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[MILITARY ORDERS TACTICS] Quo Peregrinatur Grex Pastor Secum ["300pts Box" WiP 06/04/19]

Discussion in 'PanOceania' started by eciu, Jan 8, 2018.

  1. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    [​IMG]
    Hello here is my (obviously subjective) review and tactic written for Military Orders. It's still work in progress so expect some more additions to it in following days/weeks. All critique and comments are welcome :)

    DISCLAIMER
    UGH 3rd Offensive Update was …. sad. MO got some nice toys (Santiago KHD, Dart, Tikbalang) but the small details (removal of Fusiliers) just broke the back of list building in MO. It shifted hard the sectorial into single combat group, while also removing most competetive and strongest link (Hospitallers+Magisters) while not solving main problem of MO (leaving DZ). Enjoy your cheapest LT at 34pts 1SWC and he’s obvious identity (MO now cannot hide it’s Lt it’s as good as open info). In a wake of all new factions (Ramath, Shasvastii, Dashat etc.) MO CC approach look pathetic (suddenly every faction have strong dedicated CC unit which MO cannot compete with). If you like the fluff/premise/models go and play MO, but if you are looking for competetive faction go look elsewhere (as competitive players will grief you with their TAK/Tunguska/VIRD/OSS).


    Changelog:
    06.04.2019 - Update for 3rdO. Boy that was a mixed bag of changes ......
    08.07.2018 - Finally added description of Magister Knights. Next planned thing is more of direct MO strategies and gameplay examples and tips. Explaining MO approach towards CC and "flexible hammer&anvil" tactic.
    29.06.2018 - Added spoilers tags to unit description to make everything more readable. Added proper disclaimer to MO as it is half-cooked sectorial with a lot of limitations. Players beware.
    10.02.2018 - Added part about incoming CB 300 pts Military Orders Box
    29.01.2018 - Added reviews of KotHS, Teutonic Knight and Seraph. This is "rant" update, sorry ;(

    If someone knows relevant code/api explanation of BB code version which this forum uses drop me PM as it is really tidious to work with it (edditing in internal BB editor), and I would love to make some internal links/references etc (the way it should be done). And this wall of text relaly need table of content ;/

    This is material is released under "Prayware" license, so I accept everything thrown my way via rosary or EFotRR :)


    Main strengths and weaknesses

    Strengths:

    • Broad selection of various HI (even if some of them are lacking defined role/niche)

    • AVA TOTAL on TO units (LI only though, for some reason Swiss laity is not welcomed in MO ;/)

    • Good special Characters (Joan, Konstantinos, de Fersen)

    • TOFOOS, TO MSR with infiltration

    • Some agility in link building, you can relatively freely mix some HI and LI (FK/Santiago with Order Sergeants/Black Friars)

    • MO has access to 2 quite unique, yet agile TAGs (even if MO version of Tikbalang is overpriced)

    • You can make a full HI list (true HI not IA pretenders ;P)

    • Has access to one (if not the) of the best TAGs (Tikbalang) and skirmishers (Dart), but ….
    Weaknesses:

    • … they cannot be used to their full potential due to MO order economy issues

    • AVA1 Fugazi makes it really hard to play against mass camo, no additional sensor also hurts

    • Limited cheap orders (line infantry costs 13 pts)

    • Few overlapping units (Teuton,FK, Santiago)

    • No reliable ways of getting into CC

    • Very obvious Lieutenant (to a level it’s almost open info, usually you won’t have more than a 1 possible Lt unit on field)

    • Expensive line infantry

    • Very weak defensive capabilities (no dedicated ARO pieces, AVA1 Fugazi, no minelayer)

    • No way of getting HD with SS2

    • No fire-superiority unit (equivalent of Swiss, Hac Tao, Kriza, Tarik)

    • Teutons are still obsolete


    Military Orders are a bit of a odd sectorial. They offer broad selection of HI (even if some profiles are bit redundant) which could make even Yu-Jing jealous, quite broad access to Auxbots (better than NCA from where they come from, but still more limited than Aleph), total availability of TO units (Specialist Order Sergeant). For those feats MO pays with complete lack of good way to leverage their CC actively (no smoke, no camo on CC knights), no knives on knights (to silently and safely remove repeaters) combined with typical PanO weaknesses (no WB, cheap camo, toolbox units, asymmetric trade), expensive BS skill.

    Military Orders excel in direct combat, as even with its weaknesses Fireteam of Hospitaller Knights supported by Magisters is one of most durable fireteams in the game. Good doctor (with excellent gun - Multi Rifle) who is always close to wounded fellow members, accompanied by HMG, and 3 “disposable” decent cc combatants (Magister Knights), equipped with template weapons (Light Shotguns), hard hitting Panzerfausts and ability to dodge most incoming attacks (Hyperdynamics).

    3rd Offensive removed this excellent link option. Since now you can only form Santiago+Magisters, pure Magister link, Magisters with single Order Sergeant or Teutons+Magister link (why would you do that ?).


    Military Orders do require careful play and good planning when fighting against “tricky” factions (factions using asymmetric warfare, multiple stacking-synergising units) as it’s tools/solutions are quite limited if player looks for something else than shooting through the problem. If HI link is being used it might be easy to “bait” main MO forces into either a trap or a place on battlefield where they are less effective and problematic for opponent.


    One of the MO weaknesses is very obvious identity of its Lieutenant. It means that knight must be LT ). You usually won’t field more than a single model which can be Lt profile (unless taking several Santiago Spitfires).


    3rd Offenisve made several changes to MO, biggest one being removal of Fusiliers. It has twofold result. First one is a strong change of MO gameplay into Limited Insertion (single combat group) gameplay, due to a lack of cheap orders (Order Sergeants are extremely expensive LI). Second result is a hard shift of MO Lieutenant options to HI Knights only. This also affect order economy, as cheapest LT in MO costs now either 34pts 1 SWC or 35pts, which in turn usually mean he (LT) will be part of the link team which would like to advance mid-field (most dangerous place), which in turn very oftern require investment in CoC (which in case of MO is very expensive clocking at 52 pts at least).


    Second big change was a removal of excellent Hospitallers + Magister link. MO lost it’s best tool to leave their DZ, without getting other tools on similar power (new MO Tikbalang might be a second best option to leave DZ while being very expensive).
     
    #1 eciu, Jan 8, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
    vicen85, andre61, mrstream and 6 others like this.
  2. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Unit and profile breakdown

    Also known as: how I’ve stopped worrying about HI and embraced 220 pts fireteam of Doom

    [​IMG]

    Order Sergeants
    Ok, this one will be long. Sit comfortable we are going for a long ride. This unit has so many different options that I will have to go one by one for most of them as their capabilities differ vastly depending on their equipment and weapons.


    First, primary stuff. Order sergeants are basically fusiliers who joined one of the Military Orders and received some additional training and general goal/purpose in life (other than consumption). This is presented in a bit higher WIP (theology is not an easy thing you know, neither is mystery of Trinity), religious skill (they are stupid brave and will stand firm if shoot at) and marginally better CC skills (seems they spend more time with their knifes, or train to achieve MA level of Close Combat capabilities). They fulfill Line Infantry role in MO, being backbone for CORE link team, with access to long range/ARO MSR/HRL and active turn high burst weapon (Spitfire/Assault Pistol).

    While additional WIP is quite nice, rest of the skills is rather not very important (religious skill being an advantage and disadvantage depending on situation), and +2 CC is almost marginal increase ( Ninja will still kill you easily). For those they pay 3 additional points which unfortunately adds up quickly if you want to have 5 man link of them.


    Combi

    MSR

    Spitfire

    HRL/Assault Pistol

    Paramedic


    Basic profiles. Designed for/around CORE link team. MSR for long range/ARO duty, Spitfire for advancing. Newest addition to OS arsenal are HRL/Assault Pistol profile. HRL being one of the best cost/performence weapons (FIRE template is nasty and always has a chance of outright killing even big targets like TAGs/Achilles) for mere price of 2pts/1.5SWC. Additional bonus is Assault Pistol which is an upgraded combi rifle within 8” giving 1 additional Burst (for a total of Burst 5 in link team!). HRL/Assault Pistol combination is really nice as one is 16-32” weapon and other being better than combi within 8” (and for 8-16” you always have combis).


    Paramedic was added (yes there was a time when Order Sergeants had no own specialist for their CORE link team!) as Specialist band aid, to encourage use of Order Sergeants links by giving them option to score Specialist objectives. As this is “only” paramedic he won’t profit from increased WIP, but still is good option to have in a link (for this 35% chance of reviving downed heavy weapon friend).


    Specialist Order Sergeants:
    Ok, those guys are same as standard Order Sergeant with an exception that they can not join link teams.

