In my infinity group some people hate to hear me say, I'm playing my Tohaa today, people some in my group say that I can play Tohaa very will, Now I don't win very game I play with Tohaa but I do give people a hard time in winning their game, It's a good feeling to know that half the battle is won when some people hear the Tohaa is coming out to play, Do any you have that same experience of what experience have you got when you say I'm playing my Tohaa today?
Pretty much the same story, the ariadna player puts in maximum effort when he hears I'm Tohaa, and I hadn't played my own brother in about 6 months when I was playing only Tohaa.
I play only Tohaa and sometimes I have difficulties to find a partner for playing. We have a very casual community here with not so many competitive orientated players. And after my second tournament last weekend, I think, playing against Tohaa is most of the time an uphill battle, if you don't know how to play against them. Through it's unique ruleset and playstyle it is so different compared to other factions, that your normal tactics won't work. That can be very frustrating. That's a hen egg problem. Cause they don't know hoe to play against Tohaa, they don't want to play against them. Cause they don't want to play against Tohaa, they don't know how to play against them. Without doubt, Tohaa is one of the stronger factions and it is hard to build a very bad list, but the reason therefore is the limited unit selection or better the obvious special usage of each unit.
In my group some people think Tohaa has no weakness, I do tell them all of Tohaa weak spots. but those who listen to me will win or give me a hard time, because I know how to play Tohaa, when the other Tohaa player plays against me I know what to do to stop them, It won't hurt to tell some of Tohaa weakness.
After a game, I tell my opponent what he made wrong and what false decisions he made against Tohaa. The biggest advantage is at the same time their biggest disadvantage. Triads! Kill one member and you weekend them a lot. But if you tell them, they should trade an expensive model of them against the weakest model of the triad, they won't believe it. It's not enough in Infinity to tell them, what they have to do, they have to learn it the hard way. I saw that this is the only way, how I learn these things in Infinity.
I am the only active Tohaa player in my playgroup, and I'm also still somewhat inexperienced. There is one other guy who was collecting Tohaa some time ago, but I don't see him often in out FLGS. I don't win a lot of battles, so in our meta Tohaa are not considered OP :P In addition, I am trying to follow @Magonus advice and not field 2 CoC Kaeltars at once, as it makes you care much less about the tactics, as you have that failsafe in the form of 4 Mates. I also do not like the overwhelming use of Smoke + MSV2 combo, and since I don't have a model to proxy the Kerail's beasts, I do not field him and try different new tactics, instead of relying on Smoke tricks. So, I guess it depends more on your playstyle and the troops you field that on the faction itself. I have a suspicion that most of the hate we Artichokes get is due to players who often field 4 Mates. What are your metas hating you for?
I agree, The only way to get better at a game is sometimes is to lose, but you can only do your part.
I to never take 4 mates the most 2, but I'm one of those Tohaa player who likes the bombs more then mates.
I take them for that as well but the bombs let you do a little more, where as the mates only do one thing.
I would suggest picking up the Kerail when you get the chance, but using them for smoke tricks is certainly not the best use for them. I usually take the 20 point version with 1 surda and attach a 'bomb and a 'mate and use it as a fast striking unit. The Surda is very powerful in close combat against generally anything without CC skills, and with a 'bomb attached to the Kerail you can force some bad choices on your opponent by jumping into a unit with the Surda, and leaving the Kerail out of sight. Forceing them to either attack the Surda and face an unopposed 'bomb attack, or reset and face a viral hit from the Surda. I generally take 1 of each Kealtar. The versatility of 'bombs is amazing, but I like having a chain of command around, and a 'mate is very useful for late game maneuvers.
I would actually love to have an alternative CoC choice that.. ehm.. does not cost 40 points due to a costly and highly unreliable skill.
I would love to use the bombs more even in casual games but for me it feels like they are in a really bad place. The coc os really useful and the mates way more reliable. The few times I was able to use the bombs they didnt really work out...
I might be completely off track but I think the utility of bombs largely also relates to the density of terrain as well. Mates serve as excellent long ranged ARO enhancers as they increase their survivability something big so gain a larger advantage if you have longer fire lanes to exploit. I'm not necessarily talking deployment to deployment but if you can setup a Triad one end and have another to cover it's approach it can be really hard to dig Tohaa out. Incidentally if a board is setup where there are cross fire lanes that an enemy can cover, bringing bombs into a usable range becomes increasingly hard and more order intensive. On the other hand on boards that are denser, mates are still useful but bombs can suddenly get up field in a couple of orders via a Kerail/Kotail and really wreck face. The COC on the mates is good and I dont mind a shift either way. I'd like that either bombs profile to either get COC but I would like both to have a specialist profile. They're excellent triad fillers either way. I would be interested to hear from others what their experience with bombs is like factoring in table density. If it has an impact at all??
Honestly anytime I got to use the bomb the enemy won the ftf and stuff like that I think I haven't got any use of it at all paying so many orders to get into the 8 inch to have one try to get something done...on the other side with mate equiped you could just shoot and have a better chance of inflicting damage against most targets so endgame wasn't worth it lets see Endgame: mostly worse than shooting with mate equiped, they have to loose their reset against burst two attack and when fail their safe... Eraser: more intresting cause of the negative mod Hellzone: similiar to Eraser Pandemonium: This is actually intresting burst 3 with a negative mod for the enemy the support are useful in certain situations. My main problem is its one use only, really powerful it would be if its permanent as long as the unit has SA, being able to turn troops in speccialist would be fun but a 3 time use or something would be sweet already. Disclaimer: Haven't used much bombs anyway, could rarely get into the 8 inch mhmm got a game next week gonna take two bombs and try some stuff out
Maybe give CoC to bomb Kaeltars, and make the bombs disposable(3). It does seem expensive. I suppose you are talking about regeneration. Taquel is just a bit better in stats than a Sakiel, but missing the frenzy discount, or just better armor and +1WIP, -2CC compared to Sukeul, but lot more expensive than both. CoC/Advanced command is a 5 pts skill though. Funny how most of the skills in the game costs a point or two, and there are some expensive ones.
I put a Makaul in each of my triads, So! no matter how the table is set up I can try to get a bomb in position. I do wish the bomb was a 3 time use, That would be so cool.
But the oponent has to declare Reset first. If you get in ZoC but out of LoS (for example, at the other side of the wall), usually he'll declare Face Changing or just nothing at all. Then you can use the Bombs free as a Normal Roll.
Why would your opponent declare dodge or no aro when a model with a SymbioBomb is within their zone of control and not in line of sight? If the bomb is on a triad member, that member has to be the link leader. The only threat to the reactive player is a model with a bomb.
