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Asking for input: N4 book readability

Discussion in 'News' started by Varsovian, Sep 26, 2020.

  1. Varsovian

    Varsovian Well-Known Member

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    I really apologize if I'm repeating myself, but this matter is really crucial to me and actually managed to completely sour the N4 launch for me... :confused:

    Basically: I can't read the N4 book due to the very small font used. At all. I tried doing that on Thursday, got through the introductory chapter and I've been struggling with hurting eyes since then (yes, they *still* do hurt, over a day after that reading attempt). I am actually afraid of making another attempt at reading... I don't want to harm my eyes any further.

    My question to you is: is anyone else having this problem? Personally, I can't imagine I'm the only one - I have multiple RPG and wargaming books at home and I'm pretty certain none of them has a font as small as the one in N4. And my eyes really aren't that weak that I'd have trouble reading any kind of relatively standard-sized font. So, I suspect other people might have this problem, too. But maybe I'm wrong...

    Another question: any advice what to do about it? I could just give up on the book and resell it, but then I'd have no N4 fluff. And fluff is important. Reading PDFs on the PC screen is annoying, but at least the rules part of N4 is available in that form. But fluff is available only in print. Should I just give up on it? And should I give up on any further supplements CB releases, if they continue using that small font? N3 supplements used font that was only slightly bigger and they were a pain to read...

    I don't know, I honestly don't know what to do... :confused:
     
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  2. Gunmage

    Gunmage General Contact Unit

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    The usual way of dealing with text too small on a hardcopy (especially if you run into this problem often) is a reading magnifier glass. Works wonders for me.
     
  3. Knauf

    Knauf Transhumanist

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    A visit to the optometrist might be in order to get your eyes checked. Maybe there is an actual condition involved.
     
  4. Wizardlizard

    Wizardlizard Well-Known Member

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    On a serious note ...do you use reading glasses? My aging eyes need them now for any serious level if reading. The font seems and feels maybe a shy bit smaller than normal print font from newspapers and books.
     
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  5. ThananRollice

    ThananRollice Your Friendly Neighborhood Locust
    Warcor

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    Sorry to hear you're struggling here! I did a quick search online and it looks like there are some pretty cool and affordable large page magnifiers. They even have LEDs in them to help in low-light situations!

    I'd probably look into getting one of these if I were in your situation.
    Screenshot_20200926-102344_Chrome.jpg
     
  6. prophet of doom

    prophet of doom Well-Known Member

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    Ah shit, my book has not arrived yet. I guess I will run into the same problem. I remember having had problems with the tiny font of the unit stats pages back when they still printed them.

    Lets face it, it is an old age or at least.eye condition problem. Maybe cd decided that they can t afford to be friendly to the older players. That would b disappointing.
     
  7. Vocenoctum

    Vocenoctum Well-Known Member

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    Haven't gotten my book yet, but tiny text is my specialty so can't really add more than I did in the other thread. Perhaps take the book with you to a drug store (or maybe dollar store, some have them) and try some reading glasses to see if they help?

    Or the magnifiers also, of course, they make a wide variety of options but can be pricy.
     
  8. chromedog

    chromedog Less than significant minion

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    I wear multifocals - and had no issues with the N3 book font size. That said, they are optimised to my myopic right eye.
    That said, I didn't pre-order the N4 book, so I'll burn that bridge when I get to it (I'm happy to use the pdf on my computer or tablet until then)
     
  9. Varsovian

    Varsovian Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for your advice, guys. I think I'll be looking into these page magnifiers.

    That said: honestly, I don't think the whole problem comes down only to me having an eyesight condition. I read other books just fine, it's a very rare situation when I have this kind of problem. IIRC, in recent years I've encountered it only two times: when reading an old novel printed in the 1970s and with some of GW's recent WH40K / AOS books. And the latter weren't as problematic as N4.

    I'll put it this way: I consulted my sister whose work experience involves, among other things, editing and okaying for release books and art exhibition materials. I measured the font used in N4: the non-capital letters in that book are of 1,1 - 1,2 mm height. I asked my sister: "A book printed on A4 pages, 1,2 mm non-capital letters. Is that - in your professional opinion - readable for an average person?". Her reply was a shrug: "Well, if they use a magnifying glass...". So, I honestly believe it goes beyong my eyesight problem: it's an actual issue with how CB designed the N4 book.

    I'm not a person who likes being negative - I was feeling really excited about N4. So, this situation is a bit of a gut punch...

    @Koni , @psychoticstorm - once again bringing this to your attention. This is important.
     
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  10. solkan

    solkan Well-Known Member

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    Disclaimer: I don't have my physical copy of the book yet.

    For what it's worth, the font size in the PDF is unusually small. When I first noticed this thread, I thought "Did CB decide to publish an entire rulebook with the 40k mini-rulebook font size?" :eyes::sweat: I'm short sighted and while I can comfortably read the N3 rules at arm's length, the N4 font is at the edge of my reading ability.