    OS with an auxbot
    Upgraded and more expensive Auxilia. For 17 pts you get better BS (12) and better WIP(13), and HFT bot. Solid option as Deployment Zone guard, secondary assault piece. Unfortunately compared to Auxilia there’s no specialist option for a OS with Auxbot (probably NCA would take pope hostage if MO had even more auxbots options than them).


    OS with Hacking Device
    This one is odd duck. While WIP13 on HD is nice he is specialist sergeant meaning he cannot join link (for this useful SS2, and specialist). If you only need HD to unlock drones and some supportware don’t bother and take Fusilier HD (and have spare points for Warcor).

    OS with MSV2 Spitfire
    Nice option if you know you are going to face Steel Phalanx or Moiras. 1.5 SWC makes it quite expensive (why NWI Deva Functionaries pay only 1 SWC for their Spitfire MSV2 is beyond me). You are probably better with Black Friar now, but if you don’t have 4 pts left (BF costs at least 28 pts) and have 1.5 SWC free you can get this one.


    OS Forward Observer with Thermo-Optical Camouflage
    TOFOOS for short (Thermo Optical Forward Observer Order Sergeant). Humble hero of Military Orders. Sneaky squire who will make mad rush towards objective on turn 3, waiting all game to do so. Scalpel, and problem solver who removes blocking repeaters, people in SF etc.


    TOFOOS are main “problem solver” in MO, being LI they don’t care about being hacked, have useful specialist skill (FO), Infiltration and Hidden Deployment, anti-personal mines. Use them either as “vanguard’ for your heavy squad (HI link, Seraph, etc.) removing things like skirmishing AHD, repeaters, E-Maulers, people in SF etc.


    WIP13 is especially useful on specialist and being FO it allows to use Flash Pulse efficiently as good ARO.


    People playing first games against MO usually fear HI. Well placed TOFOOS and TO MSR usually makes them fear this LI much more than even a full HI link.

    TOMSROS
    Similar to previous entry, just trades FO skill and anti-personnel mines for MSR. Personally I never play MO lists without one. It allows of easy solving “TR drone” problems, assaulting single fire superiority targets, TAGs with or without Suppressive Fire etc.

    Don’t be picky on Infiltration combined with MSR. It’s quite good combo, as many sniper nests/towers usually are just outside DZ. Infiltration will allow you to start on top “that high building”, on tower etc. Additionally deploying sniper on one side of table allows you to pick great fire lanes which goes alongside both DZ. Shoots coming “from a side” might be a really surprise for your opponent.

    Niche skill is also to fully infiltrate sniper into enemy half of table (which is risky as will be done on 7s), but payout might be great as few people suspect that sniper might shoot their soldiers who advanced from the direction of their own DZ.

    It’s important to learn when to drop from HD to ARO. TO MSR is one of few scalpels available to MO, and showing it too early to your opponent might result in not earning it’s points.


    Always remember to try to kill/disable all enemy MSV2 (Rui Shi, Aquila, etc.) before showing TO MSR, otherwise they will probably die shortly into enemy active turn. Having to deal with TO MSR without MSV might be extremely frustrating (especially if sniper is on top of some tower) for your opponent, forcing him to waste several orders to do so.

    Heavy Rocket Launcher with Auxbot


    This guy costs 19 pts. Remember. 19pts. 19pts for double template option. Had Tohaa had its own weakness to fire ammunition it would be probably most hated profile by them. This is cheap (point wise, SWC is quite expensive) option of getting a lot of fire ammunition to table. It’s probably one of the most (if not the most) hard hitting solo piece which you can get under 20pts. In itself might be excellent tool to threaten link teams (use HFT from bot and also shoot them with HRL). Assault pistol on decent BS12 is also great way to win F2F within 8” (with an additional HFT use usually forcing enemy to dodge). Remember that fire ammunition makes some light TAGs very nervous as it not uncommon to die out to one lost F2F.


    3rd Offensive brought some changes to humble Order Sergeants. Their link can now consist of additional single Black Friar, any number of Father Knights and Santiagos (due to their Wildcard status). This results in possible option of having no Order Sergeants in Order Sergeant link team (FK/FK/Santiago/Santiago/BlackFriar). I would say that Order Sergeant link is a second main backbone of a new main schemes how to construct MO list. Usually it will consist of 2 HI (usually Santiago as they are better/cheaper than Father Knights) and Black Friar (who is excellent addition to Order Sergeants).


    Also for some reason someone at CB still hates OS/MO and it is not allowed to link HD nor MSV2 Spitfire in the link (who are unlinkable Specialist Sergeants) why it is so (when all other faction have linkable HD on LI and many of them have linkable Spitfire MSV2) is beyond me. Someone just hate those guys here.


    Order Sergeants can now join a full link of Hospitallers or Teutons. In case of hospitallers it’s almost irrelevant but can make their main link a bit cheaper (still more expensive and worse than old Hosp+Mag), while providing little additional power (excepnt for unhackable guy who can go and kill repeater while in it’s ZoC). For Teutons it adds some cheap option for specialist, and an actual long range weapon (HRL). In both cases this single Order Sergeant makes a link much more vulnurable (due to low ARM/BTS and low PH), which might be a huge problem.

    It’s worth to note that Konstantionos counts as an Order Sergeant so he actually can link with Hospitallers or Teutons links bringing them MSV2 option (with this dreaded and overcosted Combi+Assault pistol combo).

    [​IMG]
    Konstantinos
    Basically baby nisse :) Initially it was only way to get specialist into OS link. Sharing base of stats with OS with an additional equipment: MSV2 and Mimetism (with some small stats bump in PH/CC/ARM), Assault Pistol. It’s quite nice well rounded combat specialist (good “light” combat specialist). He becomes quite powerful when linked as B5 Assault Pistols are no joke. There is option for take him as infiltrator which can be quite nice in few new missions (Grid, Looting&Sabotage). If you need specialist with MSV2 take him, if you need “only” good MSV2 bruiser take Black Friar (who sports a bit better gun).


    Recently he saw drop in popularity as specialist in OS be fulfilled by paramedics, and Black Friar became “go to” option for MSV2. Mind that though that Konstantinos uniqueness still is that he fulfill both those roles at the same time.


    3rd Offensive changes allowed Black Friar to link with Order Sergeants making a Konstantinos addition to this link even more questionable decision. Black Friar is marginally cheaper, and provides many, more flexible tools that Order Sergeants lack. Specialist duty can be fulfilled by paramedic OS (or linked Santiago or Father Knight FO/AHD).

    He can though link with Hospitaller links or Teutons, giving both of them option to bring MSV2 (with overcosted Combi+Assault). Mind though that in case of Teutons he is more expensive and less resilient than a Magister Knight.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Trauma Doc & Machinist
    Standard options for PanO. Trauma Doc is a bit more redundant in MO due to access to Hospitaller Doctor. Machinist is usually also only to fix your HI who got Isolated or Immobilized. MO is not known for its broad access to drones, but sometimes coupled with TR drone it might force your opponent to spend few more orders to completely remove your drones from table. MO has also quite decent access to D-Charges (Konstantinos, Father Knight AHD), making Machinist not a single option to take it.

    3rd Offensive gave every PanO sectorial special thematic version of Machinist. ASA has Mimetism+Terrain Skill Machinist, NCA has Veteran1+Bioimmunity one, Varuna has Mimetism+Stealth+Aquatic Terrain option of Machinist.

    MO got a special name for their Machinist ^^

    [​IMG]

    Techbee
    Techbee. Quite useful specialist for 5 pts. Always consider her if you have those few points left. Slightly worse than Warcor (WIP12 vs WIP13) but having a specialist skill it allows her for easy capture of objectives located near/in your DZ. She’s also another “cheap” order generator either if you plan to use Command Token to convert her irregular order into regular when needed or you take Joan and use Inspiring Leadership to do the same. Remember that her sole presence gives your machinist and crappbo +1 WIP to rolls which are made without any other modifiers (as once in blue moon it might be useful).

    Warcor
    Mighty warcor. Most powerful unit in infinity. For 3 pts you can get 360 visor annoying sentry who can be also used as order generator. Use him to capture empty quadrans in any quadrant control missions forcing your enemy either to kill him or move any piece (which usually costs much more) to same quadrant. Bonus points are that Joan in MO can easily convert him into regular order making it cheapest order generator (Joan + Warcor + Techbee gives you 3 regular orders and “free coordinated order” for 57-58 pts!). Flash Pulse is an excellent ARO weapon with good range bands (WIP13!) and one failed BTS test will stop rampage of even mightiest of Rambos (strong singular units).

