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Jammer into CC

Discussion in 'Rules' started by eciu, Jan 29, 2018.

  1. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Sooo if Jammer is bleeding edge of technology weapon which ignores Walls/LoF/ODD/TO/Eclipse/Smoke/everything is it also unaffected by -6 mod while "shooting" into CC ?
     
  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Until this is clarified otherwise: no.

    You can not possibly convince me that shooting into CC goes into the category of MODs due to visibility conditions -.-;;
     
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  3. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    If only we had some way to mark modifiers which affect (and stack) with BS attacks something you know like small key-words which goes categorize things out.....
     
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  4. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Why not ? I would consider partially obscured target (or fast moving) the same way 2 guy struggling to put sharp objectes into each other ...
     
  5. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    And range is only distance of vision...

    Shooting into CC is meant to be two units fighting. They don't stand where the models stand and shoot with a mistimed shot and you'll hit your friend, not because you couldn't ser but because the target and your buddy suddenly moved.
     
  6. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    You aware that technicly Jammer also ignores range as it has ZoC tag xD

    Men I love the mess Jammer BS attack is ^^ I must create a thread "Which BS attack rules does actually Jammer follow/use" xD
     
  7. Shingen

    Shingen Well-Known Member

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    But jammer is labelled as Comms. Attack, and -6 mod applies to BS attacks only…

    So, no BS modifiers for jammer.
     
  8. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Which seems not to be a problem when targeting fast moving motorcycles which are additionally equipped with cutting edge technology which does disrupt your vision ^^
     
  9. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Quote:

    • The user of a Jammer can declare a BS Attack using his WIP Attribute against a target within his ZoC. However, this weapon does not require LoF to the target.

    And again:

    • Comms Attack. The use of this Special Skill or piece of Equipment is a form of Attack that allows the target to declare Reset as a response.

    All what Comms Attack label do is to say that you cannot "dodge" the attack which is using this label put you reset against it (so again you use your WIP not your PH against it).
     
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  10. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Oh yess, but the ZoC label isn't the one that gets it free from ODD etc. :)
    The weapon is a Comms Attack but you have to declare a BS Attack (the skill) to use it, so it qualifies for both.
     
  11. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    No, but kinda says it doesn't care about the distance (again "technicly") ;P
    No the Comms Attack is a "reversed" label akin to "Technical Weapon" which "just" changes the attribute you roll on when attacking/defending against given weapon.
     
  12. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Hah, but only Japan is cutting edge, everyone else relies on silly low-tech smoke!

    But seriously, a Surprise Shot may be that you can't see the enemy, but it's still not a MOD like ODD, same goes for inadvertently ducking behind cover due to Suppression Fire or Full Auto. It's still doesn't fall under the alterations of what the FAQ made us play with.
     
  13. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    So you mean it qualifies for both in other words.

    No, by the way, Comms Attack means Reset works against it. It is also a Technical Weapon, which is why you use WIP.
     
  14. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    You can use the Jammer against CC, the Mutta will roll at 9, and if rolling between 10 and 15, hit his partner. I would do it without remorse depending on what is that mini fighting... And would use ADL launcher aswell.

    As for the -6 being applied, rules are rules, not perfect emulations of the world. The explanation, if you want it, is that you target a bubble where to condense the microwaves, and during a melee any of the dancers can get affected.
     
  15. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    I have no problem with either ruling, what I'm pointing out is that there is no clear information if this mod should affect jammer or not. It's easy to argue that -6 mod is "visual" mod (or not).

    Oh Jammer, only weapon which should have it's own skill and doesn't have it...
     
  16. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Jammer is a BS attack with the Comms Attack label, so it falls under the "-6 to BS attacks". Overthinking can be... like time travel in Star Trek. In the words of Admiral Janeway, "don't" XD
     
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  17. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    So does the TO/ODD and by the hi-tech of Jammer technology it's not affecting it ;P
     
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  18. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    LdF requirements, as mentioned in other post about the Jammer.

    Explaining the same things time and again becomes really tiring. In that regard, I understand why the staff avoids posting about rules as much as they do.
     
  19. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Ghazi are broken enough as is, let's not go rules fishing for even more advantages.
     
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  20. derbrizon

    derbrizon Well-Known Member

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    Is there text on the wiki somewhere which explains in detail the implication of what "no lof" means? People keep referencing that Jammer ignores "visual" mods, but I can't find a phrase to this effect, and mimetism and such just says to impose a mod against enemy BS atacks.

    I DO see that mimetism etc. affects BS attacks, and jammer is a bs attack. The "No LoF" tag intuitively means I don't have to draw a line to you from my sil, but LoF rules don't mention mimetism and the like... There's no "No LoF" page, and the attributes pages don't seem to show that label. An faq I missed??
     
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