I really like this explanation. I feel like when something new comes out, the imitate knee jerk reactions are, “these profiles are trash and over costed.” Or “These profiles are hyper optimized and way better than anything else in game.” I think a measure of power creep in inevitable. It’s good business to make the new shiny appealing in profile as well as models sculpted to capitalize on making a new faction as desirable as possible to at least some in the player base. Over the years CB has also been good about going back and making updates to existing armies after big game and rule changes were introduced through new armies. I think of things like when new skills like NCO or TA were introduced, other factions got a smattering of the skills tossed around to share the love. I thinks that’s a trend we’ll continue to see.
As a sectorial, TB is still being judged in the void. We were shown the approximate profiles, not the final ones. We were shown only the starter box profiles, too. There is, for example, a TAG in the lsit we haven't yet seen the rpofile for - and judging by the recent CB approach, I expect it to be an S6 "light TAG", to complement Starmanda's Zeta, which is a classic MBT. How will the Wrecker compare to, say, a Blue Wolf, we are yet to see.
Of course we're judging it into the void, but it is normal to voice these comments as the preliminary profile drops, because this is a feedback from the people who will play with/against these profile. The comments about WB and IA comparison are interesting, although I don't agree about monk/hellblazers comparisons. Monks are cheap, one wound and don't threaten targets with EXP hits. This thing is tough and can survive long enough to shank something with that ugly pointy nonsense. But it fears hackers.
This is the truth, sadly. If you want to compete on equal footing you better play a recently revamped Sectorial, peak game balancing. And I disagree about CB being good about rebalancing old Sectorials.
It's a bit different here, the issue isn't power level at all, and I expect any HI focused faction to end up on the weak side of the meta anyway. No, here you have a new sectorial that took 3 of the most emblematic units of an older one, and simply upgraded them. The white banner comparison doesn't make sense because white banner doesn't have zuyongs, zhenchas and liu xings. I have a list that I really like with a zuyong core and various solo units around, and I can already make an upgraded version of it with what we have here (except for the daoying). As an avid IA player I feel pretty dejected right now, it's hard not to see a release like that as CB aknowledging all the things that are wrong with IA, but they still won't fix them. The only reasons left to play IA are shang-jis, daoying and hac tao, that's not what I signed up for with IA...
This kinda mirrors PanO players reception when O-12 first came out. Everything there felt similar, but just a bit more optimised and interesting. Good BS, hi-tech, but also good WIP, more liberal use of secondary weapons, additional skill here and there, competetive pricing, much better support structure. Lynx vs Hexa, Epsilon vs Nisse, Omega vs ORC...
Just wait, till O-12 would get sectorials to mimic each other faction, and they would start crusade against aliens to the distant stars.
I think we are safely in the prerelease hype/ doom phase, things will settle down as usual when people start playing with the sectorial.
Indeed, it feels like that to me too, too much reminiscence from Operation Wildfire's release. Also, if experience serves right, older profiles may get a slight paintjob, but won't get properly updated until it's their Codex time. I mean... relaunch time. It is only if you plan to not sell the old product anymore. If you are rotating and trying to make your only clients whales who buy only the latest, most optimum stuff, then... I'm afraid CB has forgotten that Infinity is played with much less models than GW's games, so they will fill the whale's model room much faster, while making harder (even harder, I mean) for new players to get in. So if a sectorial has useless profiles and really good ones more than enough for a game breaking list, it's balanced? Quite the fallacy here! As for the "judged in the void", the other option is to wait until they release it all, then at leas six months for balance. If any. After all, they consider all IA models have sold whatever they needed to return the investment, and now extra sales are "free money"... Or simply tire of their feedback being ignored and leave the game...
It looks like TB is the "videogames" sectorial XD We got other references to comics and movies, now "videogames". About not many profiles going to vainilla or viceversa I think is a good thing. They are always a feeling about vainilla armies having too many profiles, plus "sectorials" not being a charismatic as they should because they have too many vainilla profiles and nothing unique. Don´t know, to me is a good thing. Vainilla is vainilla, TB is TB. They share, but not too much. I have here the feeling we will find TB same as Morats, when they were released we thought they will be broken as hell, but in the end they weren´t the worse thing. Yes, they are powerfull, but in "play" they are too directs that makes then Ok to face. It looks to be some kind of hybrid between MO and IA, but lets wait until we see all the profiles. For the moment it looks like the will not have too many cheap units. I think, TRUE :( Sadly. WB even invalidated SWF. We will see... they are even worse comparison inside O-12 I don´t think they forget about the prime in fireteams. I choose to believe they understood prime should have it :) But what I see, let´s wait and see. I think this is something we need to take in consideration. Yes, it was a patch over Taskmaster, but a good one I think. About TB being a better IA, yes, it could be, but from another point of view, that some armies have sectorial or options to play as others isn´t as bad as we can think. They are for sure players who want´s to play as IA or MO but they wan´t to go into another faction for many reason, so they have now the chance. However, let´s see what the other profiles are.
And this is the option I propose: wait till they release the complete sectorial, with its actual profiles. Not the "subject to change" profiles Bostria presented yesterday. Are you calling relying on actual, playable profiles a fallacy? I'd say, it is quite the gall here!
I think Optimus will be fine in reality I wish the Kriza has BS Attack (-3) but mostly just for thematic reasons rather than anything else. I do think the best new unit by far is the Strider, who seem to be 5pts cheaper than the Sombra for reasons I can't work out, but also eh, nbd
Sombra is non-Hackable, and has Climbing Plus. Howm nay points, exactly, is non-Hackability worth (and whether it is worth that much), well, it's anyone's guess...
Indeed. And also, what we've seen about Strider might still differ from the final published version. I guess mathematically, in terms of CB point formula, it checks out. In terms of on-table performance, we're just about to see. In my meta, hackers aren't that prevealent - and I've always conidered hacking Hi with Stealth to be a nuisance. Though TLB's arrival might force a change in the meta. Not to mention - that's my local meta. Hardly representative...
I'd say that the Strider's NCO probably costs about the same as the C+ on the Sombra and the difference is due to the hackable trait. Honestly that seems fair though; hackable is a big downside imo. A lot of the places that Strider wants to go, it can't because it risks an Oblivion to the face. I will say that it's a bit meta dependent, but my own experience is that hackers with SSL2 are a regular thing. And active turn hacking is real; if I was facing a Strider I'd definitely be thinking "let's hit it with Oblivion"
