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Tao of Tunguska

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by natetehaggresar, Feb 20, 2019.

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  1. infyrana

    infyrana Well-Known Member

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    I came to the conclusion that I really like most all of the Tunguska models and came here to seek appropriate advice please!

    I'm interested in building a Kriza (Hollow Man) Haris as my starting point for a list and look for support around it - but that's where my knowledge of what the Sectorial does best (Hacking?) stops!

    The only model I own for Tunguska is a Lunokhod+Koalas, but I can proxy REM's, Doc, Engi and Zondbots. I plan to pick up the good looking Tunguska starter box and a couple of other bits to go with it. I've been eyeing up the Securitate SWC box (Grenzer model and hacker=proxy Interventor) and the Feuerbach as I really like these line infantry models which play a big part in me wanting to collect TJC. Does anyone ever run Securiate heavy lists for any reason, I'm very curious?

    I am spoilt for choices between a heavy link of Hollow Men, an expensive but cute Puppetactica box, a gorgeous Zondnautica smoke model and a rather list restrictive but sweet Szalamandra. I will likely grab them all over time, but of these four models, is there a preferential order for using and learning them please?

    Perseus is a must for the haris, are Mary Problems and Raoul allstars in N4 for the haris setup? The Heckler blister would provide me with a Fast Panda for my Interventors, but I'm not sure a second Heckler is needed.

    Finally with the new Cheerkiller box coming, how are people looking to use and support these in N4 please? That Grenzer model would make a great MSR conversion since I don't own the MSR model.
     
  2. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    Percy is a must if you're building the kriza and hollow haris as he is a hollowman for fireteam construction.
    Mary can't be linked, but is still a very good solo operator and is one of the few pieces where Trinity is actually effective.
    While the bro haris (Percy, Raoul and stempler) can be effective, Raoul in my experience is far more effective as the AD option as it gives TJC (Tunguska Jurisdictional Command) access to an incredibly effective flanking strike piece that is great for exploiting openings and knocking down enemy pieces that have other elements of your list pinned, as well as becoming a massive headache that your opponent will have to spend orders on to deal with.

    The interventor box comes with a pair of fast pandas, but the jammer heckler (the one that comes with the panda) is key to TJC defence and far more important in leveraging our offensive hacking they greater reach and reliability than a pitcher. Hecklers are quite easy to take 2 - 3 of and have them be useful mostly as crumple zone defensive pieces and a way to leverage hacking, the Red fury used to be a great secondary gunfighter but red furies are a little weak this edition so I'm not entirely sold on that profile at the moment.

    I'd recommend to get puppets and then the hollowmen, both are back bone units and you will take the puppet master at least solo in pretty much every list as he is the cheapest order in the sectorial, has minelayer and counter intel, and the puppets are great first turn attackers if you choose to take them with the PM. Hollowmen while no where near as effective as they were last edition are still real mean and you should expect to have a few running around in most lists. As for the Szalamandra and the Zondnautica they aren't core units but they are the kind of thing that you add in from time to time based off of what battlefield role you need filled and which mission you are playing.


    Securitate are the primary core team for the faction so you will need a handful around, they also allow for the inclusion of a native repeater in the fireteam which lets the securitate fireteam have some interesting applications as an assault fireteam.

    Cheerkillers will either be an assault haris with a wildcard gunner subbed in to to the heavy lifting or the AP rifle/shock marksman. Alternatively they could be run as a cheap backfield haris that puts some close defence pieces in the DZ with a ML or MSR thrown into the haris for more direct fire support. As for the grenzer conversion depending on how that model is broken up it may be annoying to convert and would exclude you from running the ML later on, if you run corregidor I'd recommend picking up the action pack you get a few useful things for them there and the other Kriza profile, a combi Spektr that doesn't look real old and derpy along with the sniper Grenzer.
     
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  3. infyrana

    infyrana Well-Known Member

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    @Tourniquet Thank you for your helpful and informative response! I'm soaking in the tactical information as I'm piecing together what the faction is capable of and making notes :)

    A shame about the Hollow Men, they're a great model but that Super Jump nerf is plaguing a number of troops. I'll put them on the back bench for now with Szaly and Zond for later in the year. I grabbed individual models from the Nomad action specifically for Corregidor when it first came out - thereby missing out on models such as the Kirza, Spektr and Grenzer - mistakes were made :( They are on my 'look out for' list when browsing the second hand and split box stuff. I was planning to pick up a second Cheerkiller box Grenzer for the conversion as it looks like it could be easy to swap the ML at the wrist. I'm still not yet convinced on the Raoul model, the tracksuit hoodie look isn't what I wanted for my Nomads, any alternative suggestions please?
     
