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So... N4 Hunh?

Discussion in 'News' started by AdmiralJCJF, Aug 4, 2019.

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  1. deltakilo

    deltakilo Bear of Butcher bay
    Warcor

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    also the avatar is already terrifying enough, Please dont make it worth 4 orders. I will never sleep again :P
     
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  2. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    Have only played N3 but didn’t the Combi-Rifle used to be hackable?
     
  3. Werekill

    Werekill Well-Known Member

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    Honestly I'd be fine with Tags getting only one additional order, although I'd prefer 3 total orders. 4 would be a bit much and swing balance too far in the other direction, I think. 3 sounds like it'd be decent, but I admit that it'd be better to test 2 first.
     
  4. ijw

    ijw Wargaming Trader, Freelance Editor (UK)
    Warcor

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    NO, it was just EM-vulnerable.
     
  5. deltakilo

    deltakilo Bear of Butcher bay
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    E/M used to just shut off e/m vulnerable weapons. (back then E/m didnt isolate though)
     
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  6. A Mão Esquerda

    A Mão Esquerda Deputy Hexahedron Officer

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    Tons of things were vulnerable to E/M weapons, such as @ijw mentioned, including most weapons outside of Rifles.
     
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  7. RejjeN

    RejjeN Active Member

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    Could always make it a variable skill for each TAG, like 2 for Gecko's (light TAG's) and 3 for heavy TAG's.

    Another idea I had, as a way to balance this. What if a TAG took up 3 'slots' in a Group? That way, while it will give 3 orders it won't get 12 by just having 9 filler models, it will still be limited to 10 (plus minus other weird skills..).
     
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  8. Werekill

    Werekill Well-Known Member

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    iirc that bit with the group slots was part of the initial idea, and I was going off that assumption lol.
     
  9. RejjeN

    RejjeN Active Member

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    Oh, lol. I haven't read the entire discussion xD
     
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  10. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

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    Back then a Molotok was just a worse Spitfire... but it wasn’t E/M vulnerable!

    Also the fact that the secondary effect on a plasma rifle template was E/M was just incredibly rude.
     
  11. Werekill

    Werekill Well-Known Member

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    No worries, lol. It's a pretty active thread.
     
  12. Mob of Blondes

    Mob of Blondes Well-Known Member

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    I would go with A. Why? Because then X means X, nothing more, nothing less. And also allows extra flexibility when creating profiles. B will use similar space in profiles in the long term, as well as help with memory, but lack the flexibility.

    Example Martial Arts L2:
    A1: Martial Arts L2, Surprise Attack, Stealth, V: Courage.
    B: Martial Arts L2 (Surprise Attack, Stealth, V: Courage)
    But then we can have profiles with:
    A2: Martial Arts L2, V: Courage
    without SA or Stealth, because it's a noisy REM, eg.

    Example Morat, if there is some kind of reason for "linking" skills use + instead of comma (something disabling one means the rest will also be unusable, or whatever), maybe for fluff use &:
    A: Veteran L1 & Religious Troop
    B: Morat (Veteran L1, Religious Troop)

    Bonus: with A all the skills can be alphabetically ordered in profiles (feature I have not followed in the examples), so checking if someone has something is easier.
     
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  13. Leviathan

    Leviathan Hungry Caliban

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    Was chatting about this with the local meta, and we came to the conclusion that CC should be simplified to some extent, with CC specialists getting a version of martial arts that's just a levelled skill affecting the number of dice rolled, rather than being a big mish-mash of different tables.
    So it becomes more like shooting.
    Special effects like Guard or Protheion could instead be handled using weapon profiles, so for eg. "Protheion" functions as a CCW that causes PH+2 damage, requires a BTS save, and has the "Vampiric" keyword.
     
  14. mazzacheammazza

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    For fix crits, I like the concept of "destiny dice": you always, always roll a SINGLE dice of different colour, no matter thr burst. Only that one matter for critical hits.

    This will stop increasing B the recipe for better crit chanche, will make aro bit more powerful, and overall crit less likely in a game, and remove those silly "double crit on HI" instakill. Indeed, even fatality lvl 2 is honest with this little change.
     
  15. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    You could split the difference by only allowing one crit to auto-wound no matter how many dice you've rolled. There's no real need to introduce multi-colored dice unless you are dead set on a flat 5% chance to crit on any attack no matter what.

    Higher burst would still increase crit chance, but you'd only ever inflict one guaranteed wound because of it.
     
