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Discussion in 'ALEPH' started by TaHu, Sep 15, 2018.

  1. Devil_Tiger

    Devil_Tiger Your Friendly Neighborhood Asura

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    So what you're saying is that the Rudra can replace the trooper with the Fireteam: Haris trait?
     
  2. paraelix

    paraelix Well-Known Member

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    That would invalidate the Fireteam - because a Haris team needs a model with Fireteam Haris in order to be formed. No, I am saying that a Rudras can replace either of the Yadu or the Deva/Asura in the Special Haris link. Note, there is no reason to replace the non-Yadu in the Special Haris, because then it is just a standard Yadu Haris.

    My second point was that the Special Haris teams specify 2 Yadu/1Deva, 2 Yadu/1 Asura, or 2 Deva/1Asura. However, it does not specify which of these models needs to have the Fireteam Haris skill. Ergo;
    Asura with FT:Haris
    Yadu
    Yadu

    Deva
    Yadu Haris
    Yadu

    Deva Haris
    Yadu
    Yadu

    These are all valid because it doesn't tell you which model needs to have the skill. So when you then add model replacement into the equation;
    Asura Haris
    Samekh
    Rudras

    This is a valid Yadu Special Haris.
     
    Arlic and Devil_Tiger like this.
  3. Devil_Tiger

    Devil_Tiger Your Friendly Neighborhood Asura

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    Okay, that make sense! It's a bit finicky i think but heh i guess that work, i'm a bit worried that it will cause trouble to peoples though.

    As a sidenote i kinda feel like what Yadu are missing would be cheap core fillers (like the Samekh FTO) to reduce the price of a Yadu core to something useable. Would have been nice if you could sneak a Danavas, a Shukra or a Sophotect in a Yadu core.

    EDIT:

    To stay on topic here's a list i recently used:


    [​IMG] Waifu Strikes Back
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] ASURA Lieutenant L2 Hacker (Hacking Device Plus UPGRADE: Redrum) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (0.5 | 78)
    [​IMG] YADU (Fireteam: Haris) MULTI Rifle, E/Marat, Drop Bears (Throwing Weapon) / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 37)
    [​IMG] YADU (NCO) Combi Rifle, E/Marat, HMG / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (2 | 41)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.2 MULTI Sniper Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 24)
    [​IMG] ZAYIN Rebot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    [​IMG] DART Submachine Gun, Viral Tactical Bow, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 34)
    [​IMG] GARUDA Tacbot Boarding Shotgun / Electric Pulse. (0 | 21)
    [​IMG] LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Was playing 20x20, played against Morat, went pretty well
     
  4. deltakilo

    deltakilo Bear of Butcher bay
    Warcor

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    This is the list im pretty keen on, main thing i can see potentially getting replaced is the sophotect, but we will see. I like having all my bases covered.

    [​IMG] Operations Subsection of the S.S.S.
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] SHUKRA Lieutenant (Strategos L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 14)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.2 MULTI Sniper Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 24)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 21)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot MULTI Sniper Rifle / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] CSU (Specialist Operative) Rifle + Light Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] SOPHOTECT Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]5 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] NAGA Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    [​IMG] ZAYIN Rebot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    [​IMG] LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] DANAVAS Hacker (Hacking Device Plus. UPGRADE: Maestro) Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 25)
    [​IMG] WARCOR (Aerocam) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  5. TaHu

    TaHu Well-Known Member

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    Are you okay with asura Lt2 in harris because you are wasting her 2 orders or command points, I suppose you break it as soon as it goes to DUO but still... Also I think Shukra CoC is must have with Asura Lt.
     
  6. UnderDarkLord

    UnderDarkLord Member

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    I mean, I don't particularly like Devas, but especially Devas in a link with the Asura, when the Yadus are available, who can run the NCO option to USE those command tokens. The AHD Deva is cool, and the Spitfire and Sensor always have their uses, but for example, I'm not going to buy a Devabot box just so I can perhaps very rarely use a Deva + Bot (sad, because one of the things I slobber over when looking at PanO are auxilia). I'm most likely to run a Deva solo, or in a DUO with a CSU. But I do prefer the LT2 for the example modification I provided, just because it doesn't take much to break the link, and when it does, I figure the more orders available to the Asura, the more survivable it is (at minimum), or the more killtastic it is (ideally). Interestingly, since he had an Asura, but not as lieutenant, that's why I wanted the swap, since he didn't have Shukra: it's just more survivable than a Deva LT in that same link, so may as well have the least likely to die miniature as your LT if you don't have CoC. Personally I'm finding the Shukra a little expensive to fit into lists, but I agree that if you have a Rambo LT, you're best off with it.
     
