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The Tragically Obligatory "What We'd Like To Change/See Next Time" Thread

Discussion in 'OOC' started by Del S, Jul 25, 2018.

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So... Where do you think we're fighting next year?

  1. Paradiso

    4 vote(s)
    4.9%
  2. Aconticemento

    6 vote(s)
    7.4%
  3. NeoTerra

    1 vote(s)
    1.2%
  4. Svalarheima/Huangdi

    24 vote(s)
    29.6%
  5. A Brand New Planet No One Has Any Vested Interest In

    6 vote(s)
    7.4%
  6. Concillium

    1 vote(s)
    1.2%
  7. Dawn Again

    2 vote(s)
    2.5%
  8. Space Again

    4 vote(s)
    4.9%
  9. Human Edge

    7 vote(s)
    8.6%
  10. Bourak

    1 vote(s)
    1.2%
  11. YuTang

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  12. ShenTang

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. Both YuJing Planets

    1 vote(s)
    1.2%
  14. Wales (It's Probably Not Wales)

    20 vote(s)
    24.7%
  15. Varuna

    4 vote(s)
    4.9%
  1. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    Using the corvus ID on a third party website has a few data protection issues, but the main issue is that the campaign is supposed to get people playing and interacting with the community to draw in new people. Adding new hoops for them might put people off, but if it also means that we can use an army link on the report rather than needing PDFs for lists it would likely balance out....
     
  2. Cabaray

    Cabaray Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    Now that the scores are in, I might have some improvement.

    A way to feed Army HQs more accurate info on the goings on to get around the fog of war . Cause when you put the results of before and after AI Historian next to each other, some things become apparent.

    phase 2 seemed to be very stagnant with only the tower and ops centre being highly contested. but it turns out that Aplekton was a photo finish instead of Aleph leading with 50ish points over Nomads. And Yu Jing got way closer in taking Kurage, instead of an 80 point lead that looked a done deal.

    And I think Bostria said something clearly with hindsight. he called the Ariadnan HQ decision to go against pano "an excuse" for the loss of the tower. But I think that is easy to say after the Historian has done its work. Now I want to show you what we as HQ had to work with:

    Before the AI Historian Ariadna had a 3 point lead on pano, which turned out to be 50. While the 50ish point lead of Tohaa turned to be 15 points.

    anyone can see that if you put 20 points more on the Tower, Ariadna would have taken both zones with still a 30 lead on pano at the Ops centre. but the numbers at the time showed Tohaa as miles Ahead and pano still strong but beatable if we put all our effort against them. HQ made the decision to choose the more fun race we could see at the time instead of hoping that the AI Historian would right it in the future. which could end up with the loss of both. going after pano was more enjoyable. And we won all the things, so yeah!

    but if there could be a way to give more accurate numbers, that would be splendid



    Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-G930F met Tapatalk
     
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  3. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    They can say Ariadna won all they want, JSA were the true winners of Kurage crisis - they gained territory on the home planet of the victors. And it wasn't even a contested, probably illegal outpost like when Yu Jing was running Kurage - they get to plant the flag, get it recognized by O-12, all that jazz. Kind of a joke, really - they had the story they wanted to tell, and they were going to tell it no matter what. I'm sure all this was decided in one of their tabletop rpg sessions and we're just along for the ride.
     
  4. Cabaray

    Cabaray Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    I think a JSA loss was in the cards in phase 2. if we as Ariadna had decided to attack pano from the get-go instead of Aplekton, then they would not have the means to attack Yu Jing.

    Yu Jing would have there hands free sooner ( no pano/ weaker pano invasion phase 2) and would have the means to overtake NA-2 at an earlier moment.

    The Japanese blunder to attack Ariadna and keep their back undefended + this scenario would be a 2/3 take over by Yu Jing.

    Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-G930F met Tapatalk
     
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  5. Gargs454

    Gargs454 Member

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    Though to be fair to Hecaton, they did give JSA the plot armor of a base that really couldn't be taken in the first phase. I think they should have just outright said JSA will keep at least a part of Kurage and simply not have had that base playable in the campaign. They still could have opened up the same number of playable bases while protecting their story.
     
  6. Sergej Faehrlich

    Sergej Faehrlich Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    Yep...I feld bitter about that as well. The score by that time showed NA2 a constant lead by about 50-60 points...and a such we couldn't get the drive in our playerbase to make that push. Just seemed impossible to do that over the final weekend. Now looking at what seems to be around 20 points, that could have been done easily...we have dropped most of our reports for defense. Very unfortunate indeed.

    I agree that it would be helpful to sort out low quality reports while driving the campaign...just to have somwhat a little more precision in the actual figures...on which tactical decisions are made.

    And I must say: how and where did Yu Jing have a lot of cheating? Our overall ignores/downgrades were midfield...admittedly quality porbably wasn't the best and we didn't get a lot of upvotes, but I have rated almost every single Yu Jing report. Some of the were great and besides only a tiny fraction, almost all of them were at least decent and met the quality criteria. Looking at the Scores for ROC, there are only a handful of points subtracted from Yu Jing score...compared to NA2 dropping about 40 points...and that's not to speak of a 3 point difference becoming ~60 in favour for Ariadna.
     
    cazboab and Shiwen like this.
  7. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
    Moderator

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    We do take notes on the feedback, please keep them coming.

    For me though the winners are Yu Jing, lost nothing, gained from their enemy.
     
