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The definite N4 Comments, Suggestions, Ideas, wishlist's and Bugs that need fixing thread

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by psychoticstorm, Aug 6, 2019.

  1. Click2kill

    Click2kill Well-Known Member

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    The only WB that might be OP right this moment is McMurrough, and its because of the Total Immunity. But thats also a skill JSA benefits from, because Karakuris are very powerful now, and they are Specialists.

    As for spamming cheap units, the cheap units used in many lists are not really for swarming, but rather cheerleading. Quality units and skillful decision making do matter more than just piling the board with cheap units. The cheap units I see are flash pulse bots and baggage bots. Sure, there are a few WB units, but most of the time they are irregular and there for don't contribute their order without a command token usage.
     
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  2. Daerthe

    Daerthe A former JSA and IA player

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    Yes, we play really different games ...
     
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  3. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
    Warcor

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    Add Ghazi to the list, they're a warband in all but name.
     
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  4. Superfluid

    Superfluid Welcome to Svalarheima

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    I don't like the 'if you don't like infinity as it is then play a different game' rhetoric. It's possible to critique things we enjoy, and no game is perfect. And as infinity is such a complex game it only stands to reason that some areas are weaker than others, or that as layers of complexity are stacked atop each other for added interest, at some points a simplification is the way forward.

    Anyway, another thought that I'd like to echo is I'd like to see a general reduction in min maxing in unit profiles. It feels to me like we're at a place where new unit designers trust in absolution the original points calculator and anything they make with it must be fair game. Which is obviously a fallacy because it's easy to reduce expensive stats like BS and ARM and make up for it with cheap gear like chain rifles, smoke, mimetism, or impetuous. Things that aren't limited by those reductions in primary stats.
     
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  5. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    Yeah after streamlining and making the rules more clear, this is really important.
     
  6. CabalTrainee

    CabalTrainee Well-Known Member

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    If possible i would also like for N4 to get rid of redundant labels or clean them up. With new releases bluring the line between MI, HI and LI i would rather not have those labels have any rules attached to them at all. Just add a hackable or em-vulnerable trait or something to units which are supposed to be affected by those weapons.
     
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  7. Click2kill

    Click2kill Well-Known Member

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    The Ghazi is strong, but if we are adding LI now, i also have to put the Kuang Shi.
     
  8. Alphz

    Alphz Kuang Shi Vet. Retired.

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    Other than the clean up on rules, mainly around consistent terminology and consistent use of the requirements and effects.

    I hope they don’t change too much. The core of the game is fantastic. Crits, order mechanic and ARO all need to stay with no more than minor tweaks.

    Points and how skills are implemented will hopefully change. But that is just a meta thing if the core remains solid.
    Eg. I’d like impetuous troops and irregular troops to be less prolific outside of specific factions.
    Frenzy has a rule could either become less cheap, like 1 point, as it’s essentially reverse mimetism.
    Or becomes a much bigger disadvantage. I don’t see the latter working though as it would have to further limit player agency and players don’t enjoy that kind of mechanic.
     
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  9. Kiwi Steve

    Kiwi Steve Well-Known Member

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    I agree. The core of the game is why I left other games to play this one. New editions bringing big changes have killed interest in other games I've played.
     
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  10. Wizardlizard

    Wizardlizard Well-Known Member

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    We are in a period of uncertainty. My hope is similar...that the core stays the same and cleaning up some complication for complication sake things as well as a little balance out there.
    I never would of thought I would stop playing 40k casually but I have only played 3 games of 8th. The change was just too much for me. My ultimate fear is we go to simple simple play and optimized rules. The complexity and tactical challenge is why I play. Keep that please... No warnahordes cloning, no gw dumbing down, no level the playing feel in all areas. If that is your jam...great go play one of those game systems. They have what you want. Or heck use them as a base and make profiles for a cyber punk world. Please leave me my grown up overly complicated sometimes a mess of a game generally in place.
     
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  11. Tongfa

    Tongfa proudly selling out since 1991

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    lmao
     
  12. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    Well, I think there's enough difference between "any firefight you get into (even with a schmuck with a pistol) has an inherent risk" and "I didn't bring any AP weapons because Cr1tz!!!11!!one." Indeed, if your only anti-armor plan is to pray for a crit, you are very likely to fail.

    Full disclosure, I'm of the mind that FAT2 on high burst weapons was probably a mistake or at least not costed appropriately (like, at all!). I do think that FAT2 on weapons capped at burst 2 would actually be interesting (but it still should cost more than essentially free).
     
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  13. Click2kill

    Click2kill Well-Known Member

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    I think the easiest way to fix Fatality lv 2 is to have it only work when in the weapon's positive range band. That way you have to get into position in order for it to work.
     
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  14. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

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    Sure, and one of my biggest complaints about N3 in retrospect is that it took so long for them to get through the backlog of fully updating all the old armies/units. But Invincible Army is brand new and JSA's big move was fairly recent. A lot of Yu Jing / JSA players are already feeling a little bit upset about how their faction has been treated; can you imagine how upset they would be of both of those sectorials were unceremoniously dropped in the new edition? CB needs to put in the work to properly support their armies.
     
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  15. Alphz

    Alphz Kuang Shi Vet. Retired.

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    A thought on ARM which ties into some people's feelings about Crit.

    What if ARM was divided into two categories, lets call them light and heavy for this discussion sake.
    Heavy ARM could be something that is not negated or reduced by crits and only special ammo like mono and AP. While light would be negated by crits and possible other special ammo types.

    Models could then have a greater variety of arm. LI and MI might have 1-4 light armour. While TAGs and heavies might have proportionally more heavy armour. This way, an MI with 3 LARM would be different to a heavy with 3 HARM.
     
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  16. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    Yeah, one of my big worries about N4 is that we'll have to wait a while for our sectorials to be updated. They really need to have everything ready to go when it launches.
     
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  17. CabalTrainee

    CabalTrainee Well-Known Member

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    I am fully with you IF CB puts in that work. Which i'm not yet convinced of.
     
    #197 CabalTrainee, Aug 12, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2019
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  18. Daerthe

    Daerthe A former JSA and IA player

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    I would like to see a review of JSA and IA in N4, but I do not expect it from CB anymore...
     
  19. Alphz

    Alphz Kuang Shi Vet. Retired.

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    I actually think IA might see some more life in N4. I think N4 might be the year of heavy infantry.

    JSA on the other hand only need minor ripples of change to be effected. As they have been by recent releases.
     
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  20. Cothel

    Cothel Well-Known Member

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