Another one, because my friend makes me question my sanity. Camo marker declares move. Enemy A declares idle, B declares Discover, C can't see him. Camo marker declares another move. A and B are losing him from his LoF, C can see him now, declares Idle. Lets say that Discover was succesful. My friend thinks that C is eligible to shoot the not-so-anymore Camo marker, i think not. He declared idle, Camo didn't revealed itself, and the camouflage was dropped at the conclussion of the order, so it is not granting C an opportunity to shoot before the next order declaration. Am i right?
Discover is resolved after any AROs are declared, so there is no visible trooper to declare a BS Attack against.
Idle isn't an ARO. They actually declare that they're holding their ARO against that camo token. /semantics
It's also important that you know the difference between 'idle' and 'delay' Idle means you aren't using the ARO, delay means you're waiting for the second skill to declare against it. In your example A would lose the ARO by declaring delay when the marker makes a second move, C would get to declare ARO against the markers second move, were delay isn't an option because there won't be any further action from the marker, and BS attack isn't allowed because its a marker, so really the only option is to declare discover and only then the discover roll(or rolls) would be made. Even removing C from the equation, if A declares delay and B declares discover, A still loses the ARO on the second move of the marker.
technically it is, but the situations that you'd actually want to declare it rather than defaulting to it by other means escape me entirely... Maybe if you have the experimental drug classified objective it might be useful but you'd need to be very careful about weighing up your odds of surviving unconscious vs being killed...
It doesn't have the ARO trait. Ergo it is not an ARO you can opt to declare. Alert and opting not to change facing any troops achieves the same outcome though.
Even if you can declare Idle as an ARO, you never should, because you've now used up your ARO opportunity by doing literally nothing. This now makes you ineligible to even take the free change face from the Warning! rule!
That's kind of the point, idle is the default of not doing anything, it could be argued that you don't have to declare it because you're already doing it... The situations when you'd actually want to Idle are extremely specific and generally you're going to have at least one other opinion that's better or just as terrible. I guess if you end up standing in the trigger area of a bunch of mines in the reactive turn and you have an awful PH you wouldn't want to declare anything...
I’ve always thought of Idle as just a courtesy for your opponent - confirming that your trooper is doing nothing as a ‘pertinent negative’. Is that about right?
Idle explicitly isn't the default of doing nothing, if you want to do nothing you declare "no ARO". If you've declared idle, aside from breaking the rules (as it's not an ARO in the first place), you've also rendered your model illegible from benefitting from warning and triggered any perimeter or deployable weapons in range/trigger area.
I wouldn't have disagreed with that, but think you're right to point out a difference that could be important. I could've said this: more clearly as '... confirming that your trooper is using their ARO to do nothing as a ‘pertinent negative’.
Yes. Except: A) Idle isn't an ARO B) Idle would activate the trooper, whereas 'does nothing' or 'I hold my ARO' does not C) Idle makes is explicit that the Marker / Trooper is actually a Marker / Trooper whereas 'does nothing' does not (Intruders through Smoke pretending to be mines or vice versa) D) All valid AROs drop you out of a Marker state whereas 'doing nothing' or 'I hold my ARO' does not The distinction between 'I do nothing', 'I delay my ARO due Sixth Sense Level 1', 'I hold my ARO vs that Marker' and 'I Alert but nobody elects to Change facing' are important. Replacing them with 'Idle' just makes things confusing.
Completely off the original topic, but Idle is not an ARO. A unit can decline to ARO, but that does not count it as using the Skill Idle. It is a minor, but important distinction for this reason: A Hidden Deployment unit could delay its action against a unit in a marker state, and this takes them out of Hidden Deployment, (but not out of the camo state). However, a Hidden Deployment unit cannot declare Idle as an ARO against any unit (marker or otherwise). If they could this would allow them to react by coming out of Hidden Deployment, but not revealing themselves from the Camo State as a reaction to any unit.
Should be noted that "holding" your aro is expressly not activating either. As such it wont trigger mines ect
Having re-read the rules, I see that as an elective, Idle is only available as a Short Skill in the active turn, but can also be a state that an Order might default to in either turn: So it is never going to be an ARO declaration, but in either the active or reactive turn it is very much a ‘pertinent negative’. I apologize for my confused post.
@Wolf I'm confused. What symptoms are you experiencing? ----- The point remains: saying 'the trooper idles' is never the correct response in ARO. Because it doesn't actually make clear what it is that you're doing. Instead you should use one of the following responses: '<Trooper> doesn't have an ARO at this time' it establishes that you don't believe you've received an ARO. '<Trooper> does nothing' which establishes that you think you have had an opportunity to ARO, but have not used it. '<Trooper>holds their ARO against that Marker' which establishes that you think you have an ARO and that you can now only use it if that marker reveals with their second action '<Trooper> Delays their ARO with SSL1', which establishes that you're using SSL1 to delay your ARO against a trooper or troopers you believe are inside your ZOC. All of the above are responses that constrain / potentially constrain your subsequent options in a myriad of different ways. They're important statements about what you believe to be the state of the game. The thing they have in common is that none of them activates your trooper nor reveals your trooper (holding an ARO will result in a TO Marker being placed when a HD model does it). An Idle is a Short Skill, it occurs when declared or when it results from a failure of a declared skill. To Idle your trooper must have been activated (which means that it will trigger mines etc). Any valid ARO will reveal a Marker. Using 'I idle' as a way of 'declining to ARO' is illegal, confusing and poor gameplay (Mines or Ambush certainly can't Idle but they can 'do nothing'). Don't do it.