    [​IMG]

    Crusader
    Our first MI and also Airborne Deployment trooper. He does not have stellar PH needed by AD trooper (“only” 11). He’s pays quite big amount of points for his BS13, ARM/BTS 3, which are some of secondary stats for AD trooper (while mimetism/Dogged/high PH are excellent ones). One of the niche skills is that Religious might be quite useful if you manage to park him in some annoying (for your opponent) place and enter Suppressive Fire.

    He as one of few AD trooper retained access to HMG (although it might be very table dependant pick). One interesting profile is MR+LFT giving access to good DTW weapon coupled with MR which can be a threat even to some hard targets (armored HI, TAGs).

    His performance depends on your usual use and liking of AD troopers. Also remember that in contrary to Akalis Sikh Commandos he has no specialist option (and actually could use something to make him more stand out of typical AD troopers). With typical CB love towards AD models, you have 3 minis to choose from with MR+LFT being most recent (and quite nice) one.


    No changes in 3rd Offensive, still a overpriced AD (Akalis are at least cheap), in a sectorial which is already expensive.

    [​IMG]

    Black Friar
    Dominican Order, hounds of the Lord, well educated guys with connection and knack for investigations and urge to uncover what is hidden. Designed to be “anti surprise” units. Both profiles are quite different so will will split their description.

    Multi-Rifle
    Has MSV2, coupled with Albedo making it quite nice first turn assault piece if your opponent left something like Bao Troops/Atalanta on overwatch (they cannot see you when you approach and when they shoot back they get -6 mod). Drop Bears are “win more” option allowing BF to secure a bit his position when he advance or stack odds against enemy during next F2F (you shoot then the way they trigger dropbear). BF have PH12 so tossing dropbears is sudo reliable. Biovisor is a niche equipment but quite useful against Haqqislam and Shasvastii, by negating -6 modifier when trying to discover impersonation Lv1 marker, and making you immune to surprise attack/shoot from them. Nanopulser is sometimes good option to kill some WB (mind that eat unopposed chain rifle) or have an option of intuitive attack against camo markers.

    With a 3rd Offensive MultiRifle Black Friar can now link with Order Sergeant links, this turn BF to really nice and strong attack piece. Considering ITS10 rule which gives Forward Deployment L1 to all MI (BF is MI) you can already start up in mid-field and use your MultiRifle (if no long-range ARO is present anymore). His Drop Bears (if thrown they are B2) also provides some nice protection for the link. Oh and NCA got better deal than MO with their total wildcard of Albedo BF ^^.

    MSR
    Standard MSR with MSV2. Nanopulser is useful self defence tool against some camo assault units, allowing for even trade in case enemy walks into 8” of him. That’s only long range MSV2 option available to MO. Just remember he’s quite vulnerable if left as ARO piece and should rather be used as a active turn TO/ODD hunter.


    Someone must hate those guys (MSR) as for some reason they cannot link with Order Sergeants (apparently someone thinks that MO should suffer against Morlocks, Ghazis and Jaguars).

    [​IMG]

    Knight of the Holy Sepulchre

    First of all: the actual model is amazing. One of the best (and if I’m not mistaken last) hand sculpted knights. This model aged very well and is still one of nicest Knights among whole range.


    KotHS are supposed to be elite PanO troopers, actually carrying out honor duty at keeping human heritage safe and acting like keepers/security of many monuments on old earth (seems this job got them fat/unambitious/lazy/unfocused). This could be MO fire superiority unit but sadly is not.

    One thing going for KotHS is fact that he is so rarely played that many people do not even know that PanO has an access to Holo2 (and on HI platform) that it can be quite a surprise for your opponent (I’ve done that few times, unfortunately works only once per year per player :( ), that this merry trio of somewhat random Magisters knights are actually one KotHS (although most experienced players would be suspicious from the start, same goes for “3 plain combi OS in ZoC of at least 1 other”).


    3rd Offensive saw quite extensive KotHS rework. First of all KotHS can no longer be LT. KotHS gained a point of CC and +3BTS while lost a point in ARM and PH. Both old profiles got a Forward Deployment L2 (for some reason Spitfire got +1 pts cost ;/) while Combi profile exchanged it’s DEP for LGL (so we again have some equivalent of old Mechanized Deployment Montesa LGL).

    What is a brand new is following 2 new profiles for KotHS. They both trade FD2 for CoC profile. Rejoice finally MO has access to CoC, yet for a very hefty prices (52 pts minimum). What is actually stellar (even if not totally powerful in big scope) is fact that CB finally seems to agree that combis on “premium” HI are just wrong thing, KotHS CoC versions are equipped either with a Spitfire or a brand new and excellent Breaker Combi Rifle (finally MO has a dedicated gun against Ariadna, mind though it’s still worse in many cases than a cheap T2 ammo).
    With a current huge problems with preserving the life of LT, CoC KotHS seems quite often like a compulsory addition to the list. At least now he can actually act as a quite vilable secondary (or reciary) attack piece.

    [​IMG]

    Father Officer Gabrielle de Fersen
    2nd character in MO. He’s quite a all rounded profile doing quite a few things at once and all of them relatively well. He’s sporting a BS14 Spitfire which is good bruiser mid-range gun, have quite good (stellar for MO) CC skills (only one point of CC behind Ninja) making him rather unlikely target for all kind of CC specialist (as without additional modifiers like surprise attack they are probably at 50%-50% of winning CC attack against Gabe). His past in Templar Order allow him to both wield unique (one of two in game) Templar Sword (AP+Shock), and have special upgrade to his AHD. He’s a member of Hospitaller Order currently, allowing him to use quite reliable ARM4 and BTS6 (quite important for hacker). On top of all those good combat stats he is hacking specialist for MO. WIP14 hacker is quite unique for PanO (and barely acceptable for Bakunin or Aleph :P). Current meta state means unfortunately that AHD are quite easily hunted by all kinds of KHD. Fersen was given an Trinity (quite fitting to his lore) program allowing him to directly hunt and kill enemy hackers (remember that he still not have KHD so you cannot bypass enemy firewalls), but the program itself is heavily inferior to Redrum (only program you should use if you have KHD), and mostly useful to kill pesky HD LI or some NWI hackers. Still it’s very good profile (even if pricy) your 2nd specialist option while running Hospitaller link (remember he links like regular Hospitaller so he can join link with Magisters!). While he does not have Deflector Tinbot, he allows your link to have at least some active hacking defense (although for a price of making him a target of KHD). His AHD gives an opportunity to leverage your odds against enemy TAGs/HI before you start shooting them (or a way to perform engage with CC guys when enemy tries to reset out of Immobilization caused by Carbonite).

    Once again one of the better MO profiles even if current popularity and power of KHD makes him sometimes a risky pick (if you are going to play against KHD heavy faction with access to several repeaters). Just remember to rather not bring him against Bakunin or Bit&Kiss, and do everything to keep him away for hackers with Maestro program ;)


    Well 3rdO just introduced Santiago KHD+Tinbot. If you just want to be able to kill enemy hackers then take him (Santiago), he’s cheaper and passively protect the link from hacking and has D-Charges&DA CCW for objectives.

    Fersen just got outclassed in his own department ^^ I really love Fersen as a character and wished there were reasons to field him (but his +20 pts price over the Santiago KHD+Tinbot is hard sell ;/).

    [​IMG]

    Holy Order of Hospitaller Knights of Saint John of Skovorodino
    Orc trooper which do not suck :) Check Orc trooper profile. Now throw some decent CC on top of that, improve willpower by 1 and upgrade BTS by 3. Oh and reduce price by 3 points. All those shiny things for a mere price of having Frenzy characteristic which probably won’t happen due to a fact your Hospitallers are linked (you put them in link with Magisters or Joan did you ?). Hospitallers by default have very good stats ( BS14, PH14, WIP13, ARM4, BTS6), while usually fighting equipped with reliable and always useful Multi-Rifles. Most profiles are having just different main gun without any kind of special equipment. Hospitallers are emphitany of “standard” straightforward troopers. As it was written at begging, reliable, better than ORC troopers with an excellent specialist option (who is not counter to itself as WIP12 BTS3 AHD hacker is :)).


    HMG profile
    Linkable HI HMG. Only one (except for Fusiliers) regular HMG. One of reasons why Hospitallers are picked to form CORE fireteam over Santiago Knights (who “only” have Spitfire). There are few things feeling better than shooting enemy with 5 dices on 20s (BS14+3 range mod + 3 fireteam mod).


    Doctor profile

    Great (by PanO standards for having WIP13) specialis with useful skill. Fact that very often he’s part of fireteam makes his Doctor skill only more handy as it means his patients will probably be in his proximity which results in efficient (order wise) healing. As he can be equipped with either good Multi Rifle or cheap combi it is also quite common to see him run solo (with only palbot) as reliable combat specialist (who can both kill enemies around objective and capture it).


