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ODD/TO and USAriadna

Discussion in 'Ariadna' started by Cry of the Wind, Jan 10, 2018.

  1. Káosz Brigodéros

    Káosz Brigodéros Vanguard, Inc.

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    OK That explains why you have problems with this list. I understand you are playing on a fairly dense table and your opponent makes a good use of the terrain. (Just to make sure: to obtain the fireteam bonus only the trooper firing at the target mas to be in LoF to the target. The rest of the fireteam should be in total cover.)
    In case you shoot with a HMG Grunt that is part of the fireteam you are rolling 5 dice that hits on 8s (+3 range, +3 fireteam bonus, -6 ODD and -3 cover) in case you are firing in the 24-32 range. (SMG shoots back a single dice with -3 for range and -3 for cover breaking SF...) In case you are firing in the 16-24 range your opponent will shoot back with no range penalty (thanks to X-visor) and a burst of 3, in addition giving you an additional negative modifier of 3 for SF. That means you are rolling 5 dice for 5s and your opponent is rolling 3 dice hitting on 9s (BS12 and -3 for cover). Not a good idea, indeed.
    In this case (dense terrain, Ryukens covering a limited area) you should try moving your DTW wielding troopers close enough to fire at the Ryukens. DTWs do not care for ODD or cover and give a pretty high chance of killing your enemy. (ARM2 1W toopers has a pretty high chance going down.) Fire templates are the best for pretty obvious reasons. Due to dense terrain you should be able to maneuver your troopers upfields without provoking AROs, but in case your opponents successfully locks down every paths you should try using smoke. Desperados and Mavericks has smoke LGL. Try laying down smoke unopposed and move your troopers in this cover upfields. Keep in mind however that Rui Shi has MSV2 - I recommend taking this REM out first. A fireteam's HMG should make short work of this REM, because no ODD whatsoever to protect it.
    Granted chances are pretty high the agressor will not survive the strike against the Ryuken (unless you are attacking from the back) but if you are sacrificing a low points (e. g. a 10 points Grunt) trooper you should consider this a good deal.
    I hope this helps.
     
    #81 Káosz Brigodéros, Apr 9, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2018
    Cry of the Wind likes this.
  2. Káosz Brigodéros

    Káosz Brigodéros Vanguard, Inc.

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    Victory comes at a price. If you kill one Ryuken sacrificing a Grunt I would call this a bargain.
    In case the mission is a covert action one, you can try smoking the Ryukens blind and convcentrating on pushing the buttons ignoring the Ryukens (and killing your opponent's specialists). If the mission is a direct action one, killing a 24-points trooper at the price of a 10-points trooper is a gain on its own power.
     
    #82 Káosz Brigodéros, Apr 9, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2018
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  3. Káosz Brigodéros

    Káosz Brigodéros Vanguard, Inc.

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    I understand your main problems stem from the Ryukens. Am I right?
    One (two) more thing that comse to my mind: Instead of traditional North&South approach, you could try East&South moving the HMG trooper upfield near to the sideline and shooting across the table laterally. And you are not obliged to deploy your troopers at the edge of your DZ (in case your opponent is using ninjas this is not recommended at all); your own DZ can give you 12' more range.
     
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  4. Cry of the Wind

    Cry of the Wind Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the input Káosz Brigodéros. I'll be testing out an HMG grunt link in the near future with Rosie for fun and see how it goes. My issue with link teams is making sure they are either hidden or providing useful AROs, which tends to leave at least one model vulnerable (half the time to some TO guy grrr). I agree that a flamer grunt for a Ryuken would be a great trade, I think my HMG/Rosie link will be considered expendable in the attempt to get Rosie to something while moving flamers into good trading positions. This is a semi new strategy for me so that is probably why I'm struggling with the application.
     
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  5. Káosz Brigodéros

    Káosz Brigodéros Vanguard, Inc.

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    De nada.
    Grunt links come in two flavours. Sniper-heavy for ARO duties and HMG-heavy for active-turn goodness.
    You can reform the fireteam using a command token, so you can switch back and forth between the two modes. Many players field 7 Grunts in the same group. 2 HMGs, 2 snipers and 3 HFT fillers (alternatively you can include specialists or most recently Rosie). During your opponent's turn you hide everyone in total cover except for the snipers and form a fireteam consisting of the snipers and three other guys. During performing their duty chances are high your snipers will die. At the beginning of your turn you reform the fireteam to include the HMG guys, and then you advance them forward preferabyl with move-shoot orders. Snipers are either left behind or you can get them back into the fireteam through reforming the fireteam again. Preferably put the HMG guys in suppressive fire (and in cover) afterwards.
    Enjoy!
     
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  6. Cry of the Wind

    Cry of the Wind Well-Known Member

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    Never thought to use a larger than 5 fire team to maintain bonus after the AROs inevitably die. I've seen people post about it before but forget how cheap heavy flamer grunts are (plus they are good cheerleaders till really needed on T2-3). Thanks again for some more food for thought!
     
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  7. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Well... To nitpick, you aren't using Fireteams that are larger than 5 ppl since it's impossible... But you can keep replacements.
     
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  8. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    I'll sometimes run a group that's 9 Grunts and the UKR, with the goal of keeping snipers up and at full ARO bonuses for maximum zoning.
     
  9. Káosz Brigodéros

    Káosz Brigodéros Vanguard, Inc.

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    Thank you for clearing this!
    So you field 7 grunts. Say 2 HMG guys, 2 snipers and 3 HFT guys. During deployment (assuming you go second) you form a 5-man fireteam consisting of the 2 snipers and the 3 HFT guys. Let's assume one of the snipers dies during your opponents turn! At the beginning your turn you reform the fireteam to include the 3 HFT guys and the 2 HMG guys. The sniper is left behind and the fireteam will go hunting.
    Fireteams consist of a maximum of 5 man.
    Keep in mind however that you can only organize a fireteam consisting of troopers belonging to the same group!
    PS B2 Heavy Flamethrowers on an ARM3 platform that has shock immunity is a very, very nasty short-range ARO piece.
     
  10. Mc_Clane

    Mc_Clane Zhànzhēng bùzhǎng
    Warcor

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    • DogWarriors, smoke, superjump, CC
    • Smoke to get into reach and Flamethrowers
    • Coordinate to get into reach and direct templates
    • Smoke+intuitive shots
    • Especulative fire, Grenades with High Physics
    • Force the breaking of the suppresive. somehow. Shooting from the back or outside the 24 inches (paratroopers, Multi visors from long range... like marauders, preferable with high burst)
    Of course the marut or any other MSV 2 or higher will complicate things for you. Because smoke doesn't work... so, try to play with the sceno and make cautious movements.

    I know it's kind of tricky, and seems unfair, but you'll probably have more orthers than him. Try to take all the juice from them
     
    #90 Mc_Clane, Apr 13, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2018