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Teaching Aristeia to Newbies

Discussion in 'Rules' started by Roadrunner7431, Nov 4, 2018.

  1. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    As a newly accepted Warcor, I plan to start running demos during game nights at a cinema that serves alcohol and owned by George RR Martin of Game of Thrones fame.
    After watching dozens of Youtube videos of Aristeia battle reports I have been thinking about what are the most common rules errors and missed opportunities that I would want to teach newbies early in their exposure to this game so they avoid bad habits.

    I would like to stimulate a dialog here at this forum. Obviously the first that comes to mind is that "Switches go first!" I think that I should suggest that every time dice are rolled that the card of the relevant players are consulted for potential switches and that the active player (not necessarily the Underdog) chooses which player declares switches first. Then the switches are done before applying any result of the Action or Disengagement.

    I could go on but I want to stimulate further posts by other members.
     
    Flipswitch likes this.
  2. Kelthret

    Kelthret Usuario

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    For me, the main thing when teaching Aristeia is making sure they understand how the dice rolls work. Once they got that, the rest is pretty simple.
    Common reminders are that switches go first, as you said, and that barriers are a valid and eligible tactic (lots of people get surprised when you try to dazzle a barrier as Gata just to get the switch to displace her).
     
    -V-, Flipswitch, krotos and 2 others like this.
  3. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    Disengage can be tricky for newbies. First of all they often don't bother to execute a disengage roll at all when moving away from an adjacent enemy. Second if they fail, they forget that they have lost all remaining movement points for that 2 Action point Move Action. Third, it is quite common for the holding player to expect to cause damage if he gains :2: which are not blocked by :1: from the disengaging player. Whereas experienced players know that disengagement rolls (as opposed to Combat Rolls and rolls from specific non-Attack actions) do not cause damage.

    Misunderstanding the mechanism of disengaging contributes to new games becoming a Frag Fest and negating the area control aspect of this game.
     
    tartopom likes this.
  4. Tribulus

    Tribulus Member

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    RoadRunner! You live in Santa Fe? I would love to meet up for a night of Aristeia!! I have only a few games under my belt, as my social circle aren't much into this style of game. But I played Infinity for years in Oregon before moving out to NM. Your quip about what I'm assuming is the Jean Cocteau made me perk my ears up!!
     
    Roadrunner7431 likes this.
  5. tartopom

    tartopom Active Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    For the disengage roll, I encountered players who asked me the same question about damage on rolling a :2:. Also because the symbol of the stat is :R:. I had a hard time explaining that it's not a punch, but a grasp. Now I always use this word "grasp", and it helps.
     
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  6. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    Yes, I can see the urge on rolling a :-: for :R: and getting no :1: but only :2: to expect to do :4: as your opponent's character escapes your grasp.
     
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  7. tartopom

    tartopom Active Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    I agree. Even for my first ever game, I was thinking "well, he escapes but at least he takes a damage". But in fact, nope. A bit frustrating when you come from other games in which it is the case.

    But, when it is my characters that flees and stays alive, I'm soo glad that there's no damage for disengaging. :stuck_out_tongue:
     
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  8. tartopom

    tartopom Active Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    That's why Carnage is the scenario I like the least. It's, for me, at the opposite of the spirit of the game.
     
    Roadrunner7431 likes this.
  9. -V-

    -V- A! Team member
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    Oh, at first Testing phase it was that way... Until Miyamoto started to disengage while activating his Switch + Kaze Tachinu. So we decided Aristeia! had to remain as a positional game.
     
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  10. tartopom

    tartopom Active Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    And I'm really glad you did. As for me, Aristeia! isn't a game in wich KO'ing ALL of the opponent's characters is relevant.
     
  11. Spellbreaker90

    Spellbreaker90 Well-Known Member

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    One thing new people coming from other game can found not intuitive is that Aristos b2b with enemy can still make ranged attacks.
     
  12. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    @Spellbreaker90 Excellent point! You think that you have shut down a character by getting within their minimum range only to have them shoot your Ally instead. Your post also made me appreciate the relatively straight forward abilities of characters in the CoreSet and in SoF. I don't think I should include Bixie in a demo game. Her Domu's Gift has her gliding around the Hexadome like Tony Hawk.
     
  13. Spellbreaker90

    Spellbreaker90 Well-Known Member

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    Other things that I think could help :

    1 - First game players don't really know what Aristos card they have to put in their Deck, I would give them already pre-builded Deck and at game end explaning that they can build their Deck chosing from their Team card;

    2 - Core characters are really good, but I don't like the Team balance, I found that 8-Ball team has an higher win rate in newbie game, Musashi and Wild Bill togheter are newbie stomper. For that reason I think the player that has the Maximus' team need more help, explaning that Hexxer can totaly shut down Musashi frezing him is usefull in two way: first you help the player with the game and then show both of them how in Aristeia! killing is not everything, sometimes it's just plain better shutting down an opponent.
     