    If you are running an solo Hospitaller Doctor (in MO or in vanilla) there’s a particular way it get get considerable boost. Being a doctor you are allowed to buy a palbot for him which can actually be used as an offensive tool! Due to Hospitallers being relatively good CC combatant (CC21 and MA2), support of humble palbot gives him an very cheap option of upgrading his CC burst by +1 (friendly model in b2b with enemy). Such “squire” palbot might give you several tactical advantages (move him into b2b with someone locking them in CC and if they opt to shoot hospitaller with some weak weapon you can auto Immobilize them with Electric Pulse, if they go for palbot shoot them unopposed with MultiRifle, either way they will probably be locked in combat on next order). Such combination makes Hospitaller Doctor very potent solo piece (even though that MO naturally miss fire superiority units like Swiss Guard or Guarda de Assaulto). Remember you can always take 2 palmbot and leave one in DZ on typical “heal an ARO piece” duty (remember you can activate with Hospitaller only 1 palbot at the same time!).


    CB decided to nuke the Hospitaller + Mag link ;( Oh well there goes strongest MO option ;(


    Hospitallers can now include a single OS in their links (or Konstantinos) it might be good for occasional ARO piece (OS HRL) or unhackable guy to clear repeaters.


    On plus side Hospitallers just cheaper (so that CB can sell their MO 300 pts box) and they all got DA CCW.


    At least Hospitallers got Haris. Haris guy is also a Doctor which is really nice touch as you can have a HMG+Doctor+BSG (or cheap OS filler). While it is weaker in leaving your DZ, it’s still a viable option (and probably you will use it).

    [​IMG]

    Joan of Arc
    If any of MO units are close to being called OP (or just overperforming), this is the one. For ~50 pts you get an excellent durable Lieutenant who can be used actively (Lt order can be used as free coordinated order due to Inspiring Leadership), she can help you to get more orders into list (because of Inspiring Leadership she convert irregular into regular orders) by adding Warcor and TechBee into your list.

    On profile she’s also quite a fighter inferior only to Achilles. 15 on every statistic, CC23 with respectful MA3 and AP or DA CCW. MultiRifle is still solid weapon which can be effectively used against both Li and HI/light TAGs. As most recreations she carry nanopulser under her skin, which is a useful tool against pesky SK and occasional camo tokens (or grouped troops). Armor 5 BTS 6 and NWI makes her very resistant fighter, putting her into “durable HI / light TAG” league. If that was not enough she can join full Knights links (either Santiago or Hospitaller ones), increasing her fighting capabilities even more (it’s one of the easiest way to start shooting on BS21 if you catch your opponent without cover!). Remember she’s (as everything in Infinity) is not invulnerable, one failed BTS roll against E/M ammo may leave your assault piece neutralized and your army in Loss of Lieutenant situation (remember, best way to pass ARM/BTS rolls is not to take them). In general she’s very solid assault piece and with careful play she can be used as a strong assault piece (just if she’s your Lt, remember not to overstretch her position).

    In 3rdO her doom link got nerfed as she can only form a fireteam if there are full 5 members (4 full knights Hospitallers or wildcards (Santiagos)). Thanks CB!

    [​IMG]

    Joan of Arc 2.0 (mobility armor)
    In this armor Joan switches her MultiRifle to Spitfire, loses 2 ARM and 1 PH point for Multiterrain and 6-2 MOV and kinematika. This is not a bad profile but she’s rather seen as more situational if not slightly inferior to standard version. Spitfire although have better range and higher burst offer slightly less punch than MR, though 2.0 version has an upgraded of CCW to EXP making it reliable tool to use when advancing into 0-8” “bad” range of Spitfire. Personally would advise not to make her LT if this version is taken to fully utilize her as strong “rambo” piece and not risk LoL situation. Her Multiterrain might be quite important skill in some missions (eg. “Rescue” as not she do not enter Frenzy), or table setups. It’s also allows her to enter CC from good spitfire range (after first order move into 6” of target while shooting, next order move into b2b and use your EXP CCW with CC23 and MA3). Remember that 6-2 MOV allows for a 6” Cautious Movement (important for sectorial with no smoke access).

    [​IMG]

    Magister Knights


    Behold 2nd great unit which makes MO competitively playable ;) Magisters knights are often described as a “poor” knights who fight directly for ideals, discarding all the glory or profits which can be achieved through knightly duties. They shave their heads and request assignments to the hottest fight-zones available.


    Magister knights are the closest thing PanOceania has when it comes to Warbands. They are only native Extremely Impetuous unit in PanO roster, are decent CC soldiers, but they lack usual equipment of Warbands (smoke or asymmetric weaponry). Magister Knights being “poor” knights sport only ARM/BTS 3 which is as low as HI stats usually go.

    They are equipped with interesting weaponry. Wielding standard AP or DA CCW as a useful CCW, LSG for quite useful impact template, and Panzerfaust as quite dangerous long range ARO piece. Sygnature skill of Magister Knights is their Hyperdynamics L1. Combined with good PH14 it allows them to dodge most incoming shoots/attacks on 17s. This combined with their hard hitting (if not that reliable with “only” BS12) Panzerfausts makes them very resilient to direct enemy attacks.

    Main strength of Magister Knights is a fact that they can join either Hospitallers or Santiagos full HI link. Fact that they only cost 22 pts for a 2W HI makes fireteams they form really cheap for amount of wounds they have (usually around ~150pts). Magisters knights brings cheap option for LSG which if used in best case scenario allows them to shoot on BS21 (yes 21). Magisters in fireteams are usually used in 3 roles:

    1) Cheap link filler (after you take almost obligatory specialist from full Knightly House, and a long range high Burst weapon (Spitfire or HMG)).

    2) Surprisingly sturdy ARO piece (with “BS15” B2 single use Panzerfaust).
    3) Fireteams “bumper” which should slow down any direct assault aimed at said link (dodge on 17s allows to either dodge all incoming attacks or hopefully nullify most of them).


    Magister Knights have 3 profiles, 2 of which are identical and differ only with their CCW (AP or DA). Their second profile is a ML one. I have no idea who in the Roman Curia thought that’s a good idea to give ML to Extremely Impetuous hot-head but hey, that’s how we ended up with ML Magister. This profile is often used as a static ARO piece (similar to Rriot Girls ML), lack of Disposable on ML allows you to threaten enemy with a powerful shoot for longer. Mind thought that ML profile has no secondary weapon (which in itself shouldn’t be a terrible thing as you should have 2 other Magisters carrying LSGs).

    Magister knights in whole 5 man Fireteam can quite often be left standing on an ARO duty (especially if going 2nd) if enemy doesn’t have strong shooting Fire Superiority pieces (heavy TAGs, Swiss/Hac Tao, linked MSR sniper etc.). They can threaten resilient troopers with their Panzerfausts, while using their LSG to oppose enemy WB rushing their positions trying to throw smoke.

    DATATRACKER: Due to their resiliance and usual presence in 5 man HI link Magister Knights can be effectively used as an Offensive DATATRACKERS. Your HI link will usually advance mid-field, he shouldn’t have a problem with shooting down enemy Designated Target, or use DA CCW (and it’s Anti-Material tag) to destroy enemy AC2 in other missions


    Ont Well Magister now counts as Teutons (thus can link with Teutons in CORE) and got their won core (you can now have 5 magisters as a CORE link). Tetuons are still not taked (when there is Santiago Spitfire non-Lt/Lt with Specialist etc.).

