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So, how does Vanilla CA work?

Discussion in 'Combined Army' started by theradrussian, Oct 24, 2018.

  1. theradrussian

    theradrussian Well-Known Member

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    Hi Guys, Onyx player here who is expanding his horizons.

    I've got an LI tourney coming up, and beyond the mandatory avatar+ko dali or speculo list, I was looking at some of the other options, trying to work out what exactly is "good".

    I've gotten quite used to the crutch that is link teams (especially mixed ones), so coming to vanilla and seeing the likes of the charontid, anathematic, skaivoro, et al has me scratching my head and wondering what exactly they....do. I wanna use some of those because the minis are baller and this is a miniatures game. However, how do these non-avatar EI aspects work in a practical sense?

    What do they pair well with?

    What to watch out for?

    What do you do to counter links (EVO rem and repeaters for that sweet sweet EI hacking program?)?

    Thanks!
     
  2. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. gamma ray

    gamma ray Well-Known Member
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    • The Charontid HMG is quite popular, especially paired with a Daturazi or 2 to provide smoke/MSV tricks.
    • Kerr Nau makes for a useful toolbox in vanilla, and will also give you Pitchers to extend the reach of your hacking area.
    • Speculo Killer is almost mandatory for the surgical strike it can provide, also putting smoke on targets you don't want to CC
    • I like using the Skiavoros for late game Sepsitor shenanigans, but it's a lot of points for stats that you can pay a lot less for
    • Anathematic is a major headache for area control. Suppresive in cover is godly on this beast
    • Counter links with either smoke or White Noise as appropriate. Pick them off one by one, or avoid them altogether.
     
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  4. Skjarr

    Skjarr EI Mouthpiece

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    How does Vanilla work?
    Apply orders to a Charontid or Anathematic until the enemy has gone away.

    Vanilla is all about the Aspects.
    Charontid:
    There is a choice to be made here, MSV3 or specialist.
    If you want the HD+ you have to forgoe the MSV. It can however do the heavy lifting with extremely high WIP, high BS and arguably the nastiest rifle weapon in the game. Will need some support to cross the board though although HD+ does allow for the Impersonation state. Bwahahaha!
    MSV3 + HMG. This guy is a beastly fire base. 10000 camo markers bothering you? Auto discover and gun them down from range. Or take the plasma rifle and incinerate them close up.

    Anathematic:
    My personal favourite. A terrifying S6 TO killer with an awesome model.
    I usually roll the Lt hacker profile.
    A TO, hacker leuitenant with a Plasma rifle can really get stuff done. I've had huge success with this guy, he can cross the board and cap objectives reliably and is a capable gunfighter up close.
    As always with models like this though, beware of CC warbands as they are it's biggest weakness.
    In less button pushing mission I have been known to run the Sepsitor version for fun and frolics. Stealing a pair of Ninjas is a personal highlight.

    Skiavoros:
    Not really sure what this guys role is to be honest. Too expensive to be a cheerleader but not powerful enough to Rambo imo. My experiments have been limited but I struggle to build a list I'm happy with containing a Skiavoros.

    Aspects are expensive so you build your list around them so support.....:
    Ikadrons. 9pt, cheap order goodness.
    I get good mileage out of 1 or 2 chain rifle Daturazi. They provide smoke cover and often prove a massive nuisance to my opponent.
    Shrouded. I normally take the FO, relatively cheap for CA and provide some midfield coverage.
    If I'm not taking the MSV Charontid then I do get use out of the Maakrep HMG to help with a lot of camo and/or smoke.
     
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  5. Aspect Graviton

    Aspect Graviton Friendly Alien Overlord
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    The aspects are all dynamite and they are basically the reason to play generic.

    Skio is an excellent command and control piece especially in LI being able to channel it's order into another piece like a TAG or Kodali or a specialist to achieve a goal while also being a nasty little combat piece.

    Charontid is an almost in equaled kill piece as a HMG or a really nasty toolbox as a hacker

    Anthe' is just excellent, marker state for immediate survivability, suppression fire, hacking device option, very few situations where it doesn't excel.

    They all obviously lean towards limited insertion being more expensive than some TAGs.

    Other ways to play, you can do much more in mixed arms, units like shrouded and aswangs are great.
    Combat engineers like Kurgat come in cheaper than Dr Boobworm to look after your drones and put down mines and decent ranged attacks.
    Daturatzi give you a more dependable skirmish screen and can be used in place of line troops and smoke access.
    The EI super friends like Kodali, Anyat, Hasht and now Swanson all add a lot of very specialised versatility.
    Specialised sectorial units like the rasyat, umbra and raicho can work extremely well together.
     
