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Yu Jing doesn't allow troops to fight in more than 1 battle?

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Bohrdog, May 20, 2019.

  1. Bohrdog

    Bohrdog Santathematics

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    A nomad CO that disciplined a troop and was told to fuck off is probably going to beat down the person that said it.
     
  2. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    They could give it to the Hellcat. God knows why they still have a 2 SWC Lt!? That profile is straight up trolling newbies!

    But yeah it would make sense for CJC to have some command rules but CB decided to not incorporate it as game design for Nomads. I don't have any hopes for it to ever change any time soon. Before that we see a HD+ in YuJing I think.
     
  3. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    I really disagree. The hyperindividualist culture of Nomads has some downsides - why do you think there's no Lt option for Riot Grrls? Nobody trusts them to be in charge of shit.
     
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  4. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    We are talking about Corregidor not Bakunin! ;)
     
  5. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    I mean it's all the same thing. Corregidor is well-organized by Nomad standards... that doesn't mean much in the greater context of Human Sphere armed forces.
     
  6. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    If organization were the defining factor, then Tunguska is the #1 candidate. Corregidor would have troops more like Morats: not giving a shit about not having a leader, they know what to do.

    But that would be broken AF, or overcost them too much.
     
  7. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Nah... Religious isn't very expensive.
     
  8. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Veteran N1 combined with Religious seems like it is :p
     
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  9. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    ...but would it also be fitting to allow them to act on operation command's orders without a direct personal link to the command structure? Or wouldn't "not giving a toss about odds, adversity, or whether command structure is intact beyond reason and beyond self-preservation" suffice?
     
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  10. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    I think Nomads are more survivors with deep understanding of how limited their population and resources are in contrast to Morats who developed a culture were an almost nihilistic approach to victory at all costs must definitely have developed a robust and constant supply chain of troops and equipment.
     
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  11. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Yeah, I was making a run against the Securitates compared to Morat Vanguards XD

    More seriously, however, we already talked in this forum some months ago about how all should have Chain of Command in all the lists, but the rules make that an impossibility (besides, it's a thing that would go against the Order Pool concept of Infinity).

    The problem is, simply, that the ruleset goes from "no safety net" to "Chain of command" then to "veteran N1" (which includes more things than just "ignore LoL"). The reinforced tactical link "extra" from missions like Hunting Party and Decapitation are the closest solution to that "lack", but they remove the "take the Lt" thing.

    Also, YJ has Tactical Awareness in spades, making troops able to perform twice while in LoL, and by RAW I think using this order would not break a Fireteam while in LoL.

    On another beat entirely, what do you (in general) thing about giving NCO to TAGs costing more than 80pts, for example? That would automatically improve the Guijia because of the LtL2 YJ has, while not abusing from Tactical Sense.
     
  12. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    I think that's what TAG Lt.s are for, kinda. It's weird that some TAG Lt.s cost more SWC though. I guess it's the weird fluff SWC tax rule, since not all get it. NCO as an option for some is a cool idea, not sure if I would like giving it out to all of them.
     
  13. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    The problem is that, unless you have also a slot for a CoC, few people dare play those Lt TAGs. Making at least the Lt profiles NCOs would give them a good boost, I think.
     
  14. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    Yeah, NCO instead of Lt. could be a compromise for using the Lt. Order on TAGs. It's not as good as having CoC, but I guess it's also way cheaper then Lt. And a CoC combined, no idea about the price being ok for what you get or not.
     
  15. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I think that above all else, TAGs need a re-evaluation of point weights. A statline-carrier (barebones, no frills) shouldn't be very expensive, whereas a TAG with stat-multiplier skills should. 360 visor is one of the most costly upgrades a TAG can have, but it's nowhere near the multiplier that TO camo is, yet somehow 360 seems to have vastly increased costs on TAGs while TO doesn't scale nearly the same.
    It's similar to my opinion on HI and Hackable trait, TBH.