    [​IMG]

    Military Order Father-Knights
    Those guys are actual fully ordained priests (represented by the fact that in contrary to most knights they keep their cool and do not have Frenzy/Impetus characteristic). It’s an example what PanOceania Engineers can fit into S2 HI frame and why does PanOceania not have S5 HI nor TAG. Armor carried by father knights resemble more TAG chassis while looking at his ARM5/BTS9 and full 4-4MOV with Assault Skill and Kinematika. In other words what other factions fit into big robots/unwieldy oversized suits of armor, PanOceania technical departments fit into “standard sized” HI armor. Father Knights fit well into “tank” paradigm, while maybe being a little bit lighter in offensive power. In game terms they offer quite solid statlite … and combi rifles. Ok it’s not that bad, let us go profile by profile as they differ quite a bit. Their DA CCW became much more attractive as many missions do require or give advantage to soldier having Anti-Material CCW weapons (and his CC23 guarantees he always land a hit on scenery piece with 20% chance of crit). His Assault skill is good to have (though having extremely niche use cases against enemies) but being good skill to effectively move into b2b contact with scenery pieces and still reliable perform CC attack (on effective CC20). Mind that FK do not have Stealth (as they lack Martial Arts) which is partially compensated by his BTS9. Father Knight with Fairy Dust on him is almost immune to all hacking programs but Oblivion (as most of hacking programs are DAM13 and with Fairy Dust he has effective amazing BTS12).
    • Missile Launcher (49 pts, 1.5 SWC) - This is quite odd profile. ML is not a bad weapon with BS14 and 2W ARM5/BTS9. Problem is that on ARO duty he’s countered by usual ARO removal tools (put into -12 he has 1 shot on 2s), smoke etc. Lack of good secondary weapon (like LSG on ML Swiss Guard) as access to breaker pistol is not enough makes it difficult to use his in medium/short range. Also having such long range weapon makes paying for his good CC skills quite unfortunate. He might have some uses as sturdy participant of Coordinated Orders (as ML shot on BS14 cannot be ignored), but would say that Panzerfaust can serve similar purpose for half of price (usually on BS12 though). This profile can sometimes catch your opponents off guard as MO is not known from it’s good long range ARO power (if your opponent hadn’t brought good ARO removal, he might have some headache with Father Knight). Now as all FK can link he might be used as a sturdy ARO piece in OS link.
    • Spitfire (50 pts, 2 SWC) - Your reliable bruiser who won’t go frenzy and lose cover benefits. Bit with light TAG statline (ARM5/BTS9), with good medium range weapon of Spitfire. If facing some Ariadna or low BTS targets he might quite make use of his Breaker Pistol. His CC23 makes him also not that easy target for most CC attackers, especially those who also have NBW as his lack of MA and use of pure CC stat make him not lose his skills against those.
    • AHD (50 pts, 0.5 SWC) - Our first specialist profile. AHD have currently problem of being rather problematic choice when many opponents field quite a few strong KHD skirmishers or camo tokens. General idea around this profile was quite sound as it also has an access to D-Charges (remember they can be used as CC weapon!). So that FK was supposed to first “immobilise” enemy HI/TAG and then make use of either his DA CCW or just place and explode D-Charges when hopeless enemy tries to reset his Immobilisation status. This is still obviously possible (if order expensive), but FK will have some problems if enemy have broad repeater range with KHD hacker watching over it (as BTS9 is not bad but not that great against usual DAM16 KHD programs which do bypass Fairy Dust defence). Again specialist status and access to D-Charges can make him quite strong and reliable profile for some missions and good candidate for DataTracker.
    • FO (46 pts) - Forward Observer with Nimbus Grenades. This guy seems to be designed around idea of throwing Nimbus Grenades and using Forward Observe attack against 2 members of link (dropping their burst by 1 and giving them -3 to their BS/PH) to make them TARGETED. At the moment Guided Missiles are not that popular, but can still sometimes be good weapon of opportunity if you have spare 1.5 SWC (and template is always good against links). This is 2nd (and last) specialist profile for Father Knights and have advantage over AHD one of not being a prey for enemy KHD (and can be quite hacking resistant if having Fairy Dust on them). Again Forward Observer is currently quite useful specialist type (especially in GRID mission, remember you also have Anti-Material CCW). Lost Nimbus grenades in 3rd O because CB hate MO.
    • Combi Rifle Lieutenant (44 pts) - If you need sturdy Lt, and cannot afford Joan.
    • Spitfire Lieutenant (50 pts, 2 SWC) - Why not to take Joan 2.0 Lt ? :P Ok this guy has no frenzy so will keep being able to use cover even on turn 2 (Joan after inflicting 1W will became Frenzy and lose cover bonuses). Good bruiser and reliable/resistant Lt in missions where Lt are a target, but I would actually point that Joan is probably tougher (although having 3 BTS less) due to increase in BS/PH etc. Would still say that non - Lt version of FK Spitfire is probably more usable for MO (due to lack of CoC), and if you spend Lt order on him and keep being mid-field enemy will ensure that this guy dies. And for some reason you dont want to take Santiago LT who has cheaper (SWC) Spitfire, D-Charges, Nanopulser and stealth. JUST TAKE SANTIAGO ok ?
    • Boarding Shotgun DUO (44 pts, 0.5 SWC) - DUO option for FK. I’m a bit torn on this one as I wished it allowed to bring longer range gun (Spitfire) with addition of specialist (AHD or FO), but instead it bounds BSG to other Combi Rifle (if you want to have specialist). On the other hand TOFOOS can easily fulfill specialists duties and allow to take Spitfire+BSG and allow order-efficient movement of such DUO. Father Knights due is very expensive though, clicking around 100pts (you can 4 HI link team for this price). Personally I prefer to run Santiagos in similar configuration (Spitifre + specialist or BSG) but they are not that resistant (especially to hacking with their mere BTS3) as Father Knights.

    DATATRACKER: Father Knights have solid stats, and no marker state which is useless if chosen as DATATRACKER (and they don’t pay for “lost” skill). Their good stats make them quite a good general brawler who can advance mid-field and kill enemy objectives.

    DATATRACKER/DEFENSIVE: Father Knights due to their very robust defensive stats (ARM5/BTS9) are excellent candidates for defensive DATATRACKERs (ones which are supposed to be killed by enemy).


    In 3rd O FK can now join the OS links. On one hand is nice but I really think that the OS link is a trap now. At least the ML profile got a nice reason to exist and be somewhat usable.

    [​IMG]

    Sacred Military Order of Knights of Montesa

    Wow those guys got a total rework. They lost their Mechanized Deployment and instead got bikes. They upgraded their CC skills a bit and got a specialist profile (poor man paramedic). MO (and VIRD/ASA) just got their fast specialist/HI. While they dont have a smoke (<insert grumling here>) at least they got a nice discount Impetus skill. Remember its optional usage so you don't have to rush into enemy AROs.

    Montesa now need friend to clear a way for him but might act as a 2nd/3rd turn fast objective grabber (Tic-Tac-Toe or Frostbyte etc.). He also now sports DA CCW (again nice for objective grabbing). Remember you can use Impetus order to shoot a med-kit into your unconscious guys. While it’s not a great option it might be a “order-free” attempt to heal or deny the body of your fallen brother.



    DATATRACKER: He is fast, he can have specialist profile. DA CCW . He can make a sturdy datatracker as long there is some protection for him. His upgraded CC skills allow him to be somewhat resilient to many (but not top) CC attackers.

    [​IMG]

    Sacred Military Order of Knights of Santiago

    If you come from the grim dark future world this is closest thing to space marine corps catholic knights. Knights of Santiago seem to get a little bit more love (good thing to be the same origin as game designers ^^) than other knights.. Broad selection of weapons, starts with Combi (which can be switched for Spitfire), Nanopulser (good DTW), and E/M grenades (which make nearby enemy HIs and TAGs very, very nervous) and D-Charges. Every Santiago Knights has also 360 degree visor making them quite hard to flank (which also makes them quite good Suppressive Fire platforms!). Build in DUO skill on all profiles allows you to bind special gun with specialist (Spitfire, KHD). Their Zero-G skill became much more useful in some missions like Rescue where it’s enough to have any kind of Special Terrain Movement Skill to not be affected by Difficult Terrain (Santiagos are one of 2 Knights with Terrain skill). Since HSN3 they have access to specialist, which previously made their 5 man link team very weak in any kind of missions which required specialist.


    Santiagos are now wildcards. They got their AVA lowered to 3 (probably box of 3 Santiago+Tinbot is coming). They can easily link with Magisters (making a possibility of old 2 Santiagos + 3 Magisters). Santiagos are your current go-to Lt option as he gets cheap as chips Spitfire (1 SWC), specialist, E/M grenades, D-Charges, DA CCW. On the other hand they do bring 2 quite important things to link: DTW (nanopulser) and Speculative Fire option (E/M grenades). E/M grenades can be easily thrown while speculating at 13s making it still quite potent, and extremaly dangerous if used against enemy TAGs (as they will have -9 to dodge).

    Santiagos allows to make quite potent DUO teams. 360 degree visor allows them to position very aggressively without fear of being shoot from behind, and option to bring any (Spitfire) weapon alongside specialist makes them superior to similar option of Father Knights (who can only bring BSG alongside specialist). DTW helps with clearing bunched troops/camo markers, and E/M grenades ensures that no TAG will every try to be in proximity of Santiago Knights (shooting Santiago from >16” is another thing).


    Santiagos for some reason lost thier BSG. It’s hard to justify such decision, they only reason I can think of is to allow FK some more space (as he can now link his BSG with OS).

    Santiagos got a very nice KHD+Tinbot profile. It is great as provides some passive hacking defence, and allows MO to actually punish some reapeater-happy factions (Tinbot allows you to actually have decent chances against some top tier KHD/AHD/HD+ users, and KHD ignores enemy Firewalls making Santiago much better option for hacking defence than Fersen (not to mention Redrum is much better than a Trinity, especially in ARO)).




