1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hemos actualizado nuestra Política de Privacidad acorde con la nueva RGPD. +Info // We've updated our Privacy Policy to comply with the GDPR. +Info
    Dismiss Notice

Sin-Eater vs Reaktion Zond as ARO Piece

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by Ghost87, Feb 5, 2018.

  1. Rubberpiggy

    Rubberpiggy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2018
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    72
    @HarlequinOfDeath Could you direct me to where you found the nomad Interplanetario 2 tr bot list?
     
    reaper1714 likes this.
  2. reaper1714

    reaper1714 Annoying genocidal machine

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    71
    I'm interested also...
     
    Rubberpiggy likes this.
  3. HarlequinOfDeath

    HarlequinOfDeath Tha Taskmastaaa
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2017
    Messages:
    785
    Likes Received:
    750
    There was a download somewhere in the old forum or on the blog page. @karolis played two times the same list, he just switched the LT:

    [​IMG] Karolis Inerplanetario I
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] INTRUDER HMG, Grenades / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 42)
    [​IMG] REAKTION ZOND HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    [​IMG] INTERVENTOR Hacker Lieutenant (Hacking Device Plus) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 25)
    [​IMG] MORAN (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 22)
    [​IMG] TRANSDUCTOR ZOND Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] TRANSDUCTOR ZOND Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] JAGUAR Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] SALYUT (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] SALYUT (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] ALGUACIL Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]7 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] ZOE & PI-WELL . (0 | 47)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] ZOE (Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Stop!) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 28)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] PI-WELL Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 19)
    [​IMG] REAKTION ZOND HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    [​IMG] MORAN Combi Rifle, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] ALGUACIL Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] JAGUAR Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] JAGUAR Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] WARCOR (Aerocam) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
    reaper1714 likes this.
  4. HarlequinOfDeath

    HarlequinOfDeath Tha Taskmastaaa
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2017
    Messages:
    785
    Likes Received:
    750
  5. Rubberpiggy

    Rubberpiggy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2018
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    72
  6. reaper1714

    reaper1714 Annoying genocidal machine

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    71
    I marvel at the simplicity (and effectiveness) of such lists... and admire the people who create them. Mines are usually a potpourri of units resulting of the different strategies I want to bring to the table "just in case".
     
  7. HarlequinOfDeath

    HarlequinOfDeath Tha Taskmastaaa
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2017
    Messages:
    785
    Likes Received:
    750
    Lists are tricky. Their success depends on many things: Are you familiar with the lists and do they fit your playstyle? And sometimes you need a bit of luck.

    Karolis' list is 'simple', but not that simple. He has some great tools:

    - Redundancy: If you loose one TR drone you have another option. If you use both, you still have the Intruder. And because of the drones you don't have to risk the Intruder in first place.
    - With the Clockmaker/Zoe and many ZondBots your enemy will probably need many orders to get rid of the drones.
    - Board Control: 5 ARO pieces with Flash Pulse and HMG, as well as Crazy Koalas and Repeaters (ready at the first player turn, you don't need to place them first) make it for your opponent very hard to advance.
    - The good old MSV+Smoke trick.
    - Hacking and Repeaters to stop HIs (even Fireteams) and TAGs.
    - Mobility: Everything is highly mobile.

    The lists were for the last Interplanetario with many killing missions. I prefer to use some Morlocks and a Daktari instead of some of the Jaguars, but that depends on playstyle. Still these lists are good for objective scoring as well.
     
    #47 HarlequinOfDeath, Feb 8, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2018
    T. Rex Pushups likes this.
  8. natetehaggresar

    natetehaggresar Backlogged Painter

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2017
    Messages:
    300
    Likes Received:
    522
    Fwiw I have a really hard time justifying sin eaters.

    Full swc for a weapon when it's burst 1 when YOU want to use it is really steep.

    I feel like N3 has done a lot to devalue then, as has been discussed, support ware helps close the gap on tr bots.

    I also believe the new suppression fire does a lot to devalue him. Now nearly anyone can be a ghetto sin eaters.

