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The Way of the Angry Monkey Fist - The New (post Third Offensive) Morat Tactica

Discussion in 'Combined Army' started by DaRedOne, Jan 16, 2019.

  1. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    Suryat specialist... do want.
     
  2. BlazyCrane

    BlazyCrane Member

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    I thought about Suryat for the Doctor Profile as well and while that would be beastly. I just can’t see Morat Heavy infantry as Doctors. I think it has to go to a lower ranked ‘non-commisioned’ Morat unit where there’s a chance of them learning other useful skills besides raining death upon their enemies. If not Kurgat then I think the Raktorok would be the unit for it. They are right hands of high rank officers almost like butlers. Why wouldn’t a military butler know how to properly heal.

    On the flip side a Daturazi Doctor would be hilarious as well. It would go heal and then impetuously stampede toward the enemy.
     
  3. itsuncertainwho

    itsuncertainwho Well-Known Member

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    A Morat Doctor should be a unique profile. An "Intelligence and Reconnaissance" specialist by way of a Morat Jack the Ripper. It should be a Doctor/ Close Combat specialist. They heal Morats on their way to butcher enemy units to "gather intelligence" on their inherent non-Morat frailties. A female Morat wouldn't be a terrible idea, as to allow them some stealth to sneak up on enemies.
     
    DaRedOne, m2cat and BlazyCrane like this.
  4. Kwisatz Haderach

    Kwisatz Haderach Zelenograd Shasvastii
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    if we go for wishlisting here - i would to see some sort of option to get regular grenades in Syriat team
     
  5. InMac

    InMac Cat.IE~~

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    PHY 14, and 1 extra profile added; submachine gun+chain colt or... just dreaming, chain colt/vulkan grenades (ye... fire grenades :o) arround 35-37pts i paying this cost very happy.
     
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  6. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    How about a specialist profile so a Core might make some kind of sense (not really)...
     
  7. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    Guys, please. Let's try and avoid making this thread about complaints. Here ase some reasons to use a full suryat core:

    You're playing Biotechvore, Hunting Party or Frostbyte;
    You're playing Limited Insertion and none of the missions favor lots of specialists.
    You want a very resilient fireteam to support your cheapish specialists (Let's remember Zerat killer hackers are a thing now)
    You like the models and want to see them work on the table.

    Let's please keep this thread positive and focused. Remember newcomers are most likely to check this one out first if they want to get into MAF
     
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  8. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

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    Doesn't even need to not favor lots of specialists:
    Yeah, no Suryat specialist exists, but you know what does exist? Specialist Operative Raktoraks that Wildcard. Yeah it's a squishy 5th member, but I've yet to see ISS complain about a fifth Zhanying member or MO about Order Sergeants as the fifth member.
    It is an option, after all.

    Still not too big a fan of the KHD Zerat. I mean, I'd probably try taking one every match... but only one, the rest would be FOs still, for those mines.



    Other reasons for a Suryat fireteam:
    The TacAware HMG for order shenanigans.
    The Vulkan Shotgun. Everyone knows linked HI BSGs can do ridiculous stuff within range. This time, it gets fire ammo on the blast as well.
    Someone to escort Kornak around.
     
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  9. Yvain

    Yvain Well-Known Member

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    I am trying to get the most out of the Morat rule and I am curious what you are all picking for your LT and why. The NCO rule is nice, but we only have one option for it and he is very close ranged. That make is feel like I will lose out using the LT order if I don't pick a good unit.

    Here are our options:

    Vanguard at 14 points and 1 SWC: I feel like the advantage of this one is that its cheap, but the 1 SWC cost and relative weakness of the Vanguard means outside of link this is kind of useless. The Morat rule feels very wasted here, but often times I feel forced to take him if I put a lot of cool stuff in the list.
    Kornak at 41 points: Kornak looks pretty great if I am bring Suryat link, but without that it feels like I am spending a ton of points just to get one combat group to 11 orders. By himself he doesn't seem powerful enough to beat out some of the other options to justify taking him solo.
    Rodok at 26 points: I kind of like this one in that the Rodoks always seem useful and its is pretty darn cheap. With FD1 and Super Jump, I could see sync a few orders into him if I can pull off a good double shotgun blast.
    Yaogat at 29 points: I feel like this profile is better served on the ARO, which means he will likely die after a single turn. Not as big a deal with morats, but not exactly a good use of him. He is also really expensive.
    Sogarat AP HMG at 56 and 2 SWC: I can get behind this option as an LT, but for ten more points that Full Auto FB really increases the kill vs death ratio to make it hard to ever justify taking an AP HMG unless I wanted to run both profiles.
    Sogarat FB at 57 and 1.5 SWC: Because the full auto version is so much better, this guy will never see use.
    Suryat Multi-Rifle at 41 points: I can see taking this guy as an extra body in a link, but if I am taking a Vanguard link I am using the HMG with tactical sense. If I am taking a Haris or Core, I probably going to bring Kornak. I don't think this one will see much use.
    Suryat HMG at 45 points and 2 SWC: The tactical sense profile is so much better there isn't much reason to take this ever.

