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Remotes in Escalation league

Discussion in 'ITS' started by Vanderbane, Mar 9, 2019.

  1. Vanderbane

    Vanderbane Well-Known Member

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    I have seen differing opinions on this - hoping someone can point me in the right direction.

    In escalation leagues, you can not use advanced rules until round 4. Can you take remotes, or is that considered part of the hacking rules? If not, what do you do for onyx and oss?
     
  2. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

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    You can take REMs, and doing so requires the inclusion of a model with a hacking device (or a TAG). You just can’t use the actual hacking program rules.
     
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  3. Vanderbane

    Vanderbane Well-Known Member

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    That was my reading as well, but I have heard alternative opinions. Can you point me to any ruling on this? Or I can go with "because @toadchild said so."
     
  4. toadchild

    toadchild EI Aspect

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    I don’t have anything explicit to point you to, sorry. Just the same stuff you already read.

    From Troop Types:
    http://infinitythewiki.com/en/Troop_Types
    Remotes are semi-autonomous support units, usually lightly armored but extremely mobile and versatile. Your Army List must include a Hacker or a TAG to include Remotes.

    That’s a basic rule, not an advanced rule. But that means that hacking devices exist, even if you aren’t allowed to use the advanced rules necessary to activate them.
     
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  5. solkan

    solkan Well-Known Member

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    In one of the previous threads where this was discussed, there were two options:
    1. You either ignore the requirement to include a hacker, because hackers don't exist yet.
    2. You ignore the things that hackers can do that don't exist yet (hacking).

    For the de facto third option, you've got Operation: Coldfront.

    Operation:Coldfront has the Aleph forces using three Dakini Tacbot (S2 Remotes) vs. three Line Kazaks as the basic "My grunts shoot at your aunts" starting point. Now, there is a Deva Functionary (and WarCor model, if you're not splitting the box) in the Coldfront box. So the models supplied are a legal force eventually either way.

    The rules for Remotes aren't introduced until Mission 9 (the end of the Beyond missions) (The effects of G:Remote Presence are explained in the paragraph before the one I'm quoting):
    Troop Type: Remote (N3 p23) Remotes suffer a -3 MOD when performing Dodge, or equivalent Skills such as Change Facing or Engage. In addition, Remotes cannot use the Cautious Movement Common Skill.​
    and completely omits any reference to TAGs or Hackers.

    For Onyx, particularly if you're using the Combined Army starter box, you've got a similar situation--you've got two models that can be the hacker needed for the remotes.

    Disclaimer: As demonstrated by the FAQ, having a hacking device of any kind makes that profile a Hacker (which is the same as saying it has the Hacker skill). The Hacking skill is in the main rules section, even though Hacking (and the hacking device rules) are in the Advanced rules sections. But that probably sounds like silly legalize to some people.

    What it really comes down to this is this: A player goes out and buys Operation:Coldfront, the current Combined Army starter box, or the old Aleph starter box that had the old sculpts of the Dakini Tacbots in it. Who is going to be foolish enough to run an Escalation tournament and tell a person who bought one of the starter boxes that they can't use their line infantry?