1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hemos actualizado nuestra PolĂ­tica de Privacidad acorde con la nueva RGPD. +Info // We've updated our Privacy Policy to comply with the GDPR. +Info
    Dismiss Notice

The definite N4 Comments, Suggestions, Ideas, wishlist's and Bugs that need fixing thread

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by psychoticstorm, Aug 6, 2019.

  1. Armihaul

    Armihaul Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    613
    Likes Received:
    455
    If all factions could deal the same with that kind of 70-point trooper would be oke to me, but no, if you dont use those kind of tricks/tactics, you need to spend more than those 70 points, even without smoke. Then is good that 70 stops more? Also, those 20 are almost useless against other troopers in the faction. How do we balance that? Also, there are a other ways to stop someone of doing mission in smoke, like mines, or TOs surprising the specialist (such as the swiss!).

    I agree with you that the non-interaction is not so good, but for smoking one side completelly you need to spend a looot of orders, and even with that, there are tools to deal then. A game with all the time ftf rolls against some faction that just have higher BS for the same cost as WIP is plain boring. This is a covert operation game, so the mission should take priority to shotting the rival (even if each ITS is more focused on shotting than the previous one little by little)

    Also, having MSV is at the moment more useful that having smoke (white noise is not so extended and is easier to deffend than smoke, and albedo is only 1 round) some of the top factions/sectorials out there have MSV2 or 3 even if they don't have smoke, so maybe is not the smoke what needs to be nerfed/addressed, but MSV and their function in the board.
     
  2. Mroowkojad

    Mroowkojad Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    16
    I strongly agree that player going second should have some tools for improving the defences - very often a table composition isn't providing enough difference to promote choosing deployment and even in missions that would theoretically encourage going second, obvious tactic of alpha strike can be more tempting.
    So maybe another option for setting up a defence while going second would be through a special skill Defensive Tactics - that on level 1 would allow it's bearer to deploy in Suppressive Fire state, on lvl 2 would allow to give that status to other eligible unit (already deployed and armed with proper weapon) and on lvl 3 would allow both bearer and other unit to be deployed in suppressive state.
     
  3. Abrilete

    Abrilete Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,988
    Likes Received:
    2,647
    I'm not sure about this: the Gorgos' problem comes from being a gal with a big Symbiont Armour instead of being a pilot inside a big machine. That means no fixing with Engineer and that you loose the Gorgos if the "Pilot" needs to strech her legs and go for a walk.

    Now Tohaa has shown that they can build pseudo-mechanical things with STR instead of Wounds (Kaauri, Reex), so just making the Gorgos a traditional TAG would fix all its problems. After all, it already has good stats for its price.
     
  4. Spellbreaker90

    Spellbreaker90 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2018
    Messages:
    87
    Likes Received:
    58
    My idea is that Smoke are a key part of the game, but CB need to stop putting them on cheap disposable unit like warband.
     
    Berjiz, theradrussian and Tourniquet like this.
  5. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2017
    Messages:
    1,870
    Likes Received:
    1,601
    I'm not sure if I can agree that LoF blocking should be limited to Eclipse or other similarly rare items. That, along with galore of optimized gunfighters which "sneakier" factions has gotten over recent 1.5 years or so, pushes the game towards direct action and faction homogenization a little. Not a fan of such a direction.

    I would even argue that not every army whose arsenal includes cheap smoking WBs instantly becomes oppressive in terms of board control and shooting because of that.

    And there probably are some general concerns of armies balance. For example, Haqq/HB has access to what's probably the most broken WB in the game (I don't care that they are listed as LI, those labels are stupid and should not exist at this point), but armies themselves don't seem to perform in a stellar manner. Likewise CHA and their 45ths. Nerfs to those buggers will have to be made up for elsewhere. The problem is, if said "elsewhere" involves yet another "just give them BS13 HMG/Spit with some shooting steroid skill and reliability layer, and make it linkable with some cheap trash and call it a day", then I would not want that balancing act at all in the first place - see above.
     
    WiT?, saint, Berjiz and 3 others like this.
  6. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,211
    Likes Received:
    1,502
    I'm not sure if this counts as "broken" but bringing all of your HD models out on the last order of your opponent before going by declaring reset with all of them.
     
  7. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2018
    Messages:
    2,164
    Likes Received:
    1,646
    Has anyone tried, for the fun of it, actually implementing some of their thoughts for changes? Not trying to sound snide or anything. It's a genuine question.