  4. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    The Defiance version of him looks much betyter but if its the overall aesthetic as opposed to the sculpt thats the issue, then your best bet may be doing a conversion based off of either the ayyar, Massacre, cube jaeger (weapon and head swap), or stick a hellcat back pack on the BSG Spektr to mess with people. I used the red veil limited ed. Yuan Yuan for a while.

    Theres a few conversions down in the ceonversion thread and some of the painting threads that are pretty good.
     
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  5. infyrana

    infyrana Well-Known Member

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    @Tourniquet Totally missed an easy one - I do have the female Bandit which could be the easiest choice despite the lack of back pack. I'll go check out the conversion thread for ideas cheers :)
     
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  6. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    A question to the TJC community at large.
    How are you playong the Kriza these days?
    Is it still the solo power house of the sectorial or are you jamming it in a fireteam? And if so haris or core?

    I've been messing around with the idea of a kriza+percy+jelena/ashcroft haris but have found the list somewhat awkward to construct and still have the necessary tools to perform well.
     
  7. Savnock

    Savnock Nerfherder

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    I dropped the Nomad specops bald head on an Ekdromoi-boarding-shotty body and it looks great. CCW, shotgun, dramatic landing pose, check check check.
     
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  8. infyrana

    infyrana Well-Known Member

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    @Savnock Did you mean the combi Ekdromoi or Diomedes with the Mk12? I was struggling to find a BS-Ekdromoi model and am not familiar with Aleph. Either way they look like good alternatives, thank you!
     
  9. Armihaul

    Armihaul Well-Known Member

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    For raoul I used the combi ekdromoi, and changed the weapon with the aleph weapon pack (From spec ops) and an old alguacile head (which might be changed... he became a really big-head guy. Its not the best raoul out there... but I prefeer it than the pijamas dude one

    for the moment I got no chance to play it, but I plan to use it alone when I have the chance. He became a bit too expensive tough after also getting a nerf, yes, he is a powerhouse, but at a maybe too much cost.
     
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  10. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Raoul = Space Jesus
     
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  11. MattB89

    MattB89 Well-Known Member

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    Honestly I havnt even thought about taking a Kriza in N4. His role is ARO clearing but most of the AROs these days seem to be linked HI which an HMG struggles to get through.

    Now with the new meta of HI and TAGS, as long as points are available I would rather take a Szalamandra. For only 18 point more you gain a far better gun, better ARM, BTS, extra STR, higher MOV, as well as a model which is also a specialist.
     
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  12. jfunkd

    jfunkd hard forum hittin Carlos
    Warcor

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    IMO the biggest nerf to the Kriza was the crit change. He's still going to kill most stuff he shoots at, but he is not the anti-armor unit he was because even volume of dice with an HMG will not reliably overcome ARM 7, 8 or 9 in cover in N4. Any amount of ARM over 4 will start to humble the HMG. Crits pushed it over that hump in N3. The Kriza benefits defensively from these changes as well, so it's not a complete loss.

    The unit not dropping any in price while most HI did is also something I don't really understand, but the Kriza is still a value proposition in N4. He's expensive, but if you play him well he will do good work for his points. If he had gotten an AP HMG for this cost, none of us would be questioning his price and plenty of players would be complaining about this profile. As it is, he feels a little over costed. IMO he should have been about 5 points less.

    Mimetism was a sidegrade to me, I really like dodging on a 14 with that -3 when shooting back is not a good option and I find my Kriza to be more durable in the Reactive now.

    Burst 6 is a stellar upgrade for him, it makes running him in a Harris completely viable in spite of the costs.

    Kriza goes Brrrrrrrr
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]3
    KRIZA BORAC Heavy Machine Gun / Heavy Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 54)
    STEMPLER ZOND FTO (Super-Jump) Combi Rifle, Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 17)
    PERSEUS FTO (Fireteam: Haris) Breaker Combi Rifle(+1 Dam), Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Heavy Pistol(+1B), DA CC Weapon. (0 | 32)
    1.5 SWC | 103 Points
    Open in Infinity Army

    I have been playing him in a Harris with Perseus and a Stemplar. Much like the N3 Broharris, the Stemplar adds a decent amount of utility because of being a specialist, a repeater and being cheap. You have to pick your targets, but the harris can take on all but the toughest AROs and mostly only needs to worry about 5 man linked AP units with visual mods or MSV. If you run into those and need to avoid them, you can White Noise through the Repeater or use Perseus' B2 smoke to avoid it. It is very important to pick targets that a B6 HMG will kill through volume of dice, so don't go after TAGs in cover or units with visual mods and link bonuses especially if it can drop AP ammo on you.

