If JSA is completely split from vanilla is still a heavily discussed rumour. But for this discussion I want to set it as a fact. So no JSA troops in Vanilla or ISS. There are some questions that come to my mind. - Which JSA profiles would miss the most apart from the all present ninja killer hacker. - What kind of profiles would you replace the lost ones with? - And as a general thought, what kind of changes to the YJ factions could be possible in case of updated profiles or new troops that would otherwise be too powerful to add to YJ if JSA is still present.
Primarily a JSA player slowly going into Vanilla and kind of theorizing, but here are some things they would also miss out on that would potentially be good: +Keisotsu for being two points cheaper than Zhanshi but more reliable than the Kuang Shi (some experienced players will definitely disagree, but I like Keisotsus as a potential option when I get into Vanilla). +Oniwaban for the sheer ability of being able to alpha strike on your opponent's side of the board. +Aragotos if you are also looking for the sheer ability to alpha strike on your opponent's side very quickly. This said, Yu Jing does have some options that semi-cover the last two but those are kind of the three main units I can see some people take in Vanilla from JSA (of course, you can argue for other units such as Domaru or Karakuri but there has to be a stronger case for them). Something that would cover the bikes is some hypothetical ISS unit who is more about moving up to discover or so, but not something I do not count on. Yu Jing would definitely survive but it would kind of limit what they can take. Not to mention it could upset some people who do like including a mix of JSA and other Yu Jing units in vanilla.
Loss of the Tokusetsu Butai means everyone will have to shave 1-2 points off of their vanilla lists. I always prefer the Guijia as a TAG when I play vanilla, but I know a lot of vanilla TAG players favor the OYoroi because of the Koalas.
Yeah, most of the JSA units won't matter much for Vanilla, but Oniwabans, Tokusetsu, O-Yoroi and Keisotsu will make a huge impact. For ISS, loss of Ninja is going to hurt. Hard.
I kind of think even if they split the factions and make YJ lose access to a bunch of stuff Ninjas won't be on the list, because that would mess up Red Veil as a purchase option.
I believe the right thing to do with the ninja is to have them work for both sides, its what they do. Also, if you're are going to do JSA without ninja you may as well not do anything at all, I mean, why would you need cyber japanese without cyber samurai, cyber ninja and giant robots?
Probably there are ninjas loyal to JSA and others that remain loyal to Yu Ing in general or ISS. I would not expect an official JSA slit but maybe another unaligned army for Japanese seperatives. Maybe with kempeitai as standard infantry (as with druze in their new sectorial). And as Tey are torrorists in the eyes of yujing, maybe there is some connection to the big other superpower. So maybe some hexas and other pano equipment?
I'm rooting for a proper split. However, I expect ninjas to stay AVA1 in ISS (maybe even vanilla) simply because they're ninjas and might not have the same considerations regarding loyalty. The rest doesn't feel as critical. Some stuff go missing, but there are other stuff instead. /shrug.
ninjas are described in human sphere N3 as total mercenaries in Yu Jing society, i doubt Yu Jing vanill lsoe them anyway. I know some people who pick raidens some time, i never played it but losing aragotos will hurt a bit ( the spitfire one is a gret datatracker to kill the HTV)
So, considering that JSA is an army division within the Yu Jing military and that Japanese territories aren't exactly separate from the rest of Yu Jing society, they'd have to retcon a lot of things to make a completely separate JSA work. On the other hand, a rebelling JSA would get shutdown, its industries seized and any verified loyalist units subsumed within the proper Yu Jing military structure. This leaves a possibility for a large number of JSA elements to go mercenary. If I were to speculate wildly, this might be the reason why Haramaki haven't seen a release at all - these young 'uns I'd tag as possible insurrectionists and if Domaru are subsumed into IA as an assault division, the Haramaki could resurface as an Ikari Company unit (i.e. Ronin). If this sleep deprived theory proved true, I would wonder where O-yoroi and above all Karakuri would go. These require an extensive support industry and sophisticated equipment that a Ronin outfit would struggle to maintain. I'm actually warming up to the idea of a Ronin mercenary company. Especially if JSA got cherry picked into IA (where JSA Samurai loyalists would fit in if f.ex. Liuxing were tagged as Korean and we got a few other more regional regiments within IA - only caveat is that Domaru would need tweaking since loss of cheao and accurate Haramaki would devastate their link viability)
I can't help but wonder why people can't keep a separate track of rumors and instead tend to mix them. Liu Xing is mandarin, so no way it can be a Korean unit. The Korean unit rumor was a mechanized deployment HI. Right now there's a single one korean name in the rooster: Son Bae
maybe we should sticky a thread with all Yu Jing rumours. It's not like we'll need that JSA tactics one much longer.
I know it's mandarin. Korean HI has been a thing for a very long time, if memory serves it also stopped being developed way before Mechanized Deployment was a thing, which is why I think people have associated AD infantry with Korean (and I do mean AD, not MD) and why I wrote that they'd need to specifically associate it with the Korean forces, the tacit context being that with a Chinese name that doesn't really happen automagically. or, of course, change name of it to Yuseong
I certainly think that this will be what happens if the split does come to pass. Plus it sounds like the best idea at the moment.
The one unit I would miss, and is also the most likely to go is the kempeitei with its chain of command options. Most of the sectorial army’s lieutenants are a tad aggressive and easy to get out of position, and the Keisotsus lt option has high swc.
What do you mean haramaki have not seen a release at all? There are haramaki, rather old ones and thus not up to the new size standard. But haramaki we do have.
The Kempei are nearly guaranteed to end up in whatever the traitor sectorial ends up being (if it even ends up being), I wouldn't worry about that. Also, since Kempei has essentially 0 value to vanilla, losing them doesn't matter too much for Yu Jing at large. @Abydog precisely, they're one of the absolutely oldest models still in service and have been for a very long time with much more recent sculpts getting updated.
My intention for this thread was not to discuss the rumours, but to think about which profiles would be a loss and what new option could arise with that. I for myself would deeply miss the doctor and engineer in Vanilla, you because I have the models painted and I don't like the Zhanshi variants. Apart from that, its 2 points that cant be use elsewhere. A non-existent ninja killer hacker would mean the rise of the kanren, with the problem that he can be better targeted if the enemy has turn1. The tactic to use the 29 ninja in the last turn to clain objectives or quadrants would be missed deeply. I did use the aragoto from time to time, but mostly I find them dead before turn 2, so not be able to use them would help my order pool. ;-) I would think that drop troppers could maybe close that gap. I never used the Oniwaban because I don't own the models, but I can't think of a good replacement in terms of that threat potential against TAGs. I would be interesting to have a new profile for that role without being a Oniwaban copy.
