To be fair, it's equivalent of about 1,5 BS or so save for situations where you're shooting heavily against the odds - then its impact is more noticeable. My guess it's in the context of comparing to 2W units - those NWIs cannot be healed after taking enough wounds to render them inactive since that means going to dead for them. I'm clearly missing something, how do you do so? I won't be surprised if you'll have to buy an entire Red Veil box for Fasid HMG to do that.
According to Dodge skill: In Reactive Turn only, a successful Dodge allows the user to Move—or use another Short Movement Skill that doesn't require a Roll—up to 2 inches. Super-Jump and Climbing Plus alter Jump and Climb from Entire Orders to Short Movement Skills, so after a successful Dodge our Khawarijs can use Jump and Lasiqs can use Climb.
That's interesting. Climbing plus doesn't even need you to declare Climb specifically in order to work, so while I knew it works with Dodge movement, I was missing that clause saying you can actually use other Short Movement Skill.
I'll just leave it here: Spoiler 30-40% of success in active turn (and it's with the full link bonuses!) is lame?! I don't think so, subject-citizen.
Lol. I pull out this calculator whenever people start moaning about FAT2. Thanks for saving me the effort.
To be fair, I think you might have left the Khawarij's weapons on pistols or something since they're firing at -6 while the Orc's firing at +3. If we give them both good ranges, we get something more like this: Spoiler About 43% to 38%. Not broken or anything, but a lot better than 31% to 65% =P
Uh, yeah. A a roughly 1/3 chance of winning when firing at -9 or -6 odds vs BS 17 (i.e. taking a gunfight you have no business taking) is exactly what I'm talking about when I same lame and braindead. If a model with a spitfire fires without FAT2 in that scenario at BS4, their ability to win the firefight drops off a cliff. That's why it's a braindead rule and no fun to play against, it's a highly volatile, swingy rule that heavily benefits people who take stupid firefights they shouldn't be taking. Why, do you find not punishing players for taking BS4 fights an example of good game play? Remember that roughly 15% increased chance to inflict a wound is the product of another critical hit. Does this make sense as to why some people consider this a frustrating and brain dead rule?
I wouldn't call complaints about increasing the effectiveness of the critical hit rule a troll post, but you do you I guess.
Think of it as their defensive mod. If you run the numbers, it only has a slight edge over mimetism in terms of winning them the gun fight and inflicting a wound on the ORC – assuming good ranges for both. Granted, Fatality 2 will tip the scales more as you leave your sweet spot. Fatality 2 is the slightly higher one: I think this skill is more psychological than anything – nobody likes to be crit and it never feels good.
You're shooting in the good range band. Change it to -6 and look at the numbers, they're far different. A BS 4 model with Mimetism instead of FAT2 is 19-66% in the Orc's favour. If you give them FAT2 instead of Mimetism it's 32-60% Orc's favour. That's a 13% jump, it's not insignificant. The worse the firefight the more effective FAT2 becomes as it just dumbs the firefight down into a more swing based event. It's got nothing to do with the rule being potentially overpowered, it's got everything to do with it being unfun and braindead to play against and encouraging players to take firefights they have no business taking. If you are firing in your -6 range band into a full five man link you should not have almost a 1/3 chance of inflicting a wound.
I don't know of this is the thread to bring up this fight again, but I really don't see how it's any more brain dead than ODD or other strong mods. Om a different note, when do we expect to see the sculpts? If the models are for February release, do we have about a month to wait? I'm really hoping for some dynamic, athletic poses. The starter Khawarij is great, but I hope he stands in contrast to his brethren. (Also, do we have female Khawarij? That arm does look quite thin.)
ODD doesn't cause big swings in ridiculous firefights. Again, you put ODD on the target firing at BS4, it only raises the odds to 21-56% in the ORC's favour, which is relatively minor compared to the big 32-60% jump FAT2 gives. ODD has counters. ODD doesn't directly bypass and marginalise armour as a stat, which is already overcosted enough as it is. That's why I consider FAT2 a brain dead skill as opposed to TO or ODD, or most other direct MODs. BS4 vs BS17, with or without ODD in the mix the chance of scoring a wound through that is approximately 1/5. If you do the same firefight with FAT2 you change it to a 1/3. The rules biggest benefits are to players who take tactically bad engagements, that's not good gameplay mechanics there when your rule drastically increases in value to players who are playing badly vs players who are playing well. Do you see how it's a brain dead mechanic?
I don't get this "it benefits bad players" thing. Why are you assuming that somebody is using a FAT2 Spitfire at unfavourable bands because they don't know any better or have played badly? It improves chances in unfavourable range bands, so what?, that's just another tool to use.
Because I know a player who does just that. Constantly takes tactically unsound decisions then rides FAT2 to victory. The rule should be changed so it doesn't scale in favour of and enabling bad play.
I must agree with Triumph. When I used Spitfire Tarik, I got in unfavourable situations several times (Camo, Supressive, Long range firefights etc). In those I had two choices: A) Spend orders to reposition myself to catch enemy off cover within 24" of Tarik or get another unit into position. B) Spend 1 Order to peek, close my eyes and spray to win with horrible MODs, but with an additional chance to crit, saving orders for other units. Option B seems too attractive in case of FAT2 It's a problem on high burst weapons, as it currently is. If it was on a Sniper unit instead, only a few people would have an issue with that skill. You know what would be nice? If FAT2 added +1 to BS rolls up to user's BS with other MODs, while only giving crits on a flat roll, so that BS 13 unit rolling 12 wouldn't get a critical.
Mathematically there is no difference. You have a 10% crit chance in both cases compared to a normal chance of 5%. EDIT: Never mind, get you wrong, my fault.
