ain't no ninja anymore in my book. Not only that but it's a hackable midfield CC unit with no token state so it'll be running into hacking AROs all the time.
One thing that scared the living hell out of me in Japan were all those silent Toyota Prius sneaking up on me whenever I tried to cross the street.
IDK bro, when I was in Tokyo I got stared down pretty hard by a Vato in a lowrider... Shit was not silent! LMAO
