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The Crooked Grin Of Corregidor: Tactica

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by GHoooSTS, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    I get that, but since the CJC rework I've been finding it rare that a list doesn't include something that requires support ware, whether that MML2 for REMs, the AD buff, or fairy dust, meaning having her in a defensive link tends to be more of a frustration than anything.

    That being said in aggressive fireteams, She gets amusing quick, either as E-warfare support for a gecko or hiding behind a Brigada tinbot b being the first two ones that come to mind.
     
  2. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    I've only ever had bad experiences with aggressive cores. I find that in a Haris you're likely to have all the same issues with few of the benefits.

    I can absolutely see your points, but I'd struggle to make it work relative to running a solid defensive base that can swing aggressive in the late game.
     
  3. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    I've had pretty good success with aggressive cores, however they have been fireteams that can mitigate some of the disadvantages of a core team themselves or exists in a sectroial that can support it well. examples being StarCo. FoCo, any Nomad sectroials (Though StarCo. arguably does both CJC's and BJC's better than they do). That being said I'm very much on the Very Aggressive side of the play style spectrum where this kind of thing tends work reliably.
     
  4. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Whereas I tend to be a very 'counter-attack' style of player. So I know what I can do to a Fireteam played aggressively.
     
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  5. Hachiman Taro

    Hachiman Taro Inverted gadfly

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    It is a hard choice with the option to link Jazz. She's a lot more likely to get punked by a marker state KHD non linked (maybe through one of your own repeaters). But then Billie is so good. Not just for the cheap order, but I've found running around at 6" an order pooping out emaulers from a disposable piece super helpful a couple times when I had a few spare orders I didn't want to overextend with.
     
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  6. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Sun Tzu said: The good fighters of old first put themselves beyond the possibility of defeat, and then waited for an opportunity of defeating the enemy.
    To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
     
  7. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    He also says; “Move swift as the Wind and closely-formed as the Wood. Attack like the Fire and be still as the Mountain.”
     
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  8. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    Like TAGs aggressive fireteams pose an interesting game play puzzle to solve in game in that they need the rest of the army to support their advance and cover them so as they don't get surrounded and overwhelmed, additionally they need to be pulled back and put into proper defensive positions (which is a great way to learn proper positioning and defensive tactics), among other things. But They do really lend themselves to blitz style strategies where you take down the key threats as quickly as possible, do some mission aspects on the way before pulling back to relative safety. Though they shouldn't be relied on to do the majority of the heavy lifting, you still need solo attackers work in concert with them to make them shine by taking down the things they may not be able to.

    That being said I've only found a handful of aggressive teams that are actually worth taking.
     
  9. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    See I find that's all true, but works better with a Haris. I find the additional 2 troops ends up screwing you a lot due to table design.
     
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  10. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    Depends what the other 2 are there for, If they exist purely to buff a B4 weapon then ditch them. If they add useful toolbox options that allows the team to go from door kicker to mission swiss army knife then probably keep them. A good example is the Starco Brigada team where you have tinbot, HMG Hacker, then you add on a CC specialist with smoke (massacre) and a doctor, this team can cover the majority of the classifieds in the game. So it does a lot more in the game overall alternately in the case of something like HM they can just get the hell out of dodge and hide.

    But yes if you want just a B5 beatstick a haris is easier to use and more forgiving to table design.
    I tend to prefer Haris' for the defensive role as it's less dead resources.
     
  11. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Whereas I usually find good use from the extra core members on DZ defence. This is particularly true of Wildcats, who have a better than average chance of punking enemy AD/SK who try to attack your 'soft underbelly'. But even Algs in StarCo can easily be configured to add depth to your defence with flashpulse AROs or B2 Combis on short firelanes.

    You can then pivot to these cores in late game when most of the high-end threats have been dealt with.

    I can see why the fact Tsyklons displacing MB annoys you then. I find Core-linked Tsyklons lend themselves to longer ranged play in the early game, opening doors / fueling a Massacre Haris, McMurder or Bandits. I then tend to break the Spitfire out of the core to advance it, leaving it on Suppression rather than dragging the less mobile and squishy Algs into the midfield. Particularly since one of those Algs is likely your Lt.

    Hmm... seems like running aggressive cores effectively is a distinct weakness of mine. I should see about remedying that.
     
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  12. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    The only agressive core on Correg I would personally consider is the Jaguars. We'll see what happens in N4.
     
  13. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Fair. I'd also consider the MB/Special MB Core. Although I suspect that the StarCo version is better. It's been a while since I last picked up that list (last time I played it I ran into @deltakilo 's OSS and it did not end well... but that certainty wasn't the list's fault).
     
  14. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    something like this (rough shell I literally just slapped together a core shell) May have some viability, But yes SC may do it better though a little more expensive and has access to Hardcases, caterans and a HD+ to support it. as always wired janky N2 swc pricing kinda screws the rest of the list.

