After some thought though, the chances are good, but I guess my point was vs Symbiont Armour 1 shot even a crit did not put a model into a Null state. We were Shock immune thanks to those two staged profiles as well. Now it turns out that even N ammo has a chance of Null stating a Symbiont user on a crit, where previously it had none. That has huge implications vs ARO for Tohaa.
I'm not quite sure what you mean by this, can you explain a bit more? The odds per order of both the B1 combi critting you and you failing both saves are less than 1% (~.8% in the hypothetical I gave before, for example). I generally don't make decisions based on things that have a <1% chance of happening.
It will usually be a B2 ARO from a full link, that's one. Two, you may realize those odds, many people just see the binary "earlier it was impossible to Null state my Sukeul HMG in ARO and now it is". Also, as we all know statistical odds of one to a million happen five times out of six on the table ;)
seem people tend to forget that spitfire or HMG are normal ammo, and those are very tipical. How many special ammo do you face in a single game? I have a hard time to field as much as some people says they face BSG and SMG have a short range, in active, you should be able to get away or outrange it easily MSR, viral or multi have a high SWC even on the weakest LI, so are not so common. The same can be applied to ML. I admit that those are nasty and difficult AROs, but they are far from common HMG, spitfire, are more common, and they are normal ammo for HI, shock is the same as normal, so just more normal ammo flash is another extended-use ARO, but I am not sure a critical from this is so problematic
Besides bumping the value of armour I like that it also puts a dent in the whole "burst is king" method. AP-rifles, multi-rifles, BSG just had a nice boost.
Depends on how you view it, right? What am I most likely to be hosed down with? Normal from a HMG. What am I most likely to lose AROs to? DA from Multi Snipers. What is my opponent most likely to expose for the intent purpose of ARO? Flash from Flash Pulses (from Messenger REMs and journalists) What am I most likely to get flanked by? Shock from SMGs in the hands of skirmisher types. What do I use most? It's a fairly even split between normal from HMG, DA from snipers, Breaker from pistols and shock from SMGs. Viral is the least common ammo by a large margin. Even Spiral tends to not have more than a few pistols with it.
there is a little mistake in there Wining or losing an ARO don't have anything related to the ammo used. You will lose the same against a MSR or a SR. And if the enemy has SR, will have more than one (usually they can potentially put 3 for each MSR), so is easier to lose an aro against one of those, instead just because there will be more chances to. Another mistake is thinking that all factions have the same access to SMG. Troops like Dart have biased the perspective of what we can see. I think is much more easier to see a spitfire/BSG flanker than a SMG flanker (for example, with TJC which is what I've played the most this last 2 seasons, you will not see usually mary or the pupetmaster flanking, the kriza played is the HMG one because the MK12 is a bit too expensive, and the bounty hunter are not much used, but the zondnautica instead...)
Well, my point was that it's all about point of view and how you evaluate things. I don't often lose to snipers, in fact I rarely see regular Sniper Rifles unless it's me playing Dahshat. While not all factions have access to SMG troops, I find that I don't face many skirmishers at close range who use something else. Opponents tend to prioritize other troopers in that case. Boarding Shotgun profiles, for example, tend to be less well opimized than SMG profiles and are less popular so those players will be more likely to use multi snipers, Spitfires or HMGs to push through. Will my opponents have, by far, a lot more Combis? Sure. They just won't use them very much and those AROs are often trivial enough. Games around here are by large decided by HMGs (occasionally replaced with Spitfires), Multi Snipers, SMGs, Flash Pulses, Jammers, and Hacking (also an important source of Shock). Other sources of ammo are trivial, uncommon, or used after a game has mostly been decided. So simply stating that "there are others" is a bit of a mistake in my opinion, because while there are other loadouts and varying access to certain key weapons, there's a few weapons that people will use whenever they are available*. * I can think of one exception and that's when troopers have two equal profiles, one with SMG and the other with Light Shotgun - Light Shotgun is often more popular around here, but only if the profiles are equals such as with Varangian Guard.