    This Harris usually gets run with a Securitate + Grenzer MM MSR and Puppets. If the Stemplar or Kriza goes down, any Wildcards in the Core can help you to reform back to Harris if it's relevant to your plan. The Grenzer has covered for the Stemplar in several of my games now. The Stemplar is the easy target of the group, so it tends to go down first.

    In my last game versus PanSnow in Cap and Protect the Kriza killed nearly half of the opposing force: 2 Vargar, ORC BSG, Karhu feuerbach, and a Fusilier while using the Decomp zones as highways to grab the football my Spektr had dropped and win the game. Several of his B6 shots got reduced to B5 by Decomp zones, but I was very happy they weren't B4 instead.

    FWIW, I am having much more fun with the Kriza in N4 than in N3 and he is making more of my lists than before. He also just feels more Tunguskan with "More bullets is more better than more accuracy". I always felt he was a bit overrated in N3, useful but not quite the god-unit that many on these forums spoke of him as. Now with the linking actually being viable and beneficial it feels just about right, even if it's over costed by about 5 points or so IMO.

    FWIW, whenever I try and make a list where he is in a core, I end up hating the list. Where I have come close is when making a list where he could potentially start either in a core or in a Harris. It's kinda flaky to depend on so many wildcard to make the links though. Kriza core ends up being so expensive it's hard to make it work at all.

    You're breaking my heart here @inane.imp.

    Raoul was my profile crush in N3. Loved everything about him, his Moon Knight influence, his statline, and his ability to win games single handedly with a well timed walk on, or well placed AD (never you mind that I rolled 20 for his Combat Jump more often than should be statistically possible).

    Let me caveat my following statements by saying that Raoul is far from useless, he is TJC's HI and TAG hunter in melee and he can get there, He can also do a lot of damage but....

    I am having a much more difficult time using the AD profile in N4. It feels like DTW are everywhere now with the shotgun change. Raoul just cant tank them, not in the quantity I tend to see them on what used to be some of his favorite targets. Fireteams with B2 shotties just wreck him now and he used to eat them. He still does damage, but in my experience: he didn't make out well with the Shotgun changes. Where he wants to kill things are quite often the ranges where your opponents want Raoul to be and will just ignore his Mimetism -6 with DTW to kill him. AD Raoul tends to trade himself now in your opponent's DZ rather than kill and survive. It's easier to lose him on a bad trade, or see an attack vector for him that would have worked in N3, but not in N4.

    He isn't making as many of my lists as he was in N3. I would love to see the FTO profile for Raoul have the BSG and the Multirifle profile get Parachutist and Combat Jump. It would make each of the profiles better in their roles IMO. Then again, Raoul was borderline over the top in N4 because he could win games on his own. So maybe a gentle nerf was needed. I could see the Multirifle profile with combat jump being too strong in N4.

    I'm just sad that I'm not taking him (or Mary, but that's a different story) as often in N4 as I did in N3. Raoul was my profile crush in N3, but now It's Perseus in N4. Perseus always did a lot of work for me, but now he's so much better.
     
    #132 jfunkd, Dec 5, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2020
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  13. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Oh I was purely talking about Proxies.

    My Raoul:
    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Hachiman Taro

    Hachiman Taro Inverted gadfly

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    Don't believe you, that's painted.
     
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  15. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    I never said *I* painted it. [emoji14]
     
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  16. Ugin

    Ugin Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    I didn't know that Raoul was hommage to Moon Knight. Interesting!
     
  17. Armihaul

    Armihaul Well-Known Member

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    can you explain why his role is aro? his weapon options are not so good on aro, and his only relevant skill for aro is mimetism, which, IMO, is not enought for a 50+ points dude.
     
  18. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    ARO clearing, not ARO, meaning he exists to knockdown what ever your opponent puts up in defense.
     
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  19. Armihaul

    Armihaul Well-Known Member

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    sorry... I read it as "aro declaring", my bad
     
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  20. Hachiman Taro

    Hachiman Taro Inverted gadfly

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    I mean shooty mcshoot face is clearly a poor attempt at PanO impersonation anyway so I ignore his existence.

    Real Nomads hack things, then shoot them.
     
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