    DATATRACKER: Their lack of any Marker state, and option to bind good break through profile (Spitfire/BSG) with specialist who have Anti-Material CCW makes them excellent choice for ASSAULT DATATRACKER, for both HVT and static objectives.

    Sacred Military Order of Teutonic Knights

    [​IMG]

    Oh boy this part will be a quite a rant so be warned. If you know some uses/tactics of Teutonic Knights let me know it comments, I would be more than happy to be proven wrong :)


    Oh how low had Teutonic Order fallen. It seems that they are in lowest of their low since particular summer days of 1410s. They come with Panzerfaust, Combi, DA CCW, Berserk and option to take Spitfire instead of Combi, and EXP CCW instead DA. Those units try to be a good “trading” pawns (access to Berserk and no MA) but fails to do so (due to their price and no delivery to CC mechanism). They are also outperform by all other Orders, and lack clearly defined role. They lack MA and stealth (thus have problems moving within repeater range), and their Berserk only skill makes them weak against low CC units (as it is possible it sneaks a 1W on this ~34 pts model) although it might have some uses against super efficient CC units (so most of JSA, and few characters) by denying them use of their high CC as defensive tool by utilizing Berserk normal roll. This last “usage” of Teutonic Knights is thought to narrow and specialized to be considered often as an asset and reason to include them in lists. In contrary to popular myth they are also not the cheapest BS14 platform (this place is occupied by Hospitaller Order with their 1 pts cheaper combi and BSG profiles). Again in contrary internet myth they are not that great Avatar hunters. While their lack of cubes makes them immune to dreaded Sepsitor, most of they can do is to engage Avatar. Their Berserk and exp CCW would mean that they will probably inflict 1 wound to avatar due to crit, but after that avatar makes an ARM saves using it’s ARM9 versus “only” DAM14 (so saving ARM rolls on 6s), this is a problem due to a fact that Avatar has CC value of 18 AND DA CCW (with PH17), meaning that brave Teutonic knight is rather unlikely to be given a second chance of swinging against Avatar… (and his job can be done several times better by any kind of smoke tossing crazy 5 pts WB, did I mention that Tueton also lacks CC delivery option?) Just take Pupnics with a excellent Eclipse grenades and check how Avatar melts against them (or even funnier just leave them with him in CC and let him try to spend several order to break free against 3-4 CC attacks).


    Third “myth” surrounding Teutonic Knights is fact that there is somewhat useful use of them with Joan inspiring leadership (and her “free” coordinated order) in a way of performing multiple Panzerfaust shots against particular heavy targets. This can be done much easier and cheaper (while technically losing a bit of efficiency due to lower BS skill) by Magister knights (they can also be linked and delivered to good position far more efficient than 3 lone Teutonic Knights).

    As a insult to injury with arrival of HSN3 they lost their ability to form link team (with only other Teutons). This wasn’t very popular option (but hey it was something! At least they could stop going frenzy as long as in link), but was removed in HSN3 due to statement that giving them such skill was a mistake (insert particular meme here) in a first place (so they had enjoyed their link team ability in result of an error for more than a year (sic!)).


    To add 2nd insult to injury their Lt profile, while being relatively cheap as for HI Lt has to pay 1 SWC for this privilege (something very uncommon in PanO) making it questionable choice due to heavy reliance on SWC weapons within MO forces to even get out of their DZ zone….


    Someone could argue that they are 2nd knights to have a terrain skill (so useful in missions like RESCUE) but their lack of ability to link means that they will almost always become frenzied before reaching civilians, resulting in their inability to sync with them….


    Again almost any other knight is better choice than a Teutons, unless your list is really short on points and you literally cannot afford something else (why not Hospitaller Combi or BSG ?) or you really have some smart/narrow reason to play them, or you are just Teutonic Knights fan and want to play them in spite of “meta” “min/max” gaming :)


    In 3rdO Teutons got a Harris, with a specialist (compare it to Hospitallers Haris xD). It’s again and still inferior to Hospitallers. The second new profile is Spitfire NCO. What’s strange is Teutons didn’t get a major rework and still have same set of problems. IMHO neither Haris option nor NCO are really worthy (just take Hospitallers with HMG and better specialist).

    Teutons technicly provide now the cheapest LT option for MO (34pts 1SWC) but pays 1 SWC for that (like WTF!?). Unless you are starved for points just take Santiago Spitfire LT or Hospitallers Lt (costing only 1pts more).

    [​IMG]

    Seraphs, Armoured Cavalry of Military Order

    First and only MO TAG option. It’s relatively unique in TAG department due to access to Super-Jump skill, and an auxbot (only Gorgos has also an G:Sync model). Equipped with rather weak weapon (simple spitfire, so common among MO), is considered as rather undergunned TAG. This is only helped a bit by the presence of old&faithfull HFT equipped auxbot which can allow Seraph to win F2F exchanges with some heavier targets. In general Seraph is a light TAG, due to its gun and ARM/BTS stats, and should be used as a strong flanking force (where it can utilize it’s Super-Jumpto the maximum). Due to S7 it might be able to quickly access even highest buildings/positions and from there shoot at coverless enemies. This TAG is also equipped with nanopulser so option for using double (nanopulser+HFT) DTW on bunched up enemy light targets (LI link for example, cheerleaders) is also possible strategy. Due to having actual 2 “bodies” it is said that Seraph might be slightly better at fighting versus camo targets as it gives option to perform 2 discovery rolls or 2 intuitive attacks (both Seraph and Auxbot have DTW). What is known to a much lesser degree is fact that Seraph is best CC TAG in a game. It’s CC20 guarantees it never fails a CC attack against static enemy (objective or IMM enemy model) and if the Auxbot is in b2b with a target it increases its CC burst to 2 (rather uncommon among CC specialists), which can be deadly as Seraph is equipped with EXP CCW and PH17. Especially important to know is fact that humble Auxbot is also equipped with Electric Pulse allowing it to IMM enemies almost automatically (as long they don’t perform f2f roll directly against Auxbot), which can be devastating if used against enemy TAGs.


    RULES WARNING: Due to a fact that MO is not Aleph and is not given a “unique” skills to fix some gameplay, whenever Seraph performs short skill “jump” (due to having Super-Jump skill it can perform jump as a short movement skill) auxbot is prohibited from performing any kind of movement (as it lacks Super-Jump skill, it can perform “jump” only as a long skill). This way whenever Seraph want to use it’s unique skill, auxbots acts as a hard anchor and is forbidden from any kind of movement (unless Seraph declares “long skill Jump” as a first declaration moving up to sum of his both MOV values and allowing Auxbot to move up to its first MOV value). This a issue on fully utilizing Seraph unique skills (and should be fixed in rules). HURREY AUXBOT NOW HAS A SUPERJUMP !!



    TACTICAL ADVIES: Due to access to G:Sync model there are specific “strategies” and tricks which might be useful to know, giving Seraph/Auxbot tandem a little bit more finesse and options of movement. More about it in specific chapter of MO Tactica later in this topic :)
    (small update: after playing SoF extra I must say that McMurrogh is better/funnier Seraph :()



    DATATRACKER: Due to it’s mobility and access to anti-material CCW (EXP one) Seraph is a good candidate to be a good offensive DATATRACKER. It is especially visible in mission like Loot&Sabotage or Grid, or any other mission where it is needed to kill designated target.


    Reaso In 3rdO Seraph got his anchor fixed (Auxbot got Superjump) and a second HMG profile.

    While another HMG is nice to have in MO, it’s still quite “plain” and weak, yet expensive HMG. TAGs have their own set of weaknesses and vulnerabilities, making it really questionable over even lone Hospitaller HMG (especially now as MO has less orders).
     
    #2 eciu, Jan 8, 2018
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
  3. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Military Orders Tactics

    Massed Armor Operations:

    Excellent article is written by daboarder in thread MAO . I won’t repeat what he did in excellent way, just remind you that MO alone has can choose from 10 different flavors of HI (which could make Yu-Jing general jealous!) and has interesting TAG option.


    Playing HI Core Fireteam
    <incoming>

    General tips & tricks
    • Remember after you use all your orders in turn, you can still use Command Token to reform link. Use that to change link leader to someone in back/safe position if you spend your last regular order on forward guy who had no chance of moving back into total cover/better position.

    • Remember that at beginning on your active turn all link member who were dropped from link (for example because they declared different ARO than link) can automatically rejoin link team if they are in coherency with link leader.

    • Remember you can break voluntarily link at any moment in game. You can use that in your active turn just before order count if you want to allow Magister Knights to use their Extremely Impetuous orders (“release the hounds!”).