    I was thinking of having a game where every figure in the game has +1 ARM. Just for the heck of it to see what kind of change that has. All they way from ARM0 warband guys to TAGs.

    Sometimes it's hard to find someone that will actually play things like that. They are set in a "we must play exactly like this" mentality.
     
    bladerunner_35 and Barrogh like this.
  8. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    2,535
    Likes Received:
    4,826
    Was there a ruling re: reset that I missed?
     
  9. Xeurian

    Xeurian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2017
    Messages:
    550
    Likes Received:
    679
    Regarding the availability of smoke, I would not terribly mind if every instance of it incurred an SWC cost or if it became more expensive. For example, if Ghazi were to otherwise stay the same, the 5 point version would not have smoke while the (rarely, if ever taken) 10 point version with Boarding Shotgun would.

    Alternatively, they could be made Disposable (x), where x would equal a number between 1-3, but that would come with a "cost" of adding some more book keeping. Something I think would be preferable to avoid.
     
    Hecaton likes this.
  10. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,698
    Likes Received:
    4,564
    Just make it an S7 3W Symbio Armor HI with Heavyweight. Why is it a tag again? Also why is Tohaa HI hackable, their armor is made of meat?
     
    LaughinGod and Ariwch like this.
  11. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,698
    Likes Received:
    4,564
    People need to get off the idea that smoke + MSV 2 shooter should be a solution to all problems. Taking away Sixth Sense's ability to deal with that would be a massive nerf to a lot of factions that rely on fireteams to defend.
     
  12. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,698
    Likes Received:
    4,564
    Well, those point costs need to be rejiggered. On BS 9-10 warbands that can't claim cover, the Chain Rifle profile is *more* powerful than the BSG profile, and costs less. Reverse those profiles (and delete Jammers) and then we're talking.
     
    Berjiz and Xeurian like this.
  13. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,698
    Likes Received:
    4,564
    You could do that with Alert anyway.
     
  14. Xeurian

    Xeurian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2017
    Messages:
    550
    Likes Received:
    679
    Yeah, wasn't specifically commenting on Ghazi as I think they need to be re-visited for sure. Just a hypothetical on how you could lock smoke behind a less useful, more expensive profile of the same troop.
     
    Hecaton likes this.
  15. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,211
    Likes Received:
    1,502
    With a slight difference... you don't need to effectively sacrifice the trooper alerting.
     
  16. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    6,280
    Likes Received:
    7,837
    It's the one time Symbiont is an actual drawback worth getting a points reduction for, which is of course why you don't see the reduction.

    However, wouldn't you say that it's better to just equate the Gorgos to an Operated TAG in terms of cost and device a way to make SymbioBombs get taken to create a much more interesting dynamic? Of course that'd mean Revitalis would need to function more like remote Engineer on Symbionts, but then you could also put that Discipline on a specific troop or two.
     
  17. Anansi

    Anansi Achilles' Thigh Oiler

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2019
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    91
    Yeah, I'm just going to veto that right here and now. It'd make Steel Phalanx's myrmidons completely unplayable.

    I'd be ok with MSV1 seeing through smoke with a penalty, however. That seems like the best way to balance out some of the less technically minded factions like Ariadna.
     
    Tourniquet likes this.
  18. Xeurian

    Xeurian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2017
    Messages:
    550
    Likes Received:
    679
    Considering the changes I intended, but failed to communicate properly, a complete veto may not be warranted as I believe that Myrmidons already pay plenty to be able to take smoke (except maybe the chain rifle profile). I should have specified that I was replying to the concern regarding cheap, <15 point models were being brought as smoke lobber spam. I think smoke is perfectly fine in the hands of models that are in the 20+ range and should not come with an SWC tax.
     
  19. meikyoushisui

    meikyoushisui Competitor for Most Ignored User

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2017
    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes Received:
    1,874
    Probably not, I just was reading through today and though "oh RAW you can't reset if you're in someones hacking area but not their ZoC", but then I saw the in the effects box (and not the requirements box where it should be) that that requirement has basically been waived and reset is pretty much always valid now. Not sure when that changed though.
     
    toadchild likes this.
  20. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,698
    Likes Received:
    4,564
    It still says "attacker" so that doesn't apply unless the trooper gets attacked.
     
    DukeofEarl likes this.