  8. Kiwi Steve

    Kiwi Steve Well-Known Member

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    I think a narrative campaign needs a narrative outcome in a timely manner. The event is now long over and we haven't had an outcome.

    Also clearly defined objectives which aren't forgotten later in the event.
     
    Hecaton likes this.
  9. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    @Bostria was being a bit tounge in cheek by saying 'cheating' when referring to the disregarded reports.

    The actual content of the disregarded reports Includes reports lost because there where no pictures, the text was too short or both. That includes a significant amount of 'I lost, don't care.' reports which is really hard to call cheating.

    There was however a substantial amount of actual provable dishonesty from one place in particular that wasn't called out in any way except for the scores. That imbalance really needs to be adressed even if the individuals are not named.

    Unfortunately collating and digesting the results takes longer than a few weeks, especially when the narrative has a preset destination, publications planned etc.

    The sandbox nature of the campaigns is a huge factor in this. The easiest example would be that Aplekton is in Cold Front Ariadna Vs Aleph, but early on it was CA vs Aleph, then Ariadna stepped in to make sure the CA didn't get a beachhead on Dawn, and finally the Nomads wanted to grind their axe on some post human skulls, so Ariadna went back to undermining PanOceania's interests...

    At the very least they should gain the most in narrative, even if Ariadna 'won' it was in Cooperation with YuJing and nobody should forget that easily.

    Just imagine what a mess we'd make on Huangdi together...
     
    #89 cazboab, Sep 9, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
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  10. Ben Kenobi

    Ben Kenobi Well-Known Member

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    Come on, really? Don't you think it was the same in the other factions?
    The world is grey and in each faction are more ore less black sheeps (or grey).
    Ariadna are not the Saint of the Infinity community, nor any other faction.
    Don't know why you insist on that.
     
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  11. Gargs454

    Gargs454 Member

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    I don't have the document in front of me anymore, but I thought the objectives you are referencing were bonuses awarded for controlling each of the sites at a particular base. Could be wrong of course. All that said, it does seem clear the winner was determined by the total points. Controlling all the zones at a base may well have given bonus points to said faction. /Shrug
     
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  12. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    I didn't insist on that, at all, what I said was that the vast majority of disregarded reports(meaning all factions) weren't cheating, they just didn't put in enough effort to be verified.
    The actual provable cheating was very uncommon, and is limited to individuals(who @psychoticstorm has asked us not to name), not any faction as a whole.
     
  13. Ben Kenobi

    Ben Kenobi Well-Known Member

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    Then I did misunderstood you, sry.
     
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  14. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
    Moderator

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    There were several people caught and contacted, it is considered an internal affair and we would wish to not have pubic accusations, rest assured all battle reports got flagged as inappropriate, but we do not want to create a public prosecution scene, we will deal with whoever individuals have been identified internally.

    Thanks for your understanding.
     
  15. Luisjoey

    Luisjoey High Marshall of Wotan
    Warcor

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    Good call @pychoticstorm with a moderation team on the campaing and the Upgraded/downrated reports, i rest my case a lot

    I call people for play fair and give the most, specially the heavy hitters, to prevent the cheating calls by taking pictures of the game and maybe the opponent, also the videos should be in the upgrade chance of the reports.
     
  16. Cabaray

    Cabaray Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    @Luisjoey. As a heavy hitter you cannot prevent the cheating calls, no matter how hard you try. I got to a point that I dare not play a game lower then 300 points and had a minimum of 30 pics per game getting every move recorded. Does not matter, cause The fact that you play a lot of games is reason enough for people to call you a cheater. Mostly these people are from factions on the receiving end. The hypocracy is that if a heavy hitter would fight for their chosen faction, they would be called a hero. So it is good that people are vigilant and on the look out for bad reports. But calling people cheaters does not help, it only sours the experience of others: Just keep calm and report the suspicious to CB, I would advice.

    Heavy hitters can not do much about it. That they surpass the minimum needed for a legal report does not matter either. Cause people will come with their own set of Standards they suddenly thrust upon you. Few that I had to endure:

    - You win to much
    - You play opponent X to much (pics or not of that person playing does not matter much. Cause seeing a person shake your hand might be fake, or even throwing dice might be fake. As I said, recording everything might not be enough)
    - You switch opponents on purpose, or they are all fake.
    - Your tables look the same (I am not going to buy new terrain for every battle)
    - You switch tables to much on purpose
    - A lot of your pics do not show dice ( cause they are being rolled in a dicetray)
    - the pics are too sloppy with dice on purpose
    - you should spread your battles over different zones
    - it is not logical you fight against X faction on this zone.
    - you must play the given mission
    - The fluff says there are only 8,5 milion Ariadnans, how can they send such a big army?
    - you play the given mission to much
    - it is impossible to spend all that time on Infinity
    - You must keep to your regular game Schedule and do not get more games during the campaign.
    - you cannot set up a table up that fast (I have the room in my house to keep the table Infinity ready for a month, but people think that this is cheating somehow)
    - etc

    Al lot of it contradicts each other and I got to a point where I just say: Haters gonna hate. I play my games, make my reports and have fun. Motivate my faction. Not let bad vibes take me down.

    Which makes me ponder. What would happen of I joined the faction that "feared" me the most? A thought experiment... I own every faction, so it is possible for me to switch to any army. anyone willing to bid for my services?
     
    #96 Cabaray, Sep 16, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2018
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