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  6. theradrussian

    theradrussian Well-Known Member

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    Yeah the noctifier isn't bad, but for 30+ points and 1.5SWC I generally prefer something where the whole outcome does not hinge on me rolling 15 or less (in the best cases). My rolling is not known for being stable :P
     
  7. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Srsly I hate this guy....
     
  8. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    He is Dogged, so you have a reasonable 2nd chance!
     
  9. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    Well, think about this when dealing with links:

    Every plasma weapon has a template option. Anathematics and Charontid hackers come with plasma rifles.

    Besides the biggest advantage of a TO missile launcher is positioning them so when your oponent moves in to fight another threat, you reveal the Noctifer and force them into a bad situation. Let's say they engage your TR bot with a fully linked model and then you reveal the Noctifer and fire at the link leader: Now they have to choose between shooting at the TO Camoed missile and eating the TR bot's burst, shooting at the TR and eating the missile, or splitting the burst and risk accomplishing nothing. That's pretty baller.

    I don't consider the speculo an auto-take, but having a shotgun that close to the enemy is also a good way to take out most of a link in a single shot. You could even use a malignos for that too if you feel like it, although I think the speculo is more bang for the buck.
     
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  10. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I like the Skiavoro as the Lt.
    • No worries about LoL due to Mnemonica and he has Stratego L2.
    • He’s even better now with FD L1.
    • He has a Plasma Rifle so he can go into suppression and with his Mimetisim, even better!
    • If not Lt. then Hacking Device Plus with WIP16 is fantastic. Imagine this guy with Cybermask and White Noise.
    • He can have Sepsitor Plus, so unlimited uses.
     
  11. Leviathan

    Leviathan Hungry Caliban

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    Another thing in favour of the Skiavoro LT - he's got 1W and NWI sure, but since he's got STR and not wounds, he's immune to shock. He also gets FDL1 at the moment, so its pretty easy to just start in a forward position, in cover, spend one order to go into suppression fire (so that's -9 to hit between suppression, cover and mimetism) and then leave him there all game, never having to spend his LT order on himself unless you want to.
     
  12. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

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    I'm actually a fan of the Noctifer spitfire. It's an amazingly reliable problem solver.
     
  13. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

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    Oh man, I didn't even think about the fact that the Skiavoro is MI when reading the new ITS document.
     
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  14. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I forgot about the Structure being like Shock Immunity! So add one more to the list!

    So even though he's not a heavy he's still great as a defense figure in missions to say hold the AC unit or Console, etc.
     
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  15. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    Just out of curiosity, there is a lot here about heavy hitter, but what about TAG (Avatar of course but also other), do they see a lot of millage in vanilla ?

    Also what do you use for button pushing ? Especially on mission where a lot of button pushing is needed (rescue, tic tac toe...) ?

    PS : any use for Q-drones (HMG or plasma) ?
     
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  16. Skjarr

    Skjarr EI Mouthpiece

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    If I want to run the Sphinx I'd be tempted to run that in Onyx and back it up a Unidron team however I don't see any reason why it can't work in vanilla.
    I haven't tried the new Raicho in vanilla yet but I reckon it might have uses. Although for the same cost I can have an Anathematic so....

    For mid-field and button pushing I lean quite heavily on Shrouded FOs. Cheapest infiltrating camo specialist available to us and I often find myself short on points for a Malignos.
    I've been known to run the Umbra Legate hacker too. He's a bit fragile but is a decent toolbox and 6-2 MOV is useful.

    I also get mileage out of the HMG Q-Drone. I keep meaning to play around with the Plasma variant as it has the potential to be beastly with supportware in the midfield.
     
    #16 Skjarr, Oct 26, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2018
  17. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    Shrouded FO! Malignos is ok but the Shrouded is so much cheaper and gets the job done just as well I think.

    Fracta AHD is pretty good and survivable.
     
  18. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    Q-Drones are always my first line of offense. Vanguard or E-Drone spends an order to buff the Q-Drone, then it goes around bursting high priority targets like AROing snipers or MLs, or shooting chaff like Daylamis.

    For button pushing missions I always favor the anathematic hacker Lt, usually paired with either a Malignos FO or a Zerat FO. I'm not a big fan of the shrouded even though it should be better than the zerat. I just prefer my specialists to be able to actually shoot, and the +6 shotgun bonus goes a long way in mitigating the zerat's atrocious BS
     
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  19. Styx

    Styx Cat.IE~~

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  20. Xenophontis

    Xenophontis Member

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    How does one spec fire grenades to clear out camouflage tokens? I was under the impression that you had to select a valid target outside of LoF. Markers are not valid targets of a BS attack. Unless you are targeting a nearby figure that happens to make the grenade template overlap with the marker, it would not be a valid order? Grenades do not have "Targetless", either.

    I am pretty new though, so I could be mistaken there.