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What's the Onyx Malignos actually for?

Discussion in 'Combined Army' started by Time Bandit, Mar 1, 2020.

  1. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Active Member

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    Greetings fellow greebly generals.

    As a recently septorised convert, I am having a ball painting, list building and playing with my lovely nasty Onyx. Ikadrons, Overdrons, Unidrons, Kerr Nau, Bit & Kiss, Xeodron Haris, boy this sectorial has a lot of strange and fun units squeezed into it.

    The time has come for me to branch out into the few Shas units on offer, and ML Noctifier & Sphinx are both obvious in their appeal. That damn Noctifier has exploded so many of my carefully laid plans from the other side of the table, so now I'm really looking forward to repaying the kindness.

    But the Malignos...

    [​IMG]

    I just don't get the chap's raison d'etre. I mean his new mini is ever-so-snazzy and everything, but why would he ever get the nod in your list? The FO might be a useful specialist but the guy is 36pts packing a combi rifle, and has almost zero chance against a dedicated cc enemy, and will be spending a lot of time mid-table. The LT is crazily 2swc and can't start in hidden without causing LoL. I guess for 42pts you can have a kind of good sniper? Finally, the hackers seem overpriced and undergunned compared to the wonderful Bit or Kerr.

    Is the guy just a turn-3 bully/button pusher? Or has he just been weighed too far down by a scattergun of expensive kit? What kinds of lists does he do good work in? What am I missing?

    Please help me to see the light (or dark)...
     
  2. Janzerker

    Janzerker Invincible Angry

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    1) A TO infiltrator with boarding shotgun is nuts. Just try it and enjoy the carnage.
    2) Monofilament mines are one of the most dangerous weapons in this game.
    3) The KHD version comes with a great control tool: the Dazer. This piece of equipment is absolutely brutal and can dictate the flow of the battle.
     
  3. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Active Member

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    Okay, I'll give the shotty a go as you suggest but mono-mines have done diddly for me every time I've run them (and 1swc seems harsh).

    You know I've never actually deployed a dazer, and haven't really seen what they can do, having avoided the zone whenever it's placed against me. It's a very interesting piece of control equipment though for sure. What work has it done for you in games where you've run a Malignos, if you don't mind me asking? How would it fit into a string of orders spent on a malignos, if you get me? Objective choke points? Rambo trolling? mid-table order sapping?
     
  4. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
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    My 2c: I used it mainly with Shrouded Minelayer in SEF, so I'm used to it being already on table, and on my half of it. It still makes opponent's life extremely difficult, because if you place it well it can't be ignored. Covering objectives, hiding your infiltrators and TAGs behind them - pretty much the only units able to ignore the zone will be enemy infiltrators, which you should be able to take care of. Oh, and a nice additional effect? Saturation Zone reduces Burst, but it does squat against Burst 1. Such as Noctifier ML AROs :smiling_imp:

    With Malignos you can either lead with it - creating a safe zone bubble from the get go, and ensuring that you won't forget or run out of orders to do it later - or advance and place it in a postion more forward, possibly affecting some troops in enemy Deployment Zone. It highly depends on where you can find a safe spot for it, make it as hard to reach and destroy as possible. Choose an area that your opponent won't be able to ignore and block it, then go about doing whatever else you need your Malignos to do that turn.

    Afterwards recamo with the Malignos and make it guard the Dazer, forcing the opponent to get inside the Dazer field to even get LoF to your Malignos. And don't reveal him too fast, make opponent lose some orders. You can't declare two Short Movement Skills when in Very Difficult Terrain, and you know what is a Short Movement Skill too? Discover. So let's say opponent moves his trooper to get LoF to your Malignos; you do nothing, he does nothing because he can't declare Discover. Next order, he declares Discover+Shoot; still do nothing, if he doesn't have a Sensor or MSV there's a high chance of missing the roll, and he can't declare a second Discover with this trooper. Then he's down to moving forward, one Short Movement Skill per order; you can allow him to do this as long as it doesn't move him into LoF to the Dazer. Open fire only when he's one move away from getting that LoF (and if you have a nasty mind you've deployed your Noctifier to be able to see that particular spot as well, and now opponent needs to beat two AROs from TO troopers - while getting his Burst reduced. This approach makes opponent lose a large part of his order pool for an attempt that's doomed anyway.
     