    Wildcats are probably unnecessary, could take an Intruder LT save some points and SWC to go else where.

    Jurisdictional Command of Corregidor
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1
    MOBILE BRIGADA HMG / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 42)
    MOBILE BRIGADA Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 37)
    DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    LUPE BALBOA Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Panzerfaust, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 23)
    JAZZ FTO . (0.5 | 18)
    [​IMG] JAZZ Hacker Submachine Gun, Pitcher, Cybermine / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 18)
    WILDCAT Lieutenant Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 19)
    WILDCAT (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 20)
    WILDCAT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (2 | 20)
    MORAN (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 22)
    BANDIT Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Light Shotgun, Adhesive Launcher / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 25)
    6 SWC | 240 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
  15. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. Personally I'm hoping to see a BSG, Tinbot B HD MB profile in N4. Shaves 0.5 SWC out of the Fireteam and adds utility to it without invalidating any models. The fact MB don't have any Combi models (I hope) allows CB to adjust their profiles.

    In the current meta this, below, is probably more interesting to me. It exploits the flexibility of CJC Fireteams by allowing the Jag Fireteam to be tailored for the requirements while allowing the MB team to flex into being aggressive T2/3. It also gets the most out of SSL2 defensively in T1.

    Jurisdictional Command of Corregidor──────────────────────────────────────────────────GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 TSYKLON Spitfire, Pitcher / Electric Pulse. (1 | 31) MOBILE BRIGADA Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 40) MOBILE BRIGADA Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 37) DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14) JAZZ FTO undefined. (0.5 | 18) [​IMG] JAZZ Hacker Submachine Gun, Pitcher, Cybermine / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 18) LUPE BALBOA Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Panzerfaust, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 23) SEÑOR MASSACRE (Fireteam: Haris) Boarding Shotgun, E/M Grenades, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW, E/M CCW. (0.5 | 27) JAGUAR Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 10) JAGUAR Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 10) BANDIT Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Light Shotgun, Adhesive Launcher / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 25)GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 TOMCAT Engineer Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22) ALGUACIL Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 10) ALGUACIL Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) MORAN (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 22) 6 SWC | 299 PointsOpen in Infinity Army
     
  16. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    So would or that the MR+LFT, Multi Rifles are an incredibly underrated weapon and the DTW on a HI is always nice.

    I think thats probably where an assault core sits in CJC, where you spend the first turn using the massacre haris or a bandit to make a hole for them to follow up into.
     
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  17. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    McMurder is another great T1 option. I find you can swap him and the Massacre Haris depending on whether you need the Haris to drag a specialist into the midfield or the Eclipse. If you don't need those options, he's a huge threat.

    If you are going the Massacre/Bandit/McMurder T1 then I think you need to lean into leveraging the core for the T1 defence and have a replacement for when that piece goes down, to keep the link up at 5 members for the subsequent assault.

    If you want to do that off a MB base then I think ML ARO, Spitfire Assaulter balances survivability/cost/mobility best. It's also likely to cause less issues from Jazz Supportware from inside the link.

    Wildcats *should* play well into this, but the HRL SWC cost means that you really can't usually afford it and a Spitfire. OTOH if you can keep the HRL up into late game it's actually a very solid attacking option (switching to Combi/BSG once you're under 16"). Bravery really suits this, as you can often leverage the extra 4" for extremely useful but conservative cross-table AROs.
     
    #297 inane.imp, Feb 18, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2020
  18. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    I often forget about McMurder, probably too much tunnel vision on Camo shotguns.

    Thats the thing I keep finding with CJC is that the N2 SWC costs really put you under the SWC crunch from the beginning. I love the Wildcat defensive haris, it's a great place to stick your LT and provides a good gun to contest firelanes, Only downside is that eats nearly half your SWC, making the rest of the list incredibly difficult to fill out.

    Though using a FB Tsyklon in favour of the ML Brigada and turning the spitfire into a multi Rifle might make it work a bit better. You still have a good gun for long range ARO with much less obnxious range bands, it can climb down from its perch and join the team as an active shooter (B3 FBs get work done) until the MR closes to ideal range. Or it can be left back and buffed with support ware for B2 aro and hang out near the clockmaker. This leaves a point man for the fireteam that the embedded doctor can pick back and return the team to full strength pretty quickly and will also give you back 2 ish SWC which could be useful to have some be a LGL Aggie to scalpel out trouble pieces with a linked specfire, that can be somewhat easily spotlit thanks to CJCs native repeater net.
     
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  19. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    That's why I like the MB/Tsyklon interchange options. It fixes a lot of the underlying SWC issues in CJC. And Tomcats offer options to get Healer support where required.

    If Wildcats and Tsyklons were linkable I'd probably argue that the SWC tax is a reasonable compromise because they're balanced around SWC cheap price expensive or vice versa. Without that they force a lot of compromises.
     
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  20. Freki

    Freki Well-Known Member

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    Tsyklons are annoying to move since you want to use climbing + and your alguaciles are forced into an idle.