    But other than spreading a bit of warning about the font size for vision impaired readers, I don't really see what can be reasonably be done about the matter by CB. They already provide an electronic version, and any electronic reader should have a zoom feature built in.
     
  11. Varsovian

    Varsovian Well-Known Member

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    As far as I can tell, the PDF is exactly the same as the physical book. And it's true, the 40K mini-rulebook included in some of the GW sets was very hard to read due to the font used. I didn't even try doing that...

    True, but the there's the problem with the fluff part of N4. It's not available in PDF, so the players like you and me need either to try reading it in the printed book (probably by using page magnifiers etc., which isn't entirely comfortable and also costs money), or forget about knowing the fluff.

    Also, there's the issue of having paid 65 EUR for a book that can't be read...
     
  12. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    I do not have the physical copy in my hands yet, so I cannot comment, but I will keep an eye here, working from pdf makes an entirely different reading experience.
     
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  13. Varsovian

    Varsovian Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. I'll be really grateful if you look into this, even though I'm not sure how this whole matter could be rectified at this point... :confused:
     
  14. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I have not had problems reading my book that can't be traced to sleep deprivation, but my eyes are wonky in a way that makes reading small things easier.
     
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  15. Mob of Blondes

    Mob of Blondes Well-Known Member

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    You should bring the book to the doctor. And not only ask about what he can do for you, but if the size is acceptable for normal eyes (a couple of lines as well as long term effects). There are suggestions and tests (he probably has a test page based in those, with varying size paragraphs, measure it if so), and in some places even laws about specific things, about acceptable font sizes, colors, etc. Just because designers do it does not mean it's right. Many websites fail basic recommendations by important organizations that studied the problem, and in print field it has been common to ignore centuries old wisdom.

    Based in your data, 1.2 mm for lower case, using the picture you provided I compute ~2.3 mm total size, 6.52 points. Yeah, small for the main parts of a book. Maybe I mentioned elsewhere, but spacing, stroke thickness or shape also matters, and is taken into account by some font designers, for example some fonts are not scaled the same in both axis, small fonts can be wider to help. This font could be a poor choice for such small size, the couple of Ws make me think it was designed for headlines (or your camera played the same trick twice).

    OTOH, do not expect a reprint, at best changes in future products. So you will have to find a personal solution for the fluff part.
     
  16. Varsovian

    Varsovian Well-Known Member

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    Interesting idea... I'll check whether it'd possible to consult a doctor about these matters.

    I checked, those Ws are accurate on the photos, no distortion there. As for total size of this font - I'd say you are right. The upper case Es, Ls etc. are about 1.8 mms, the distance between top of upper-case letters and the lowest point of the letters that go below the main line seems to be 2.3 - 2.4 mm.

    BTW. I googled around for legible font sizes - and it seems that, while it's often mentioned that font legibility depends on more than just size, it's advised not to go below 8 or even 10 points. And I found a quote by a graphic designer that a 6pt font is a font appropriate for *footnotes*.

    Eh, I guess so. I suppose CB won't be keen to release a free or low-priced PDF with this part of the book...
     
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  17. Guardian

    Guardian Well-Known Member
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    Now that you mention it, yeah, it is kinda hard to read it.
    When trying to read some Infinity fluff, I give up quickly, usually. Just look at the pretty pictures.
     
  18. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

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    I've printed the rules .pdf today, (I didn't buy the book this edition - on purpose, but that another matter. I intend to use the rulebook for my group's Infinity kit we keep at the LGS, as on-hand reference) I didn't had time to actually read it, but from the glimpse I catched, the print is freakin' small.

    Now, I don't have problem with small stuff (my near-vision does fine, thank you) - I'll borrow the corebook from a member of the local community who had ordered it, and give it a read - but yeah, it is smaller than I'd consider comfortable. Whoever was doing the layout for you, CB, didn't do a good work with that font size.
     
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  19. Varsovian

    Varsovian Well-Known Member

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    Thank you! I'm not crazy after all...

    And the font choice, too. It's relatively narrow - and it makes it even harder to read at such a small size...
     
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  20. archon

    archon Well-Known Member

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    Today my book arrived and I am sadly can confirm, the font in the fluffbook - wich is the main reason to buy it - is very tiny and hard to read. Yes I am getting old but I have glasses with multifocals but it is not comfortable to read. The main text in the N3 fluffbook is bigger (but the book itself smaller). But is has nice pictures :nerd_face: Maybe I buy this magnifiers showed above, because I want to read it, but in a comfortable way. Overall from the first impression (book arrived today) I have to say that it feels a bit expensive for what you get. Maybe a friendly reminder that some of the customers are the age of Bostria or even older :smirk:

    I good suggestion for the fluff is a an E-Book.
     
    #20 archon, Sep 30, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2020
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