  7. paraelix

    paraelix Well-Known Member

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    Who can't currently make use of unreleased rules so the argument, at this moment, is invalid? :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
     
  8. Devil_Tiger

    Devil_Tiger Your Friendly Neighborhood Asura

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    If i do a Haris with a Lt L2 i put a NCO Yadu in it to use the Lt orders on the HMG. I'd only do that with the Hacker Lt L2 though, that seem kinda redundant/wasetful on a Spitfire Lt which i think would work better as a solo midfield huntress.

    Buuut i might be wrong, i'm just a pleb who's happy he can finally use the Asura without shooting himself in the foot (If i want to do that i can take a Marut in OS, i still love muh giant bunny girl cosplaying as Kali, smoke or not.)
     
  9. Cartographer

    Cartographer Well-Known Member

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    Given the lack of clarity so far, I'd be hesitant to run this one.
    I take the meaning of "can join any Yadu troops fireteam" to be any fireteam formed by Yadu troops, so either a Yadu core or a Haris/Duo with the Yadu with that skill forming the fireteam. Barring specific clarification, what you've written is an Asura fireteam, not a Yadu one.
     
  10. paraelix

    paraelix Well-Known Member

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    Yadu.jpg
    These are Yadu fireteams. The rest is all clarified in the "Summary of Fireteams" thread in the Rules sub-forum.
     
  11. Cartographer

    Cartographer Well-Known Member

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    I've looked and while Ian is doing a great job offering clarification where he can, he's answering the "wildcard" question not the Rudras one. I think relying on an Asura Haris counting as a "Yadu fireteam" is just asking to be disappointed down the road.
     
  12. Kelthret

    Kelthret Usuario

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    Yesterday we played a 400 points Limited Insertion tournament, and these were my lists:

    [​IMG] FW Kelthret 1
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] ASURA (Fireteam: Haris) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (2 | 71)
    [​IMG] DEVA Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 31)
    [​IMG] DEVA Lieutenant (Sensor) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24)
    [​IMG] SHAKTI Hacker (Killer Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Sucker Punch) Mk12, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 40)
    [​IMG] YADU (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] YADU (Number 2) Combi Rifle, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] YADU Heavy Rocket Launcher, Submachine Gun / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (2 | 35)
    [​IMG] RUDRA Red Fury, Mine Dispenser / Electric Pulse. (1 | 40)
    [​IMG] SOPHOTECT Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.4 HMG, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 25)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.2 Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)

    8 SWC | 398 Points

    Open in Infinity Army


    [​IMG] FW Kelthret 2
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] MARUT Lieutenant (Strategos L3) MULTI HMG, Heavy Flamethrower, Nanopulser / AP CCW. (3 | 120)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] KARKATA Flash Pulse / Knife. (0 | 0)
    [​IMG] MARUT MULTI HMG, Heavy Flamethrower, Nanopulser / AP CCW. (3 | 116)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] KARKATA Flash Pulse / Knife. (0 | 0)
    [​IMG] DEVA (Multispectral Visor L2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 33)
    [​IMG] CSU (Specialist Operative) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 21)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 15)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] NAGA Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Engineer Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    8 SWC | 399 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  13. Cartographer

    Cartographer Well-Known Member

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    'cus someone hates USARF and doesn't want them in their tournaments.
     
    eciu likes this.
  14. paraelix

    paraelix Well-Known Member

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    Well, he answered my questions directly. Which confirm what i am saying. I agree that it is a mess, and have consisteny suggested addressing the language used or creating new, standardised rules that are fully defined. I think what we have is likely what we will be stuck with until N4.
     
  15. Yog.0

    Yog.0 Member

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    Gonna try this for my first trial. Me and my mate don't really use sectorials yet, and have been playing 200 points for years. Still learning the rules, I guess :-)

    [​IMG] 200 pts New Aleph
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9
    [​IMG] YADU Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, E/Marat, Drop Bears (Throwing Weapon) / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 36)
    [​IMG] SHUKRA (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.2 Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] NAGA MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] DEVA Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 31)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)

