Riot Grrls are stupidly well optimized with the near-cheating Frenzy thrown in, but I dare say that the more CB designs missions with stuff like the AC2 or even just the simplistic scenery boxes of Supremacy, the more the Zuyong will shine. I think that the basic options they provide as a fireteam are excellent and I think they are an even more supreme canvas for sectorial refinements that doesn't even have to be as extreme as those that Wu Ming or Riot Grrls received, and given a choice between a Wu Ming and a Zuyong link I'm not sure I'd actually want the restrictions that Wu Ming demand for the tools they offer. The mere fact that it's very hard to fit a decent LT into an ISS Wu Ming list just exasperates this, making Wu Ming very costly. Shang-Ji on the other hand, as we've detailed extensively, are much more likely to simply get forgotten unless innovated.
I think part of the reason why we don't get that in vanilla and ISS is the Kuang Shi Situation: if we are getting 5 regular orders for 0.5 CAP and 33 pts it seems kinda "too good" to get AVA 3 or something on 8 pts bots. However, if we don't get Kuang Shi for IA (which seems pretty logical to me), maybe having superior AVA on remotes becomes fitting.
I highly doubt they'll not give mixed link and interesting options to the Terracotas. That's the entire point of the Invincible Army is an unkillable force to show how powerful the state empire's HI are and how much they protect their troops, right? There's zero reason to suspect they'll only get core with no option to mix in other units or add in interesting options.
It would be interesting to see a sectorial designed around LI only. Although that might place constraints on Infinity if CB every wanted to take the game in another direction. I don't know if it would look that different to other sectorials, but I'd be curious nonetheless.
I think we have to view them as being halfway between line troopers and HI, which is really what they're designed as. They may not shine as much as Wu Ming and Riot Grrrls, which are two of the game's most playable HI links, but their equipment is definitely a bit more interesting than your typical LI link.
Since Ikari is getting a missile bot in their Wu Ming Link, There better be similar for IA! If not a bot like that then I'd be fine with a baggage carrying some panzerfausts. :)
I think its safe to say the shang ji is either receiving a huge redesign or its going the way of the dodo as its the only HI profile in yu jing not to receive a resculpt (I think). It would be cool to see a mixed link with limited ammo weapons and a linked baggage bot. That could allow CB to cheapen the HI profiles as well as provide cheap orders that aren't bland.
Yeah, I think Shang-Ji sculpt is older than the Terracotta they killed off with the release of N3. @St.Craft while I don't quite get the fascination people have for slotting in weaklings as it makes HI links have built-in weaknesses, do try the YuanDun list D out. Personally I love Rui Shi for the fact that they are sufficient in and of themselves. Slot them with Zuuong and they just get slower and gives you a higher concentration of force in a small area.
Thx for advice, but im vanila player :(, i dont have any iss minic beside kanren, rui shi and hsien. And rui shi ava 2 , one in link and one free
No, the Shang Ji came out with Human Sphere N2 (it was in the resculpted YJ starter pack), and there was at least one of the old Invincibles around before then (HMG, I think...) But the Shang Ji is about the oldest model left in the game now, except the basic REMs. Across all factions. Only the Nomad Catgirl Daktari and the Tankhunter Autocannon are older. I like the Stempler/Weibing (combi+FO+Sensor) option. Ping! Oh, Hai, U can haz HMG now... SMLbots are a bit overkill most of the time, unless there's some bonus I'm not seeing for keeping a Mortar/ATGM as close to the front as possible (those are usually a couple hundred meters behind the front lines).
@St.Craft the gist of it; Hsien HMG in a 5-man link. But the Rui Shi I like because it mimics vanilla's strength of spreading out threats across multiple angles and a large area. I don't think it gets stronger in a fireteam. Mileage may vary and all that of course. @Section9 they made hieroglyph models THAT late? Well, close enough. Those are some uninspiring models.