    • At the beginning of enemy active turn if your Holo2 unit is out of LoF it can automatically and for free regain it’s holoechos as long they each is in b2b with at least 1 other one. You can use this trick to get both Suppressive Fire and Holoprojector Marker State (and you can use that to “bump” your guy in SF just around corner to see enemies).

    • You can use Joan Lt Order to make Coordinated Orders (she must be part or this order but she doesn’t need to be Spearhead) to drop several mines, re-camouflage several TO troopers etc.

    • Remember that religious training allows you to ignore Retreat! Situation, preserving regular orders and allowing to act normally

    • If you are playing Magister in a link, always try to use them as a buffer/shield for your Hospitallers/Santiagos. Remember that dodging on 17s with Sixth Sense Lv2 is one of the best possible AROs in game (obviously worse than shooting but still effective against any kind of TO/ODD enemies). Remember than Hyperdynamics also work with Engage! (and even Ninja are not so sure to win F2F against Magisters)

    • Remember than 4+ members of fireteam gives you Sixth Sense Lv1 (also Lv2) which allows you to “delay” your ARO if enemy execute order inside your Zone of Control. This is extremely important for links as allows “safe” discovery of camo marker who tries to sneak on their position, or proper response if attacked by someone who can use different types of attacks (requiring dodge or reset ARO).

    • Always remember to play the mission! Killing enemies is important only if this leads you to your mission objectives!
     
    #3 eciu, Jan 8, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2018
  4. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

    Joined:
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    Example of interesting, showcase lists

    <example of typical MO lists, big/small link of Doom, TOFOOS spam, auxbot spam, hosp-mag bonanza, Joan zerg attack>

    Classic Link of Doom
    Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    [​IMG]8 [​IMG]2

    JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, DA CCW. (+1 | 50)

    KNIGHT OF SANTIAGO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges + 1 TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 38)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 39)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 31)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) MULTI Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 39)

    WARCOR (360º Visor) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    TECH-BEE (Remote Assistant Level 1, Specialist Operative) Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5)

    KNIGHT OF THE HOLY SEPULCHRE (Chain of Command) Breaker Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 52)

    SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)

    FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)


    3.5 SWC | 298 Points


    Open in Infinity Army



    Leave still a bit space for design changes (drop TO MSR and pick up double HRL on Order Sergeants with Auxbots, for coordinated order shots with Joan Lt order), but in general it’s a classic single combat group, 223 pts in one link list. That’s one of the closest things in infinity when it comes to “deathstar” concept (although it faar from true deathstars in other tabletop games, even 5 pts model can be a grave threat to it!), mostly due to its price (223 pts for 5 guys). With ITS9 immunity of single combat group to get -2 orders on 1st turn it’s really scary to go 2nd against this list. As usual your mortal enemies are all kinds of HD Missle Launchers and/or HRL. This list has no backup plan (although Joan herself can sometimes be a “plan B” herself), and puts literally all eggs into single basket link. Very strong in all kinds of “killy” missions, link provides 5 BS types of weapons, 2 distinct specialists, some passive and active hacking defence and CoC option to salvage game once Joan dies.


    Important notice: Remember that in 3rdO Joan’s DOOM link got derped and REQUIRES 4 HOSPTIALLERS to actuall form. That means if one of the link members dies and link is broken YOU CANNOT REFORM IT with Joan to anything less than a FULL 5 members. Thank CB for that.

    All rounder small link of doom
    This option was killed by CB. Shame because that was most competetive MO list possible. RIP Hosp+Mag link ;(


    [​IMG] General small link of doom

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]3

    [​IMG] KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, AP CCW. (2 | 41)

    [​IMG] KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) MULTI Rifle / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 41)

    [​IMG] MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    [​IMG] MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    [​IMG] MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)

    [​IMG] FUSILIER Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10)

    [​IMG] FUSILIER Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 18)

    [​IMG] FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)


    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]3

    [​IMG] MACHINIST (Father-Engineer) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)

    [​IMG] PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    [​IMG] SIERRA DRONBOT HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 25)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)


    5 SWC | 300 Points


    Open in Infinity Army


    This is slightly “downgrade” core HI link concept. It’s still good and efficient as Magister Knights offer sturdy defence (dodge on 17s with SS2!) and Hospitaller finish link nicely with HMG and Doctor with reliable MR (good option when engaging heavy TAGs, and simultaneously trying to put Magister Knights in CC with it).


    Heavy armor blitz
    Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]3

    KNIGHT OF SANTIAGO Lieutenant (Specialist Operative) Spitfire, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades, D-Charges / Pistol, DA CCW. (1 | 43)

    KNIGHT OF SANTIAGO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges + 1 TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 38)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 23)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 23)

    SERAPH Spitfire, Nanopulser + AUXBOT_3 / EXP CCW. (2 | 82)

    [​IMG] AUXBOT_3 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    [​IMG] AUXBOT_3 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    MACHINIST (Father-Engineer) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)

    PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    SPEC. SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher + AUXBOT_1 / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 19)

    [​IMG] AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    SPEC. SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher + AUXBOT_1 / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 19)

    [​IMG] AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)


    6 SWC | 298 Points


    Open in Infinity Army




    Did you know you can fit TAG and 5 man HI link team in 10 order list ? Now you know :) Excellent list for LOOT & SABOTAGE mission, you can either make Seraph or one of Magister Knights a DATATRACKER.


    Holy Ghost(s)
    [​IMG] Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    [​IMG]10

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)

    [​IMG] KNIGHT OF THE HOLY SEPULCHRE Lieutenant Combi Rifle, D.E.P. / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 51)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 15)


    6 SWC | 300 Points


    Open in Infinity Army


    Excellent lists when you are tired of Ariadnas s*** ;) Not that many people know that Order Sergeants are AVA TOTAL also on their TO profiles (this list can make even Shasvasti a bit jealous). Only 1 “true” entry on courtesy list will be a shock for many opponents who usually expect quite “straightforward” approach of MOs lists (when a Switch Holo1 was available to all factions still few of my tournament opponents were surprised when I’ve placed 2nd Joan of Arc on table).



    Guess the links?
    Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]4

    JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, DA CCW. (+1 | 50)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (Fireteam: Haris, MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0.5 | 36)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 39)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 31)

    KNIGHT OF SANTIAGO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges + 1 TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 38)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    MAGISTER KNIGHT Missile Launcher / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 32)

    FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)


    4.5 SWC | 300 Points


    Open in Infinity Army




    In theory you can build 2 different 5 man links with it. There’s also Haris and lone Joan. If going second you can try to deploy Magisters+Santiago as AROs and then reform DOOM link. Problem is if any of Hospitallers/Santiago get unconscious you can forget about that link ;/
     
    #4 eciu, Jan 8, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  5. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Start collecting Military Orders! - 300 pts packages

    All prices are based on official CB store so they may vary depending on your location and FLGS ;) (treat it as just general estimation of cost) This also do not include and kind of special offers, discounts which you could probably get :) It will follow general approach “use all minis from boxes”, it’s designed to give you most of “playability” for lowest cost. Obviously those lists could be much better optimized but as I mentioned we want to use all models “as they are”(or very close) from the boxes :) (once you have broader collection you can do what you wish :) ).

    Obviously I avoid any proxies here (unless it’s allowed like Order Sergeant combi -> Order Sergeant Paramedic). Even changing that (using Black Friar MR as MSR) might enhance some lists, but once again it’s to show you that you can build up quite competitive force with some minimal money investment.

    Disclaimer: it’s hard to build MO force in such a way as many linkable knights are sold in box of 4 making it difficult to fit full 8 knights (including full 4 Confere Knights) into lists (it’s possible but we won’t show it here).