    2.5 SWC | 200 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  16. UnderDarkLord

    UnderDarkLord Member

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    I mean, I don't even have the Colfront models yet, let alone the HMG NCO Yadu, who I probably won't proxy, since I'll most likely want at least Shakti or a regular Yadu, if not two other Yadus, in the same link. I'm unlikely to play any ALEPH until I get my hands on the new releases, and some of the spoiled future releases. In the meantime I'll probably play some vanilla with the Coldfront minis, assuming I can get them painted sometime before Beyond: Coldfront, Dakini SWC box, or more, gets released, which isn't likely as now that fall's around the corner I'm getting busier. At this point I'm just crossing my fingers, hoping that we don't have to wait until next fall for the Yadus SWC box, or whatever product will end up with the Yadu HRL, NCO HMG, and possibly a Combi rifle armed Yadu. I really want to play with those honorary HI. Will I use more Devas in the mean time? Maybe. Maybe I'll stubbornly wait for the resculpts I want (Asura Spitfire springs to mind, the size of the current ones are off-putting to me), and the Arjuna, while preparing to play ALEPH, but continuing to use YuJing/JSA instead.
     
  17. DukeofEarl

    DukeofEarl Well-Known Member

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    Playing around with a more Yadu focused list instead of the Daikinis I was drawn to at first.
    This one would start as a core with the HRL, Samekh, HMG, Rudra and Shakti, but then could be broken out into a 3 man core ARO base and a Haris with the Asura and Shakti for moving up. Ideally you would be able to move the core to get the 2 for the Haris to drop out and only spend 1 Command Token.
    Option would be double HRLs, drop the HMG, and upgrade a netrod to another Lamedh


    [​IMG] Operations Subsection of the S.S.S.
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] YADU Heavy Rocket Launcher, Submachine Gun / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (2 | 35)
    [​IMG] Rebot SAMEKH FTO Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 22)
    [​IMG] YADU (NCO) HMG / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (2 | 41)
    [​IMG] ASURA Lieutenant L2 Hacker (Hacking Device Plus UPGRADE: Redrum) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (0.5 | 78)
    [​IMG] RUDRA K1 Marksman Rifle, Mine Dispenser / Electric Pulse. (0 | 42)
    [​IMG] SHAKTI Hacker (Killer Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Sucker Punch) Mk12, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 40)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    6 SWC | 300 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
    UnderDarkLord likes this.
  18. Plex

    Plex Umbra Solitudinarian

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    I'm liking this idea.

    [​IMG] How do Yadu
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Engineer Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] SHAKTI Hacker (Killer Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Sucker Punch) Mk12, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 40)
    [​IMG] YADU Heavy Rocket Launcher, Submachine Gun / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (2 | 35)
    [​IMG] DEVA Lieutenant (Sensor) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24)
    [​IMG] YADU (NCO) HMG / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (2 | 41)
    [​IMG] YADU (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] YADU (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] YADU (Number 2) Combi Rifle, E/Marat / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] RUDRA MULTI Rifle, Mine Dispenser / Electric Pulse. (0 | 39)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)

    4 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
    DukeofEarl likes this.
  19. Insane Cheese

    Insane Cheese Member

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    Using Coldfront and a few Aleph minis I already have. Got a couple of link options, maybe not enough specialists.

    [​IMG] Derperations SubSection──────────────────────────────────────────────────GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)[​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)[​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)[​IMG] CSU (Specialist Operative) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)[​IMG] DEVA (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24)[​IMG] NAGA MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 34)[​IMG] SOPHOTECT Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)[​IMG] SHUKRA Lieutenant (Strategos L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)[​IMG] YADU MULTI Rifle, E/Marat, Drop Bears (Throwing Weapon) / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 36)[​IMG] GARUDA Tacbot Spitfire / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 28)GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)[​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)[​IMG] DANAVAS Hacker (Assault Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Icebreaker) Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 23)[​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)[​IMG] PROXY Mk.4 HMG, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 25) 5.5 SWC | 300 PointsOpen in Infinity Army
     
  20. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
    Warcor

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    First attempt at anything resembling a Horde list:

    [​IMG] Operations Subsection of the S.S.S.
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] DEVA Lieutenant (Sensor) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24)
    [​IMG] CSU (Specialist Operative) Rifle + Light Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    [​IMG] DEVA (Multispectral Visor L2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 33)
    [​IMG] CSU (Specialist Operative) Rifle + Light Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot MULTI Sniper Rifle / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 21)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 15)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] DAKINI Tacbot Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] APSARA (G: Jumper Level Z) Submachine Gun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]6 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] DALETH Rebot Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 17)
    [​IMG] LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] PROBOT Hacker (EVO Hacking Device) Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 25)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.1 Engineer Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.3 Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 21)
    [​IMG] PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] NETROD . (0 | 4)
    [​IMG] WARCOR (Aerocam) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    6 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Possible tweaks: Exchanging Dakini MSR for Samekh FTO, or Mk.3 for Mk.4 HRL
     
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