I think someone already mentioned this on another thread, but compare that Sombra to a Daofei or Zhencha. What it gets for that price is absolutely insane by N3 standards, especially considering it isn't even Hackable.
plus the entire ruleset is different and power is measured differently e.g. with crit rework making armor and bts more valuable by default.. it's false equivalence
good thing it's only playable in n4 then... bostria said during the interplanetario stream that points costs are lower overall in n4 (because there is a 15 unit limit now meaning the bottle-neck is shifted for list building)
I know, but N3 standards are all we have to go by here, plus the Daofei is one of the only units we know a provisional points cost for- 55, judging by the CG batrep, so it is actually a good point of comparison. The Sombra's expensive on a per-unit basis and certainly isn't for everyone or every list, but it's probably the highest-quality midfielder we've ever seen in the game so far and its point cost is actually very modest for that kind of ability.
Thanks. What I haven't seen discussed till now is the downside of the new crits mechanic (maybe it was, I surely haven't read every single post). Yes, everyone is cheering "Crits are less lethal, wohoo, we have a chance now." but is this the case? After having played a last game of N3 and rolling the new Crit-Rule just for fun (not using it, just rolling it, when a crit occured) I can say that for "normal"-ARM units it's not less lethal and could possible be the bane of the new 1W+NWI troops. Suddenly you can't tank a crit and move on with 100% certainty. Maybe you still die from one Crit. Same for HI. Yes ARM is worth more, but most units have pretty few ARM. You can do the maths yourself, how good your chances are to tank 2 hits and live and how good your chances are to take two hits and die, despite having 1W+NWI or even 2W. During our game, the new Crits rule would'nt have changed a single thing. So For 1W+NWI troops the new Crit rule is a lot more lethal than the old one, making 1W+NWI less valuable. Just some thoughts...
I remember someone doing the maths somewhere, apparently ARM4 is the breakpoint where N4crits are less dangerous than N3crits to multi-wounders. ARM3 was about even. TAGs benefit a bunch, things like Noctifers and Warbands suffer- which was probably the goal. Low-ARM, high wound trading units have been doing very well for a long time, while high-ARM units aren't worth their price in almost any scenario.
The only thing that can salvage Shock at this point is to change how it works somehow. Fire Ammo vs non Shock immune or something. The way it makes both Dogged and NWI potentially worthless combined with how abundant Shock is in the game, N3 Shock basically needs to die. Shock can't remain straight up *negates Dogged and NWI* if you want to have NWI without Shock immunity in the game and want a pricetag on it. Wildcats vs new Nomad troops make it jarring how bad those Wildcats are priced. C+ Engineer AP Spitfires with Tinbots should flat out not exist on the same Profile ever. If Guard works like it appears to work, RIP CC troops vs competent Guard. With N3 MA levels a Shikami approaching Andromeda eats a CC23 hit and can only BS Attack at -9 against that. The counters to CC are Berserk, DTWs, Mines, Perimeter and sheer lack of efficiency. Guard didn't need to counter CC troops on top of that. N4 was always going to have powercreep across the board compared to N3. TAGs and HI getting cheaper just does that.
But they know, man, they KNOW! That tiny amount of information from profiles, plus the tiny amount of rules we have from N4, mean they can make sweeping generalizations about NR and be *right*.
It's amazing to me that we have seen rules that: 1. make jammers less effective 2. making hacking more useful 3. reduce the spikiness of crits (something I argued against on the basis that it would increase power of big guys and better players) 4. allow shooting through smoke for a broad swath of units 5. expanded availability of dtws 6. active turn dodge-moving 7. new uses for command tokens 8. limitations on super jump 9. improvements in the ability to get cover And somehow we know enough about how N4 will play to draw conclusions about what will be powerful. There's a word for that and it's not extrapolation, it's hubris.
Have people noticed that a lot of the new units have forward deployment versus infiltration? It makes me think that Infiltration will get better: From one of the videos it was confirmed that you can over-infiltrate into the enemy's half in N4. It already looks like they have been changing Roll-3 to just Roll. I would not be surprised if over-infiltration becomes a straight PH roll. That certainly would help differentiate FD and Infiltration.
Hot take: Infiltration rolls are hot garbage and need to die in a fire. I'd much rather have Forward Deployment >12" than Superior Infiltration with a roll that can fail.
I totally understand that POV. I am not a gambler and understand that guarantee can be more valued than a chance. But it looks like CB is trying to promote people to take more risks for dynamic gameplay. By design, it looks like they want more use of AD and Infiltration rolls. They want more mobility on the battlefield (easier for units to get cover, easier for bigger bases to maneuver, active turn dodge can sometimes provide extra movement, more climbing plus and super jump). This makes me feel like the battlefield will be much different in N4.
Yes, sure, I'll take that Infiltration roll at 60-65% which means 35-40% of the time I'll be just losing a skill. On second thought, I think I won't (unless I'm playing just for laughs, which I do most of the time)
I'd give more reliable Infiltration a whirl. I'd have to bring two or three to be sure, but getting one mid-level trooper exactly where you want it is very powerful.
In N3 you're not just losing the Skill. You get less than normal deployment and start without Marker State if you have one. Nevermind the 35-80% for Infiltration rolls, the massive difference on fail vs success is not a good mechanic under any circumstances.