    5 Man link of Doom
    [​IMG] Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]8 [​IMG]2

    [​IMG] JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, DA CCW. (+1 | 50)

    [​IMG] KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, AP CCW. (2 | 41)

    [​IMG] KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) MULTI Rifle / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 41)

    [​IMG] KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) MULTI Rifle / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 41)

    [​IMG] KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 33)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher + AUXBOT_1 / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 19)

    [​IMG] [​IMG] AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] WARCOR (Aerocam) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    [​IMG] TECH-BEE (Remote Assistant Level 1, Specialist Operative) Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5)

    [​IMG] BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)


    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]1

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)


    4 SWC | 295 Points


    Open in Infinity Army



    You will need to buy:


    1. Joan d’Arc 15,75

    2. Hospitaller Box 44

    3. Order Sergeant box 24,95

    4. Black Friar 10,25

    5. Techbee 16,95

    6. Warcor 11,95
    Total: ~124 euro


    Order Sergeant attack!
    [​IMG] Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 15)

    [​IMG] BROTHER KONSTANTINOS Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Assault Pistol, CCW. (0 | 29)

    [​IMG] MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    [​IMG] TEUTONIC KNIGHT Lieutenant Combi Rifle, Panzerfaust / Pistol, AP CCW. (1 | 34)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT Combi Rifle + AUXBOT_1 / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 17)

    [​IMG] [​IMG] AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    [​IMG] CRUSADER MULTI Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)


    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)

    [​IMG] PATHFINDER DRONBOT Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16)

    [​IMG] FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    [​IMG] BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)

    [​IMG] TECH-BEE (Remote Assistant Level 1, Specialist Operative) Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5)


    4.5 SWC | 300 Points


    Open in Infinity Army


    You will need to buy:

    1. Military Orders Starter box 39,95

    2. Crusader Brethren 10,25

    3. Black Friar 10,25

    4. Order Sergeants box 24,95

    5. Tech Bee 16,95

    6. Dire Foes Mission Pack 4: Flee or Die 29.95
    Total: ~132 euro

    This one is bit different, we buy Dire Foes pack which has also a miniature for Haqq so you can always sell it to friendly player (or use it as target practice :D) this pack will also give you nice HVT miniature :)



    Sword, Gun & Brain
    [​IMG] Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1

    [​IMG] FATHER-KNIGHT Spitfire / Breaker Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 50)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] TEUTONIC KNIGHT Combi Rifle, Panzerfaust / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 34)

    [​IMG] TEUTONIC KNIGHT Combi Rifle, Panzerfaust / Pistol, EXP CCW. (0 | 36)

    [​IMG] MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)

    [​IMG] DE FERSEN Lieutenant Spitfire / Pistol, Templar CCW (AP + Shock). (2 | 58)

    [​IMG] PATHFINDER DRONBOT Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16)

    [​IMG] FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)


    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1

    [​IMG] SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33)

    [​IMG] WARCOR (Aerocam) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)


    5.5 SWC | 299 Points


    Open in Infinity Army




    You will need to buy:

    1. Military Orders Starter box 39,95

    2. Warcor 11,95

    3. Military Order Father-Knight (Spitfire) 13,5

    4. Father-Officer Gabriele de Fersen 10,25

    5. Dronbot Remotes (REM) 27,95

    6. Teuton Knight Combi Rifle 10,5

    Total: ~~115 euro

    Official Corvus Belli MO 300 pts Box

    Well it seems that CB decided to break a bit their rules for 300 pts pack for MO (no proxing, models have to be used WYSWIG). Following picture presents something which seems to be a MO 300 pts box which should be available at some point of this year (2018). Sorry for rather poor image quality, couldn't find better (but I saw one!) If it follows usual price it should cost around ~100 euro.


    [​IMG]


    WYSWIG Army list should look like:


    Military Orders

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    [​IMG]10

    JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (+1 | 49)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 39)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 35)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 31)

    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 31)

    SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)

    ORDER SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 15)

    SPEC. SERGEANT Combi Rifle + AUXBOT_1 / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 17)

    [​IMG] AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)

    BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)

    CRUSADER MULTI Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)


    4 SWC | 297 Points


    Open in Infinity Army
     
    #5 eciu, Jan 8, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  6. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Holy shit (pun wasn't intended... initially).
    I knew you can do this, but this is apparently an actual list people play. Oh man.

    Also, nice guide.
    Chapter on collecting is a nice idea, and besides, it's one of the few actually recent guides here.
     
  7. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Thought that might be good idea, MO has really hard time to make "300 standalone" box as other factions but it is doable to some degree...

    and I obviously do not encourage certain miniature company to send me one ;P not at all :)


    There will be more pictures, graphs and hopefully table of content incoming (again hopefully shortly).

    Well tbh this particular list I hadn't played yet but it doesn't seems like its a weak or unplayable list :D
    Its great at throwing people off their gameplan as suddenly they have to play completely different game (more play like against Ariadna and not HI oriented faction as MO is).
     
  8. Deltervees

    Deltervees Crash Test Dumbass

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    Could you expand a bit on the Supulchre Knights? Why don't you like them?
     
  9. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Will do, it's still WIP :)

    (but to give big glimse: only one profile is usuable (Spitfire) and 51 pts for Combi guy with "just" holoprojector in faction which hardly uses many of its features is really bad)
     
    Golem2God likes this.
  10. MrNailbrain

    MrNailbrain Relentless Optimist

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    In the big guy’s defense, no one remembers that PanO has a holoprojector unit. He’s a hidden beatstick that is a great backup assault piece. I’m in agreement that you should really only consider the Spitfire profile, whether he should be Lieutenant is debatable. He’s a good LT option in military orders but less valuable in Vanilla.

    I would definitely consider him alongside an Order Sergeant team. The full knight boat is probably too points/SWC strapped for him. He’s got a place, it’s not a large one but he has his niche.
     
    Ayadan likes this.
  11. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Joan does better job as Lt.
     
    Elessar likes this.
  12. MrNailbrain

    MrNailbrain Relentless Optimist

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    Different job. Inspiring Leadership, but has the drawback of a big ol bullseye painted right on her forehead. If you show up with a Sepulchre Knight, your opponent has no idea until you reveal.

    Joan is a great Lt, no argument there. I’m just trying to make a case for why someone might want to play the Sepulchre Knight.
     
    Stiopa likes this.
  13. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Only if you are not using Holo2.

    And it's not easy to hide. You still need someone to appear as an Lt otherwise your opponent will immidietly know you have KotHS Lt on table. And MO can rarely afford "waiting" with 50 pts guy in back field just for lulz without contributing anything to game during 2 first game rounds.
     
  14. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Or until your first active turn. Sometimes it's something. Whether this something is enough to justify this price though...
     
  15. Teslarod

    Teslarod Trebuchet Enthusiast

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    Last time I checked the KotHS still trades 20 points worth of stats for a Holo 2 and the lack of Frenzy compared to Joan, it's crazy how bad of a deal his Profiles are. After all that he still somehow manages to be more expensive than Joan.

    With the change to Shock vs NWI on Multiwound models I feel less comfortable running a Joan Lt nowadays. Additionally Techbee and Warcor are invalueable as cheap, disposable roadblocks and can be flipped to Regular with Command Tokens if necessary.

    At the end of a day, a sturdy Lt is still no replacement for the security of CoC or a casual Fusilier + body double hiding somewhere on a roof. I'm not saying this lightly, Loss of Lieutenant is easily up there with my least favourite game mechanics. I desperately want a agressive or at least 2nd line PanO Lt to work and trust me I tried. After all efforts I'm sad to admit defeat here. Everything except a faceless cheerleader is just unnecessary risk and liability.

    MO currently seems overshadowed by a few primary choices, mainly it's HI Links. Don't get me wrong, I love playing my MO and they're up there with the strongest Sectorials. I'd simply give an arm and a leg for more vialble solo Knights and more desireable OS Links.
     
    Skoll likes this.
  16. PreacherSaul

    PreacherSaul Active Member

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    Hide Sepulchre Knight as Joan. Take Joan too. Talking about vanilla though.
     
  17. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    So you just sinked 100pts (at least) into hiding your Lt?

    Switch was doing that for far cheaper while having dreaded weapon against TAGs and nice KHD :P
     
  18. PreacherSaul

    PreacherSaul Active Member

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    Bashi merc does it better, but again not in MO. Joan gives you the plus one SWC for the tax and covers the irregular though. Plus you now have what looks very much like a KotHS and Joan and have 40ish points of TO or AD masked if you want it.

    And I never said it was a good idea. If I was going to do it though I'd take bulleteers, druze KHD and an OS bunker for long range support, add specialists. Again, not saying it's good, but it might work.
     
  19. Silagast

    Silagast Señor de los cabezas huecas,o eran hombres huecos?

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    Just a little correction as Hospitaliers also have MA2 and they are CC specialists only below Joan, De Fersen and magister knights in the sectorial.

    Really good guide and analysis. it´s great to find everything about MO tactics in just one place...but there is maybe too much information for our rivals XD

    Regarding the KoHS discussion, I fully agree that he lacks something to be worth the huge amount of points invested. Maybe a cheaper profile with CoC, maybe an specialist option to push you to advance with him (a KHD would be sweet combined with that holoprojector as level 1 to surprise WB or BAT with AHD). What is clear is that any offensive option can be done similarly by a father knight with spitfire, De Fersen or Joan, and this last option is by far a better lt.

    I am anxious to read how do you play magister knights and your tactics with them besides the links with hospitaliers and santigos.
     
  20. Superfluid

    Superfluid Welcome to Svalarheima

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    If you run Joan as LT and Sepulchre knight as Joan, and then do Joans inspiring leadership including them both in her special coordinated order, do you have to reveal at any point which one is the real Joan? (unless you perform an action that requires the knight to reveal himself out of holo1 ofc)