Hsien in 5 man team of hi in ia? I really dont think we can afford that, hsien in 5 man with zanshi? I dont belibe in that. Rui shi bring msv 2 in ia links, and we know that ia for now quiete laking in this aspekt, that why i hope for rui shi links, and i really glad to know your opinion about rui shi :)
I can't see either of those coming true to be honest. Hsien is really an IS thing instead of an IA thing. And We haven't seen them link the Combat Bots outside of Missile bots which they could've done in Tunguska with the Tsyklons. If any bot gets linked it'd probably be a missile bot again, or maybe Pangulings (although TR bot in link sounds stupidly broken)
Gah! There is such a thing as being too concise. Sorry about that. No, YuanDun List D is true to its letter, it features a Hsien in a 5-man team of 4 HI and a Zhanying. It has the drawback of not featuring any Sophotect nor Killer Hacker while having two Hackers and no Deflector in that fireteam. List D also has the Celestial Guard smoker in a Haris - something I'm direly missing a lot of the time when constructing lists. Point is, you get the fullpowered, overpowered, version of a highly functional MSV2 in a 5-man team. It is not a list you play with against Tunguska or Haqq/Hassassin however. - I would still rather not have a situation where I'd have to rely on a weakling to flesh out my fireteam with the tools I need. I'm not fond of it in Wu Ming links, and it is the bane of my existence with Crane links. I would appreciate it if THE HI sectorial was designed with mixed *HI* fireteams. Mixing Weibing etc would be appropriate for adding utility to support units (Zhanshi equivalents) Also, REMs are inadequately dimensioned and function to replace Zhanshi equivalents, I sincerely hope we don't have to rely on Chaiyi for cheap orders - that would be sufficient to utterly break the sectorial since it would become ultimately dependent on favourable terrain in a way no other sectorial is.
I think the haris Grenzer with the Spitfire profile and a KHD Interventor for a specialist and boarding shotgun to the link is legit good. Also, I think the Grenzer is finally shining, how is it not awesome to pick the profiles you actually want an fill the rest with cheaper Securitates? My Grenzer MSR is finally seeing action in Tunguska and so far he’s been performing quite nicely! :)
For now Invincible army has too many flaws. A average high cost per trooper to play lists that have more than just one group It'll be hard. because in invincible will probably be hard to get more than 13-14 orders. This disadvantage could be reduced due to AI beacons, Liberos (free agents), or counterinteligence... but who knows if we're gonna get any of those Lack of CoC or veterans: Loss of lieutenant will be a high blow with such a poor order pool. A Sectorial that relies It's security on ARM in a game that gives poor importance to it. There are plenty and common tools to deal with IT. High burst weapons, AP munition, Multiplewound munitions... Antytank weapons (autocannon, misile launcher and feuerbach) A lot of weight on AD troops to deal alpha strikes. We have the tiger Soldiers and a Rumoured AD HI called Liu Xing. This Will probably make the EVO hacker the Predominant Support hacker in IA and will increase further the cost Aparent lack of mid table presence and Table control oriented troops. But it was romoured a Corean heavy troop with Mechanized deployment for some time now Expensive ARO pieces (Yan-huo Neurocinetics, Tiger sniper, or Hactao ML...) Lack of Warbands Lack of tools to deal with TO/DDO : Lack of Visors (except on remotes), just a cople of direct templates Limited access to close range countermeasures (combi+Light shotguns, nanopulsers, Chain rifles...) in basic/afordable troops A A Mediocre doctor for an army based on expensive troops and a low order pool to waste. Mediocre engineer + Almost all of their reliable troops will be Hackable The bulk of the army vulnerable to ovblivion... and almost no resources to undo it Lack of Smoke to make safe advances Lack of grenades and speculative fire Lack of antimaterial CC for missions like Looting and Sabotaging Lack of Veteran, Elite and headquarter troops for Hunting party Lack of good/usefull hackers ... But testers keep saying Invincible works good. I don't know If I can trust them... they seem to have strange judgment... Sometimes so brilliant and sometimes so weird.
@Mc_Clane To the point of the testers, they at least have access to profiles we know nothing about at this time.
Yep, they have, but they've also passed through profiles like Pheasant rank with PH 10 grenades and a lot of CC investment just to deal damage 10. Or rules like sniffer, deactivator... that no one uses.Or things like tarik's faltality Lv2 and that datatracker extra order...for no cost. My trust on them is limited because I don't know how much they've influenced those decisions and officially they seem to align with them. But this game is soo permeable to OP rules and crappy profiles that it gives the sense that nothing would be really disbalancing.
I use Sniffers, and see them used in top tier play (which I mostly watch from the sidelines as I'm not a top-tier player but I go to those events). Camospam Ariadna or Nomads are pretty common and sniffers with Sensor (2 8-point messenger bots and a 16-point Sensor/FO botare a tactic I've seen used repeatedly to turn a board full of spammy markets into a bunch of dudes with their shorts around their ankles. Deactivator is going to see a lot more play now that the toolkit Sensor/FO bots are entering linkteams more often and everyone who can is using Spector with dropbears, tons of perimeter weapons in ISS or Nomads, etc., so it may have been immediate availability that was limiting its use more than lack of utility.