    What do you all think? What are you go to picks?
     
  10. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    Of all of these, the only ones I will never use are the Vanguard and Sogarat Feuerbach.

    If I'm playing Limited insertion I either pick Kornak for the Suryat haris or a AP HMG Sogarat for sheer sturdiness.

    If it's not limited insertion, then I pick whatever suits the mission more. I've used the solo yaogat to Panzerfaust through smoke at hard targets (not super useful, but it's a free order so whatever). I've used the Rodok as part of a fireteam, usually without even caring for NCO. I've ran 16 orders lists with Rodok lieutenants in a haris, so by that point the lieutenant order feels irrelevant (That being said, this guy does pair well with a raktorak NCO on his own team or on a different one).

    I strongly disagree about your assessments on the Suryat LT, on both versions. I've used them for basically the same thing: moving into midfield and supressive fire. But I've also used the solo HMG Lt on missions where the data tracker gets an extra order to get up to 16 orders while still rolling with a Raicho and a decent Heavy infantry, and the MULTI-Rifle lieutenant is decent as a non-SWC option for missions where people will be gunning for your LT. For example, if you're playing Decapitation and don't want to shell out the points for a Sogarat, a Suryat MULTI is more resistant than Kornak even against Viral Ammo (since he doesn't die if he fails one save), unless you're up against JSA, who can one-hit-KO any of them anyways.
     
  11. Yvain

    Yvain Well-Known Member

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    I should note that I am brand new to Morats coming from USARF where I am swimming in cheaper units with lots of orders.

    I see what you are saying about the Suryat units. I suppose I didn't really think about using them solo when I could link the to save on orders.

    How are you building a Raicho in your list with other HI?
     
  12. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

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    These are a few ways I'd imagine people go about doing that...

    Morat Aggression Force
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]2
    RAICHO MULTI HMG + Heavy Shotgun, Mine Dispenser / . (2 | 94)
    [​IMG] RAICHO PILOT 2 Heavy Pistols, D-Charges, Knife. ()
    SOGARAT Lieutenant AP HMG / Pistol, AP CCW. (2 | 56)
    RAKTORAK (NCO) Vulkan Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24)
    ANYAT K1 Combi Rifle, Chain-colt, Smoke Grenades, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)
    MORAT Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 19)
    MORAT (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    MORAT (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    MORAT Hacker (EI Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 22)
    DĀTURAZI Chain Rifle, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 14)
    DĀTURAZI Chain Rifle, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 14)

    6 SWC | 298 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Morat Aggression Force
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]3
    RAICHO MULTI HMG + Heavy Shotgun, Mine Dispenser / . (2 | 94)
    [​IMG] RAICHO PILOT 2 Heavy Pistols, D-Charges, Knife. ()
    SURYAT (Tactical Awareness) HMG + TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 48)
    KORNAK Lieutenant Mk12, Light Flamethrower / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 41)
    RAKTORAK Vulkan Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    ZERAT (Forward Observer) Boarding Shotgun, Grenades, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    ZERAT (Forward Observer) Boarding Shotgun, Grenades, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    DĀTURAZI Chain Rifle, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 14)
    DĀTURAZI Chain Rifle, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 14)
    DĀTURAZI Chain Rifle, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 14)
    IKADRON (Baggage, Repeater) 2 Light Flamethrowers, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)

    4 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army


    There's a fun trick you can do with this one: Duo him with the NCO Raktorak.
    Now normally, you couldn't use a Lieutenants order to move a fireteam... but with NCO, that becomes a possibility. So not only are you moving up an AP HMG, you're also moving up a Vulkan Shotgun that can cover for said HMG AND a specialist. Win win win.

    Kornak's a relatively strong fighter in his own right I hear: BS14 with a decent gun, got a LFT, even has some surprisingly competent CC capacity.

    I can see ONE use for this guy so far: You aren't linking Kornak into your Suryat link but you are linking the NCO Raktorak into it. Same logic as with the Sogarat applies.
     
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  13. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    I actually took this list to an LI ITS event:


    Morat Aggression Force
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]6 [​IMG]4 [​IMG]5
    KORNAK Lieutenant Mk12, Light Flamethrower / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 41)
    SURYAT (Tactical Awareness) HMG + TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 48)
    SURYAT Heavy Rocket Launcher, Light Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 39)
    MED-TECH OBSIDON MEDCHANOID Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 23)
    SLAVE DRONE Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    SLAVE DRONE Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    RAICHO MULTI HMG + Heavy Shotgun, Mine Dispenser / . (2 | 94)
    [​IMG] RAICHO PILOT 2 Heavy Pistols, D-Charges, Knife. ()
    OZNAT Vulkan Shotgun, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 20)
    PRETA Chain Rifle / AP CCW. (0 | 7)
    PRETA Chain Rifle / AP CCW. (0 | 7)
    PRETA Chain Rifle / AP CCW. (0 | 7)
    PRETA Chain Rifle / AP CCW. (0 | 7)

    6 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    I used it in Looting and Sabotaging where I went 3-6 against Combined Army (it could have been 3-0 if I had let Kornak watching the AC2 on my last turn) and in Frostbyte I went 6-3 vs haqqislam, in an army that included Tarik Mansuri. It looks like it has a weakness against hackers at first, but unless your oponent is really hacker heavy you can negotiate them very easily. For example, on both matches I had the Raicho fire mines near the enemy assault hackers and made them sweat when they tried to hack me as I advanced. Oh, and the Raicho survived both matches despite ending both games on the enemy deployment zone.