Oof, dude, you clearly have never encountered or used a sea of pistol shots from warbands in turn 3. People running their game-deciding button pushers while ignoring 2-3 Jaguars or Kuang Shi taking potshots on 2s and 5s tend to REALLY regret it. Same goes for people who think their Achilles or Sphinx is 100% safe from basic combis just focusing on juicy targets in the enemy Deployment
my point was that, for ARO purposes, it is not what your enemy will use in active turn, that is meaningless. Is what he will leave for aro, and what you will chose to hunt down. There will not much special ammunition aro, and usually are in good platforms, so they don't rely on crits as much as combi-cheerleaders do. And I say "rely" because they usually face a really bad roll, so they will lose most of the time unless there is a crit. Regarding SMG, I see much more BSG on my enemy lists. And I mean a lot more. Actually SMG use is not so extended, just that it is used in a few but powerful profiles that bend the perception of the weapon use. Most of the profiles that have it, is because it make them cheaper, not because they will go hunting enemy troops. as I say, I might flank much more times with a BSG spectr than with mary, the +3 extra in the same rangeband is very important
I don't think you're quite interpreting what I'm saying in the way I mean it. Even trivial shots can be deadly, crits happen and ARM dice being phobic to big numbers. That's not to say that those are commonly used ammo, because neither me nor my opponent will plan on using them and neither me nor my opponent wants to use them. Besides, if we counted "common ammo" by the metric of what's available rather than what we try to use, then it's pointless to even consider ammo because there's going to be so. much. more. normal. ammo. If my opponent is making last turn hail Mary's, then the game is mostly decided. That's not the same as saying that hail Mary's don't happen, because they happen a lot, but it is to say that it is no longer interesting whether it's Shock, AP, or Normal ammo as long as your opponent fails the ARM save with the only specialist inside Order range to win the game. Stun, DA, Viral, etc are still interesting, of course, because they generate more saves to fail, but because you usually plan on using models with those ammo they also tend to deplete during the game or if you can keep them you usually also tend to have some special abilities on them and they tend to be in decent positions to prevent Hail Marys. It's like... if you haven't killed the Kamau Multi Sniper by tail end of turn 3, your chance of success for a Hail Mary is dismal (unless you've got Eclipse like MacHaon) because the Kamau is going to fill your Trauma Doc with far too many DA rounds. Just trying to tie it back on topic; so with the crit mechanic changed, while it's still not going to be as interesting whether we're dealing with Shock or Normal during Hail Marys, the Mary player will no longer be as safe trying to do that with a 2W/NWI model after eliminating all DA sources and the defending player will want more trash level AROs because even crits aren't guaranteed to kill a Traumadoc.
Ah right. I can appreciate that difference, and it does seem like your meta is different from mine. I don't think we've discussed it inside the meta at great length, but I get the feeling that people are trying to get a +3 range band at 8" to 16" more than trying to get +6 inside 8" around here - but, and this is important, Combis aren't seen as good weapons because it pushes the cost up too far. I do know that my primary O-12 mirror match nemesis likes his Plasma Carbine a lot more than either of us likes the Razor BSG, whom even though they have Infiltration, I'm inclined to say the Lynx is by far the better of the two. I don't think I've seen Mary Problems being used to shoot stuff, either, but she tends to be placed like an anti-HI sentry so she usually have problems getting out - but then again I tend to play with a lot of HI so I haven't really seen her in games where the opponent has mostly non-hackables. I must say, though, that leaving a sniper out for ARO in some way is very common and Flash really does make a difference when it disables the primary attack piece (like that one game when my Chaiyi disabled a Maghriba on second order or when both my Zuyong HMG managed to get crit, one after the other, by a CA Messenger remote...). They might not be big volume, but they tend to make a huge difference.
Actually makes active dodging quite interesting. Bait out a shot and dodge back inside cover. DO I SMELL AN INDIRECT BUFF TO HI AND TAGS HERE? Effectively the same, but with fewer maths. Yay. So either mad spray in the general direction of the enemy, or giving somebody a face full of buckshot. Amazing!
Sorry, my sense of smell isn't that good. :c I came here as fast as I could once I heard HI stuff come about! 0:
You mean Böyg who, besides being Gotland dialectal slang for homosexual, references a powerful gnome? Sure, it could be S5, but that's quite an unusual interpretation of a gnome...