    #4 Stiopa, Mar 2, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2020
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  5. Lesh'

    Lesh' Infinity LATVIA
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    in Onyx I just use a KHD profile. For me he's useful for

    - cheapest TO infiltrating option in OCF
    - SMG with AP ammo sometimes can be good against armored targets, or good vs skirmishers due to shock ammo. not to mention that I always prefer to have a higher B weapon
    - mines
    - with TO camo and starting from middle of the table you can maneuver and catch opponent off guard
    - surprise shot is good thing to have when you're a TO
    - you can deal easily deal with non-nwi hackers quite easily (surprise attack + maestro)
    - dazer. really situational but still nice to have a tool that might be handy
     
  6. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Active Member

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    Solid gold Stiopa, thanks muchly. So if I'm understanding you right, he's a very different piece to Kerr Nau (gunny + white noise) or Bit+Kiss (great repeater net & efficiency). Less rambo, more master speedbump? Your explanation of how to use the dazer to protect the malignos from discover once its down, and vice versa, makes a lot of sense now, as does overlapping that setup with a nasty aro if possible. Actually makes me keen to get him on the board...
     
  7. TheDiceAbide

    TheDiceAbide Thank you for your compliance.
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    I think @Stiopa 's speed bump is an alternative use for him which is easy to overlook, as opposed to the only way to use a Malignos. The combination of TO ammo, mines, dazer, and KHD can really stop enemies in their tracks. Malignos are really a versatile unit, I prefer the boarding shotgun profile because you can easily get up close to someone, get them at -12 to hit, while firing two boarding shotguns rounds at BS18, and even drop mines before you do it. TO Combi rifles also get TONS done, and the Malignos is no different, even if you're firing outside combi range, you'll still hit an enemy on 6's, while they will be at -12 to hit you back (range, cover, TO). Not to mention if someone does KO them, he has a 60% chance to doctor himself back up.

    In short, they're one of those units where their power isn't obvious on paper, but when you play with units like them, you'll see how good they are.
     
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  8. Indominus Rex

    Indominus Rex Active Member

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    These are good reasons.
     
  9. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
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    I was just focusing on the Dazer use there ;) As @TheDiceAbide said, there's much more you can do with this unit, and he's absolutely right about shotgun being a perfect tool for TO Camo infiltrator. SMG is a nasty piece of work too. And sniper can be very surprising if enemy likes to flank. If you can predict which flank he will use deploy a hidden Malignos sniper on the other side of the table if there's a good vantage point there, and shoot alongside lateral axis. People are usually good at anticipating possible risks coming from the direction of enemy DZ, but can be blindsided when attacked from, well, side ;)
     
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  10. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    I am a huge fan of TO snipers with infiltration. They're super useful at not just unexpected AROs but also at scalpeling key models off the table. Blowing up the enemy's sole backline doctor may sound like a waste of orders, but I've had games I won just because of that.
     
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  11. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    Infiltrating snipers are definitely something new players try, fall out of favour with, and then rediscover as you play the game more and more.

    They're a sometimes food, but catching an extended enemy rambo in the back, and out of cover, is always hilarious.
     
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  12. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Active Member

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    This is all very useful, thankyou. But let me ask you, what utility does a msr malignos bring that a noctifier ml doesn't, out of interest? The noc is 10pts cheaper, has dogged, a tasty little assault pistol and imo a slightly scarier aro weapon. Malignos sniper just seems to pale next to him...
     
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  13. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    1) Sniper Malignos is better in the Active turn due to double the burst and better rangebands compared to the ML, remember that sniper does not mean ARO only! A sniper with TO is formidable attack piece (unless the enemy has a visor).

    2) Deployment flexibility, infiltrate lets you place it in sniper perches outside your DZ, placing it with LoF laterally across the table, or looking back at your own DZ lets you enfilade an attacking piece. It should not be deployed with LoF into the enemy DZ, as that's just suicide (though this is true for most AROs). Also remember you don't need to go all the way to the halfway line, sometimes the best location is only 2-3 inches outside the DZ.

