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The amazing Raoul

Discussion in 'StarCo' started by kghamilton, Jun 18, 2018.

  1. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Sure. My issue is HRL + Haris + ( Brawler/CSU Specialist) is a great swing option already* and is ~20 pts cheaper than including Raoul.

    20pts is a lot for being able to shoot better, CC ability and Drop Bears. It's literally 2 Jaguars: which offers similar utility and 2 orders. You also telegraph to your opponent that Raoul isn't going to AD.

    I'm just not seeing what it brings to a list.

    Whereas AD Raoul is such a brutal option. The threat will weigh on your opponent even if you don't take him.

    * its how I'd like to run a Wildcat Haris.
     
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  2. Leviathan

    Leviathan Hungry Caliban

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    Yeah. I was really only entertaining it for two things - the multi rifle, and the dropbears. Taking it because it was an option and to see what it was like. And it was good, yep. But theres a reason why I'm only building/painting the AD version
     
  3. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Raoul failed me tonight.

    I spend 4 orders CCing a Dodging Chasseur under Smoke. Hit everytime, never critted. The Chaseur passed 4 Saves. This was after surviving an Irmadhino's chain-rifle and CC attacks.

    Things I learnt:

    Raoul should slap non-MA troops if your main aim is to render them Unconscious / have already EM'd them.

    CC25 + DAM12 is on 61% odds to do a wound to an Alg. You're probably on ~55% to do a wound with the EM CCW, at best.

    Also, if you're using NBW BRaoul should use Bare-hands over pistol: Pistol is DAM11, whereas Bare-hands is DAM12 due +1 DAM (to PH) from NBW B.
     
  4. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    Why bare hands and not the EM CCW?
     
  5. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

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    I've used him in the Haris with a MSR and it didn't really work at all, the MSR is good for long range obvs, and wants to be with a Rifle+LSG CSU and Haris Brawler, who do great DZ defence in a little link.

    In an aggressive Haris, with a HRL... maybe. I dunno. If you took him with the Brawler Haris and a CSU then you could basically use them as +1 Burst for him and other bodies to jam up zones with (with B2 LSg AROs), that might work. Cheap and cheerful, overall.
     
  6. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

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    Because of the stupid way that E/MCCWs work, if you crit, they get auto-E/Md with no BTS save, but don't take an ARM save. It's very silly but it is the rule. So you use Bare-Handed because even though it's PH-2, it's -1 with NBW and if you crit they actually take a proper wound, which you're slightly below 25% likely to do.
     
  7. Alz

    Alz Well-Known Member

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    I think that's wrong. EM / EM2 CCW do indeed cause the BTS effect on crit, but it does still cause the ARM roll, or at least I don't see anything suggesting otherwise.
     
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  8. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    Yeah, I understood it as an normal CCW attack plus a second one against BTS too.
     
    #28 McNamara, Jul 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2018
  9. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    They still roll vs the ARM, but without the Crit it's about 57% (EM CCW) vs 61% (Barehanded) vs ARM1. The delta does up from there.
     
  10. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    There is a normal roll as well but the critical only applies to the e/m when it is present.
     
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  11. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Well to be fair the normal roll only happens after you've EM'd them and the only to TAGs, REMs and HI. Gotta love tearing a TAG apart with your bare hands

    (I'm pulling the piss, I got confused by normal roll rather than ARM roll :P).
     
  12. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    It's different with normal E/M CCW though, the forcing of crits only happens with E/M2. :/
     
  13. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Happens with both. EM Morlocks are better at slap fighting as well.

    Massacre you should just not use Dual Wield and only use the AP CCW.

    "E/M Special Ammunition and CC Weapons

    Close Combat Weapons that use E/M Special Ammunition cause Normal damage in addition to the E/M effect. Critical hits in CC are always applied to the E/M effect.
    "
     
  14. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    Yeah I over read it under EM and only found it under EM2 first, but looking it up again it's on both. :(
     
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  15. Leviathan

    Leviathan Hungry Caliban

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    immobilise/isolate, then swap to pistol for future rounds if they're still alive. damage is 2 lower but 25% chance to roll a crit that will actually kill them.
     
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  16. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Slapping is better than Pistol (if it's allowed). PH13-2+1 vs DAM11.
     
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  17. Leviathan

    Leviathan Hungry Caliban

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    NBW chart says +1 Damage, not +1 PH :) so you can use either really.
     
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  18. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Read how to read CC tables

    Damage MOD: A MOD to the PH Attribute of the user to determine the Damage of a successful CC Attack.
     
  19. Gus-its

    Gus-its Member

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    Is his em/2 CC weapon applying 2 BTS rolls + 1 ARM roll to damaged?
     
  20. McNamara

    McNamara Merc Rep

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    Yes, but only crits against the BTS.

    On another note: Raoul seems to be an StarCo and Tunguska exclusive after all. Would have loved to have him pair up with a Tomcat in Nomads, but it seems fair that it just was a mistake.
     
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