  14. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    @Spellbreaker90 Great post. I wonder if you have a suggestion for a better balance of 4 versus 4 using just the characters from the CoreSet.
    Lately I have been thinking more of drafting randomly. I played a very interesting TTS game yesterday with my friend @Tribulus where I randomly drafted a team of Mushashi, Prysm, Hannibal and Laxmee. I am not sure I would have ever put them together but the synergies especially with their Aristos cards were fascinating to explore.
     
  15. Spellbreaker90

    Spellbreaker90 Well-Known Member

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    Using only the 8 Core Aristos the only balance change that can come to mind is switching Lunah with Wild Bill. This way both team have a 6 Initiative damage dealer and both have chance to gain extra attack.
    At the same time Parvati Reset would be more likely to come in play removing Lunah -2 MOV.

    But the best change I think come from just switching out Miyamoto for Laxmee. This way both Team have the same thing that work in different way. Both have a ranged attacker, both have a Tank that deal damage on close combat, both team have a way to move enemy piece (8-Ball/Hexxer), to remove enemy status and both have a sort of Scorer in Hexxer/Gata.
     
    treiral, Roadrunner7431 and tartopom like this.
  16. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    @Spellbreaker90 Thank you for contributing. I have been following this forum for 11 months. You are a member who thinks through the depth that this game offers. I just have been invited to visit a group of dedicated Infinity players at one of their homes. Any advice for pitching Aristeia to them?
     
  17. Spellbreaker90

    Spellbreaker90 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think Aristeia! Share something with Infinity other than the wonderfull model.

    They are different game that take place in the same world.

    I think a lot of the appeal of Aristeia! Is the same that MOBA game have, you don't stand for a faction, but for the Aristos!

    Showing them how cool character are, what they can do and the depth of the game I think is the best selling point.
     
  18. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    Please help me explain States affecting LOS to Newbies without my making mistakes by oversimplifying. Correct my errors please.

    Dazzled - Your character cannot use Ranged Actions ( except for :L: 0-1) but your Enemies can shoot you freely.

    Hidden - Very much the inverse of Dazzled. You shoot freely. Your enemies or allies need to be adjacent to you to target you with Ranged Actions. Also you do not benefit from Cover ( So a Hidden Lunah would not get the extra :)::5::,:)
    However if your character uses a red Attack action, then that character loses the Hidden state immediately after the Attack is resolved. You may use green Actions freely.

    Marked - Any action that targets you by friend or foe that otherwise would require LOS does not require LOS. Anything that would target you with :L: is now effectively :SL:. You do not benefit from Cover.

    Smoke - Free Spaces with Smoke block LOS but not movement. Any character on a space with a Smoke token is almost like being Hidden and Dazzled at the same time except for the fact that you may still get Cover from adjacent Blocked spaces, Obstacles or Occupied Spaces in the event a character like Bixie that ignores Smoke shoots you. Also you can Attack adjacent enemies without losing the effect of Smoke (unlike Hidden). Of course the fact that you can spend movement points one by one and interrupt a series of movement with a ranged action means that you can move out of Smoke, perform a ranged action, then move back into Smoke. You cannot move out of Dazzled.
     
  19. treiral

    treiral Midnight poster

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    Sounds good. Keep in mind that a :S:Dazzled Laxmee or Kozmo can use their :SL:actions because they don't require LoS, so it's not like they can't use ranged actions.

    This makes no sense, if they are adjacent then the action isn't ranged. But it's probably just a mistake in the writeup! Just wanted to point it out.

    Another good reminder for newbies would be what @-V- was talking about in the other thread. Characters that has no LoS can't :4: their attacker in :W:Defense Rolls, and that applies to :S:Dazzled characters, Smoked characters beyond 0-1:L:, :J:Marked characters that don't have LoS with their attacker, and in the case of :O:Hidden, everybody.
     
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  20. Roadrunner7431

    Roadrunner7431 Well-Known Member
    Warcor Aristeia

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    @treiral Thanks so much for taking the time to review and offer constructive criticism. Actually Kozmo's Attack "Supernova" is an example of what I was trying to say concerning a Hidden target. The Attack has a Range requirement of :L:1-2. A Kozmo adjacent to a Hidden Target may attack but a Kozmo two spaces away may not. I will edit my post. Perhaps there is no simpler way to express the adjacent concept other than how it has been written in the "States" sheet.