Of course it's important to acknowledge weaknesses, I'm not talking about that kind of comments. It's just that, to me, some people are saying trooper X is bad and not worth your time without even testing it first. Abstract discussion was fine when we didn't have the profiles/army yet, but now... That's what I'm referring to. Edit: I've played against a Nomad player with Hecklers, the HD+ nun (sorry I don't remember her name) and Morans. Most of the time the Jammers are actually outside de DZ, trying to slow down your approach. In those cases, the Liu Xing seems worth it. ... And I just noticed Explode LX could be Explode LiuXing (?)
I think this is a bit disingenuous. Liu Xing may be the first AD with the HI label, but they’re hardly the first with two wounds. Diomedes, Fraacta, Gao Tarsos, and Duroc all have existed for quite some time, it’s not exactly a new concept. It’s unique thing is explode and only 2 of its 4 profiles even remotely lean into that. Don’t give us a different flavor of tiger, give us an entirely different desert. Embrace explode and design the unit around it instead of making it feel like a tacked on gimmick. As far as I can tell from the forum, folks like the boarding shotgun profile the best (including this very post) and I don’t think it’s a coincidence that that profile’s loadout and cheapness happen to be the most incentivizing for aggressive use of explode. Edit: I was mistaken. Even though she’s only got one wound, Margot is the first AD troop with the HI label.
If you want to be entirely correct here, Louie is the first AD trooper with a Hackable non-Hacker profile and the only profile so far with Explode LX. That's the extent of their uniqueness. The rest isn't unique, just overall a fairly solid, low-end premium, statline.
I salute your glorious devotion to the Shooting Star! Here's my take on using max Liu Xing: Brute Force ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 LIÚ XĪNG Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 32) LIÚ XĪNG Spitfire / Pistol, CC Weapon. (2 | 39) LIÚ XĪNG (Specialist Operative) MULTI Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 38) LIÚ XĪNG Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 38) GŪIJIĂ MULTI HMG, Heavy Flamethrower / AP CCW. (2 | 88) GŪIJIĂ PILOT Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. () SON-BAE Yaókòng Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17) ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 11) ZHANSHI Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 11) ZHANSHI (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12) ZHANSHI (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12) 6 SWC | 298 Points Open in Infinity Army So dumb. So fun.
You are trying to simplify the discussion surrounding AHDs far too much to try and create an argument. AHDs are underpowered conceptually speaking. This does not mean you cannot have good profiles with AHDs. Far from it. What it means is you can't just slap them on a unit with decent stats and expect them to be useful because they have inherent drawbacks. You can put a Spitfire on a BS14 model and expect it to be useful in a vacuum. There's no real downside here you get a decent gun with a decent BS. You shoot stuff with it, it's not rocket science. You can't put an Assault Hacking Device on a WIP14 model and expect it to be useful in a vacuum. You create a new vulnerability in a model and vector for attack and aren't even guaranteed the model will be able to use its AHD depending on the opponent. This is why stuff like the AHD Hac Tao or Locusts aren't particularly popular. To overcome their downsides the AHDs normally want to be a mix of able to defend themselves or difficult to attack, and also cheap enough to be disposable so if they do draw the ire of a KHD you can afford to kiss them goodbye and not worry about it too much. So things you look for in a bearer for an AHD: Relatively cheap. Guilang's a good AHD, Ninja and Zencha aren't because they both cost over 40pts. Brawler is a special mention at 17pts being ludicrously cheap and the Barid isn't far behind him at 19pts Difficult to attack. Normally this means a marker state. This generally forces a LOF interaction to attack them which makes it more difficult to safely remove them. Alternatives to this include being in a hacker heavy force, and being hard to safely target. So Nomads for example it's often force of numbers are helpful in this regard. Alternatively Mary Problems is in a unique area where she possess both types of hacking devices. Having access to pitchers is also another way AHDs attempt to stay safe by hanging a long way back out of the midfield where infiltrating KHDs often lurk. Barids and Druze are good example of this There are plenty of AHDs worth taking, they're not that rare, more than half the parent factions have good AHD profiles available, even Pan-O has access to good AHD profiles. The argument is about improving the status quo for AHDs so there are fewer dud AHD profiles like Father Knights and Ninjas, not that AHDs are never worth bringing.