    And this list I used for Deadly Dance on an escalation match:

    Morat Aggression Force
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]6 [​IMG]4 [​IMG]6
    MED-TECH OBSIDON MEDCHANOID Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 23)
    SLAVE DRONE Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    SLAVE DRONE Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    RAICHO MULTI HMG + Heavy Shotgun, Mine Dispenser / . (2 | 94)
    [​IMG] RAICHO PILOT 2 Heavy Pistols, D-Charges, Knife. ()
    Q-DRONE HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    OZNAT Vulkan Shotgun, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 20)
    PRETA Chain Rifle / AP CCW. (0 | 7)
    GAKI AP CCW. (0 | 4)
    GAKI AP CCW. (0 | 4)
    GAKI AP CCW. (0 | 4)
    KRAKOT RENEGADE 2 Chain Rifles, Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 14)
    IKADRON (Baggage, Repeater) 2 Light Flamethrowers, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1
    SURYAT Lieutenant HMG + TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 45)
    MORAT Hacker (EI Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 22)
    KRAKOT RENEGADE 2 Chain Rifles, Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 14)
    R-DRONE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Went 7-3 vs Yu Jing. Killed their guija on my first turn and proceeded to bully the midfield with the Raicho like mad. Having the Suryat be able to spend 6 orders to move around and exchange shots with a hsien on suppressive fire allowed me to clear a path on the midfield to let the big stompy lady do her thing. Raicho also survived until the end of the game, but with only 1 structure left. My enemy brought 1 ninja KHD and 1 Kanren AHD. I had the group 2 krakot run up to the Kanren and hack him to pieces, and the ninja got shotgunned off the table by the raicho.

    USARF is a very different beast than MAF, but it has advantages that USARF doesn't. Namely the fact we have more than double their fireteam options, and we get more diversity out of our lieutenant options.
     
  14. Yvain

    Yvain Well-Known Member

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    In list one, don't you need to take the Haris Suryat option to form a Haris link?

    In list two, how do you get 6 orders on the Suryat? I see 4 and the LT order.
     
  15. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    Kornak has the Haris skill. If you take him you don't need to take the Suryat Haris profile.

    Deadly Dance gives your data tracker an extra irregular order. Make the Suryat your data tracker. If you choose the Raicho, you only put an even bigger target on it and make sure your opponent will make a beeline for it and kill it. By choosing a different but still sturdy model as your data tracker you can maybe force your opponent to make bad decisions.
     
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  16. Yvain

    Yvain Well-Known Member

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    Cool, these are great tips. I appreciate your help guys.

    The Kornak haris thing is great. I can't believe I didn't notice that.
     
    #36 Yvain, Apr 5, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  17. Yvain

    Yvain Well-Known Member

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    New questions

    When do you prefer to use Krakots vs when do you Daturazi?
     
  18. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    I touched on this on the main article. Krakots are better if you don't want or need smoke.

    It's really simple in this case. If you're not looking for smoke or to link them, then usually you're better served with krakots as they're more controllable.
     
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  19. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

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    So, I have stumbled into a slight predicament here...

    The local Morat player has some excess of models ( A Feuerbach Sogarat ( Who doesn't have the face either, so I'll have to fix that somehow eventually as well... maybe should have enough random 40k bits strewn about my bits box to make a face for the guy. ) and a Kornak he doesn't need. ) that he'd be willing to give away ( Since I'm the only other local player who has expressed an interest in the Morats. ).

    Plugging those two into army, I found that if I'd grab the starter, a Kurgat and an extra Raktorak, I'd end up with this:

    Morat Aggression Force
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    MORAT (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    MORAT (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    MORAT (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    KURGAT Boarding Shotgun, D-Charges, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 17)
    KORNAK Lieutenant Mk12, Light Flamethrower / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 41)
    OZNAT Combi Rifle + Light Smoke Grenade Launcher / Pistol, Shock CCW. (0 | 18)
    SOGARAT (Full Auto L2) Feuerbach / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (1.5 | 67)
    RAKTORAK Vulkan Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    SOGARAT (Full Auto L2) Feuerbach / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (1.5 | 67)
    RAKTORAK Combi Rifle + Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 23)

    3 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    On a scale of ''This is horrible'' to ''This is very horrible'' how bad of an idea is this...?
     
  20. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    Without commenting on the list as a whole... I think the Raktorak comes with an extra head that you could glue to your second Soggy.