    Yes both alternatives cost orders to use, but cheaper models allow you to field more guys to generate orders.

    I want to use him, but I can never bring myself to field him anymore, which is sad, conceptually they're one of my favorite units. They just cost too much!
     
  9. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Morlock trainer
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    564
    Likes Received:
    841
    Well, I was actually playing Vanilla on that tournament (and in total four times) since you definitely had to face Le Muet, an Intruder and a Spectr too. :stuck_out_tongue: And if I recall it right it was also Le Muet and the Intruder in Suppression Fire who were dealing most of the ARO damage. The Sin-Eater got killed by your Riot Grrls...

    My overall experience is you have a fine troop able to control or deny various parts of the table during the game forcing the opponent to spend orders in avoiding or killing that troop and the Sin-Eater. He'll never be as effective as the Reaktion Zond:
    1. he can never shoot at more than one target
    2. after he's healed (so he was lucky not to be insta-killed by shock) he'll cost extra orders in order to avoid more than one ARO just for standing up
    3. also he's not really able to get into a new (maybe better) position during the Game
    4. Knauf, Speznaz and REMs with Assisted Fire are real threats for him
     
  10. HarlequinOfDeath

    HarlequinOfDeath Tha Taskmastaaa
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2017
    Messages:
    785
    Likes Received:
    750
    Ah, I remember that Le Muet and that heal. ;) But nevermind was a close match anyway.

    So you agree with the Sin-Eater being subpar compared to the TR drone. Do you still use him and if, under which circumstances?
     
  11. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Morlock trainer
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    564
    Likes Received:
    841
    Briefly said: Yes.
    And no, as far as I remember I used him once again last year in april at a tournament (Supplies aginst Nomads and Deadly Dance against a double TAG Tohaa list).
    [​IMG] Nutze den TAG <-- classic german pun since that means "seize the day" as well as "seize the TAG" ;)
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    [​IMG] MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    [​IMG] MODERATOR Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 10)
    [​IMG] MODERATOR Spitfire / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 15)
    [​IMG] MODERATOR Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 11)
    [​IMG] MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    [​IMG] MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    [​IMG] MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] REVEREND CUSTODIER Hacker (Hacking Device Plus) Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] ZERO Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 24)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]6 [​IMG]2 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] TRANSDUCTOR ZOND Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] SALYUT Hacker (EVO Hacking Device) Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 25)
    [​IMG] SIN-EATER HMG / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 33)
    [​IMG] WARCOR (Aerocam) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] ZERO (Deployable Repeater) Combi Rifle, E/Mauler / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 19)
    [​IMG] ZOE & PI-WELL . (0 | 47)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] ZOE (Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Stop!) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 28)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] PI-WELL Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 19)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
    I don't exactly know why I chose him but I think I had the points and SWC left. The only thing I remember of him was seeing him die due to an ARO whilst I tried to relocate him during the battle against the Tohaa (which I still won 6:0).
     
    #51 Tristan228, Feb 9, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
  12. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    2,113
    Likes Received:
    2,135
    If a concept in a game is really strong, having the strongest version of that is often extra pricey. Like the Cutter costs a lot more than the skills it gets over the Lizard because of how powerful TO is. If TO slowly dropped in usefulness the price difference would need ti be tweaked.

    If the game is moving away from ARO lockdowns being a common tactic the downsides/cost of the Sin Eater might need retouching.

    I don't know that is the case but that is a thing that happens.

    Edit: phone tricked me in to posting half way through so I needed to finish in edit.
     
  13. Tom McTrouble

    Tom McTrouble Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2018
    Messages:
    545
    Likes Received:
    536
    So while ultimately I do agree that the Reaktion is way more effective/viable, we no one has mentioned that one of the legs up the the Sin Eater has is that it doesn't have a bad range band since it comes with a pistol. Just something to think about.

    Wow I forgot this list actually packed in 18 orders. I won my last local tournament with a variant on this at that clocked in at 15 trading out salyuts/algauciles/warcor for 2 zeroes. For the life of me I could never understand why he had the morans in two different groups though.
     
    reaper1714 likes this.