So many people just ready to rub they opinion all over a thread whenever the chance comes up. Give it a break, Put it away. Thanks for the batreps @Joametz, your writing style was fun. Glad you found a way to apply copious Liu xing for hilarity and win the day! I do love me some AD so will definitely have to try multiple Liu xing sometime
Real fun write up! They really are great. I switched back to OSS this week, and trying to bring on my Garuda to hunt lt and hacker against an opponent we’ll deployed to counter made me miss the Liu Xing for durability and force!
Maybe my bias towards the Fraccta is showing but I just find having 2 wounds is such a big deal it trumps anything the Tiger does for the most part. The expense of the Liu Xing is made up for by how well IA does limited insertion lists. While expensive, the Multi-Rifle Liu Xing can complete various objectives and threaten even TAGs. Compared to the cheapest infiltrator that IA has, the 34 point Zhencha, I'd say its well worth the cost. While maybe in generic Yu JIng you'd take the Tiger just to save points, in IA the Liu Xing should be a workhorse.
Yeah and it's a disappointment, but we're all just gonna have to come together and learn how to deal.
It's not, because it's hackable and operates well outside of the KHD support the army can provide. This isn't Nomads or CA, or Haqq, where you can fire a pitcher to delete the offending hacker to create space for your Liu Xing. Your KHDs are bound to your link for IA.
@Joametz I'm sorry but you're completely wrong. Despite your actual tournament tested data shows I have pages and pages of speculation from as soon as the profiles were spoiled that told us its terrible. Little did you know that there are hackers and jammers everywhere with amazing repeater networks completely canvassing every deployment zone ever. If you ever find an opening in a players deployment zone then your opponent is terrible and your win doesn't count at all.So really you lost all of your matches and IA was a mistake. Also limited insertion doesn't count either because reasons so you lost again. /s In all seriousness man that is awesome and I loved reading the batrep. Congrats on the win and let the haters sip on their Haterade. Not only did you do serious work with the Liu Xing you brought 4 and completely memed people to death with it! Congrats on the wins and it sounded like you had a ton of fun on top of all of it as well which is icing on the cake!
Limited insertion 8 player event local event Not located in any place that has a significant wargaming scene Jokes aside, let's not get ahead of ourselves here. I win local events with the Guijia , doesn't make the Guijia good and I certainly don't try to pretend it does.
To be fair, your really negative. Much the same with MO, I think you over emphasize the weaknesses of some units and are too quick to dismiss their strengths. And then someone does well with a unit you dislike you quickly dismiss it. Thats kind of irritating. Generally, I don't find player's DZ full of repeaters and hackers so the Liu Xing tends to be safe in that regard. As a flanking unit in the mid-field he does a good job as well. Do you have to be careful with him, sure but he can be quite effective.
Being negative about a unit that isn't very good is a pretty normal reaction. Dismissing people that are trying to champion this particular example as a reason to why the Liu Xing is a great model isn't unwarranted either. An 8 man limited insertion local event in South America of all places isn't a particularly useful set of data at all. Like I said, I win local events at the opposite ass end of the world with the Guijia, I don't try to base arguments around those though, because like this one, they're not a great example of anything. Putting aside Limited Insertion is an unbalanced joke format that revolves waaay too much around alpha striking, that event wasn't exactly what you'd describe as high caliber. You show up and win a 60 player convention tournament with 4 liu xings, I'll be far more impressed. Stomping the locals with a meme list? Ehhh... not so much.
Maybe, but they aren’t. Which is more constructive, keep complaining about that or discuss how to make the Liu Xing work for people that want to use it? I mean it’s fine to acknowledge the LX’s limitations, but at some point it’s no longer helpful.
The whole it's not your list it's you rings true here. Good players can win with units people think are bad. It's one of the reasons that makes infinity such a great game. Speaking of jokes I love you just casually dismiss the entire continent of south America. I mean you take smug superiority to new heights. Look I get it you wanna be upset and have others commiserate with you. No one wants to be salty all alone down in the salt mines.
Whoah whoah whoah that's way too much of a logical adult reaction to an emotional problem that is literally out of our control. I mean come on where do you think we are?!