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  16. bona

    bona Well-Known Member

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    They’d have to make some adjustment for close combat. High CC numbers with mods greatly increase the odds of a crit. If it got reduced to pure 5% chance, the whole CC balance would have to be adjusted.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
     
  17. Andre82

    Andre82 Well-Known Member

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    No worries

    The payoff being huge is also sort of my issue however. Let me give an example.

    The last time I pushed it was with a Fiday. My opponent had deployed first and left a hole open in his backline not far from his LT. It was a pretty easy hole to miss with it being inside a building prone. Normally a 25% chance of turning a 30ish point troop into just a cheerleader but this opportunity was basically a 75% chance to win the game. He was so mad at himself for his mistake and forfeited after my first turn.
    Was skill involved? Yes quite a bit, both in him making the mistake and in me spotting it, and it was a risk vs reward choice I had to make, but the effects of this choice still boiled down to the second roll of the game (first being LT roll) pretty much deciding if he got to play Infinity that match. Some people are ok with this kind of high risk roll, I don't like it for the same reasons I don't like turn two combos in MTG. Even as a Haq player I would rather it not be an option for Fidays.
     
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  18. Scutarii

    Scutarii Active Member

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    I would love to see more scenery interaction rules - maybe just for non-competitive narrative play. I want my engineer to blow holes in walls with d-charges. I want my HMRC to shred that advertising board you’re hiding behind. I want my hacker to be able to seize control of that parked car and smash it into you. I want the ninja diving off the roof onto you’re head to sword you to death to get a bonus for being cinematic.
     
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  19. Mugaaz

    Mugaaz Member

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    These are all just my opinion, obviously.

    1. Recosting of many things that have proven over time to be too cheap or too costly. - KHD, AHD, ARM, various skills, etc.
    2. Someway of seeing all skills a unit has without 15 page clicks in the wiki. Option for basic or detailed skill listing is probably enough.
    3. Fatility L2 only being available on sniper rifles. I think theskill is cool on a sniper rifle, while being eyeroll worthy on a B5 platform.
    4. Crits changed to be a damage modifier instead of auto damage. And/or defensive skill that prevents crits from being an auto damage. I think its possible for crits to become nearly automatic damage to most units, but still allow ways for armor to matter. I'm unsure on the exact value of the modifier. Off the cuff guess, +5 DMG modifier.
    5. Some curtailing of ability to stack an absurd amount of negative modifiers. There are tons of ways to accomplish this - change from neg 3 to neg 2, cap of max, cap on how many modifiers. -9 to -12 mods should be harder to get than they are.
    6. Guns need to be condensed. There are too many gun names, many having similar range bands or damage to existing guns. I'd rather guns be consolidated into various "chassis" types, and then modify the chassis through adjectives and ammo. Example: Plasma Carbine vs Plasma Rifle. The only thing different between these is the burst value. Plasma rifle is doing this well, because it is just an adjective modifier to the rifle. OTOH, the carbine is just pointless and should be assigned the rifle chassis, while using an adjective to describe the negative burst modifier. Some guns are not completely identical, but not different enough to be worth creating a new gun for. Just remove them and come up with a list of interesting modifiers.
    7. Hacking needs more than just some number tweaks and consolidation (needs those as well). Some of the devices/programs are unique, interesting, and yet utterly pointless. I feel like there are so many ways to tweak them, and all have merit. My overall feeling is that hacking in Infinity is a cool idea, but of all the systems it is the one that actually needs redevelopment and not just minor tweaking.
    8. Skills that let models generate more than 1 regular order, while still not allowing you to exceed 10 order cap. They have been touching this design area with a 10 foot pole lately, and all of those attempts have been really good imo. I don't understand the hesitation with allowing some units multi order generation. This design space would actually create a lot of room for new and existing units. It needs to be used sparingly on expensive platforms, but would be great in many places.
    9. More skills designed for the reactive turn. The reactive turn needs more skills, equipment, and units designed specifically for it. I want more things like Total Reaction, Nuerocinets, etc. The most effective reactive turn defenses now are being pushed into ways to contest your opponent without a real winner take all F2F roll. That is because there is little to no way to really contest F2F reactively. It is becoming very hard to justify why a person would want a B1/1W Sniper in ARO anymore. I want more powerful and varied ARO pieces to exist that actually compete in F2F. It feels like all the good reactive strategies rely on some form of cheese, because all the majority of non-cheese methods are underpowered in comparison. I have *no* problem with the cheese options. My problem is with the non-cheese options being so unattractive.
     
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  20. Ayadan

    Ayadan Knight of the TAG Order

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    That's something you can already do in non-competitive games. It's rarer in ITS scenarios.
     
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