    3) Stun ammo is arguably more effective at stopping a rampaging HI/TAG than an ML, a single failed roll puts a stop to any Active turn piece.

    4) They're like the Spanish Inquisition, everyone expects a Noctifer ML when playing Shas/Onyx/VanCA, but no one expects a Malignos sniper, so you're more likely to catch your opponent flat-footed.
     
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  14. smog

    smog Well-Known Member
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    I just logged in for the sole reason to thank you for the replies. I want to use all sorts of malignos profiles now that I’ve never considered before!
     
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  15. Aspect Graviton

    Aspect Graviton Friendly Alien Overlord
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    1. As above an infiltrating TO boarding shotgun is a magnificent link killer (place near to an "overlooked" console or objective that you couldn't cover or somewhere you're likely to get a second move reaction on a link team).
    2. forward observe from surprise and then T-drone, Onyx can do this very well. This season it's a bit less as you want you malignos FO to be liason officer.
    3. Screen your CC vulnerable link teams or Overdron with a mine or dazer.
    4. That unexpected gotcha maestro or sucker punch when someone tries to get you in a hacking fight through your repeater web.
    Things malignos don't like: Warbands, within 12", shock
     
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  16. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Active Member

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    Well as fate would have it, it looks like I'll be fielding a FO Malignos at a tournament next month (with Frontline mission). Am I right in thinking that the only non-REM FO in Onyx is the Malignos?
     
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  17. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Active Member

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    Okay, well, I've gone from complete sceptic to forced conversion! I'm rocking up to Firestorm's Satellite event next month with a new army, fully expecting to go 1-4 or such, but have lots of fun in the doing. The event has Frontline as one of its missions, and since Onyx only has one non-REM FO, I need to move towards a list that includes a Malignos FO. It's not exactly the profile that jumps out at me I must admit (the killer hacker with dazer would be my preference).

    What do you think of the following (alongside a LI Sphinx list)? 17 orders, very strong repeater net and lots of remotes to capitalise on the E-drone, with a T-drone to sync up with the targetted being thrown out by my Malignos and 2 Unidron FOs. It crutches quite a lot on Kerr nau to help deal with visors, may have a bit of a camo problem, and suffers from Very Obvious LT Syndrome©...

    The five missions are Acquisition, Countermeasures, Firefight, Frontline (hence the FO restriciton) and Powerpack.

    EI Swarm
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1 (9)
    KERR-NAU (UPGRADE: White Noise) Plasma Rifle + Pitcher, D-Charges / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)
    NEXUS Lieutenant (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 16)
    UNIDRON Missile Launcher, Light Shotgun / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 20)
    UNIDRON Spitfire / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1 | 18)
    UNIDRON (Forward Observer) Plasma Carbine / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 15)
    UNIDRON (Forward Observer) Plasma Carbine / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 15)
    IKADRON (Baggage, Repeater) 2 Light Flamethrowers, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    IKADRON (Baggage, Repeater) 2 Light Flamethrowers, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    T-DRONE Smart Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 18)

    GROUP 2 (8)
    MALIGNOS (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 36)
    GREIF-OP (Inferior Impersonation) Combi Rifle / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0.5 | 21)
    MED-TECH OBSIDON MEDCHANOID (Journalist L1) Submachine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    Q-DRONE HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    E-DRONE Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 28)
    R-DRONE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    SLAVE DRONE Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    ÍMETRON . (0 | 4)
    ÍMETRON . (0 | 4)

    6 SWC | 299 Points
     
    #17 Time Bandit, Mar 5, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2020
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  18. Lesh'

    Lesh' Infinity LATVIA
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    I'd rather swap T-drone for another unidron and and trim few points here and there to upgrade unidron ML to Plasma Sniper Rifle, as it has better range bands, and cause I'm not a big fan of SMLs.
     
  19. Savnock

    Savnock Nerfherder

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    Sphinxes in Dazerland give me nightmares. More of an SEF thing, but also applicable here.
     
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  20. ObviousGray

    ObviousGray Frenzied Mushroom
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    Proof that Shasvastii has a heart
     
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