    That, and I also think TAGs should be more like motorcycles as far as zone domination and order generation is concerned. Didn't kill the Staldron, but killed the Overdron? It'll keep generating orders until you kill both.
     
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  16. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

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    From their description:
    It is a direct tactical response and combat control force. It also does police and legal work in the spacecraft, stopping clans, mafia or factions from breaking the internal laws. The situation in Tunguska is like a powder keg ready to explode and it needs an iron hand to control it. The quality of the Securitate members is constantly put to the test which has made them one of the best security forces in their space sector.
    Sounds like a description what makes a troop a veteran™.

    And then they all become Kuang Shi in the end? :speak_no_evil:

    Maybe because the are free spirits, they have a hard time accepting an officer at all, so a field promotion is something they all dislike.
     
  17. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    This argument can also be used why they should not care if the officer dies or not. ;)

    We discussed this subject in the Nomads section a couple of times already and from a game play point it doesn't seem to make sense to incorporate it into Corregidor. And it kinda depends on a personal interpretation as well, so whatever CB does what they want and if you want to play Veteran Mercenaries there are always Druze to play as Nomad proxies.
     
  18. Mc_Clane

    Mc_Clane Zhànzhēng bùzhǎng
    Warcor

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    Kuangshi "volunteer" ranks are filled with criminals and traitors. not soldiers

    What I mean is that the yujing troop formation is wide and sort of "good for everything" but not specialized in survival and acting out of the chain of command. Ariadnans and morats are trimmed by survival and isolation situations. Yujing troops fall in line and act acording to orders. That's why we have veteran troops, but not the veteran skill, and we have so much chain of command specialists.
     
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  19. Shiwen

    Shiwen Commissar, Yu Jing General Political Department

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    If you want to justify it all in your head, I find it helps to envision CB's names and basic descriptions for skills as being very 'surface level'. They aren't wrong, but something like Veteran or CoC or Lieutenant isnt just 'person who fought many battles', 'second-in-command', or 'commanding officer', its also a more complex system of specialized training and equipment. Sure, on Corregidor there are clear chains of command to ensure the ship is saved in emergencies, and if we were playing Infinity the Spaceship Hull Breach Repair Game all those Corregidorans might be CoC Veterans, but in Infinity the Wargame those troops are on a battlefield filled with a storm of electronic warfare and suppression transmitted from ships and hacking hubs off-table on both sides.

    In that environment, perhaps to get the Veteran skill you need to be trained that disregarding orders is OK and the StateEmpire would never train its soldiers to do so, to take over command with Chain of Command you need not just rank and obedience of other soldiers but to be carrying the same sort of advanced communications suite that let the original commanding officer cut through that electronic noise to be a Lieutenant, and Nomad tactical doctrines just don't consider doubling up on that to be worth whatever costs it entails.
     
  20. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Ah, good point.

    Shows how often I actually use (or see) XO, doesn't it? :scream: (Where the hell is the blushing/embarrassed emoji?)



    Depends on whether the troop was deserving of a beatdown.

    If the trooper did something really stupid, the Nomad CO is probably going to have to get in line behind the person(s) hurt by trooper's stupidity. In fact, if the trooper actively harmed another trooper (like assault or rape), a good CO will insist that the victim be the first to beat the perpetrator down.

    If the trooper's crime was showing up to duty too drunk/high to function, the CO will probably be first in line to beat them down, followed by the rest of the unit. See the "Wall to Wall Counseling Field Manual" ( Do note the date of that FM. April 1, 1989 :smiling_imp: )

    But if the trooper wasn't harming anyone and the CO is just on a power-trip, I'd expect the rest of the unit to beat down the CO. With the CO's subsequent complaint filed under "who the hell approved this idiot for command?!?" and followed by a fairly righteous beatdown from the boss's boss in an attempt to beat the stupid out of the CO.
     
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