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IA: Hulang shocktroopers

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Cannon Fodder, Apr 5, 2019.

  1. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

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    I had one game where I spent 9 orders in a turn attempting to spec-fire a Unidron link in hot range with not a single hit...

    We called it after that.

    PH12 is just too low to be messing with that spec fire, honestly. Domarus do that way better. While they can occasionally be useful, I've found more and more that the Hulang's problem with his EM grenades is that he's just not very good at using them. They're great when they work, but a good opponent should have no problem making sure he never really does get to use them efficiently. Setting up direct fire situations for those grenades to do their work is just a lot to ask.
     
    Zewrath likes this.
  2. SKOZZOKONZ

    SKOZZOKONZ Well-Known Member

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    I think ive knocked out one bulleteer in all the games ive used him.
     
  3. fatherboxx

    fatherboxx Well-Known Member

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    Most targets these days tend to be linked in 5-man teams so surpise shots without additional MODs are wasted

    Specfiring is an incredibly effective and borderline cheating strategy because a failure on a roll doesnt result in your trooper getting harmed - and current specfire rules let you do silly quantum ricochet shots while being in positive range. If a single grenade can isolate an obvious LT that doesnt have good PH in a bunker or a group of troopers in a spammy list it is a very cost-effective tactic. Also the scary Dakinis and Unidrones cant dodge for shit.
    Of course 14 pt Krakot does it better but EM grenades usually need to connect once with most targets.
     
  4. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    ...You mean a maximum of 5 models? Or are you trying to convince me that, somehow, you’re engaging fully linked ARO pieces with a simple combi rifle? ‘Kay..
    Also, Aleph, Nomads and especially Haqqislam are very strong armies as Vanilla so talking like it’s uncommon to make use of the Surprise Attack is just bizarre to me.

    Just no

    Even against a Dakini that dodges with an additional -3, you have less than 23% to disable it. Hilariously it has a bigger chance to dodge than you have of disabling it.
     
  5. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

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    The problem with Hulang is that it seems like he is heavily reliant on your opponent making bad decisions in order to make his toolkit work. The moment you have an opponent that is aware of what he does, the fun and interesting options available to him suddenly become far less viable. He'll catch poor players off guard, but against anyone else, he's kind of a dud.
     
  6. IAGO242

    IAGO242 Executive Officer

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    I think you’re 100% right. I’m still going to take him to the next few tournaments that include armoury or engineering deck in the hope that he can be of use. I’m not the most competitive player, and if a model does something cinematic I’m happy. Maybe I’ll be able to get forward observe off. Anyway I’ll make a post should anything interesting happen but it’s not likely :(. He really needed limited camo.
     
  7. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

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    The sad part about objective rooms is that if I absolutely want to commit to taking that room, I'll just rock a KHD Hac Tao. Not only is he harder to kill, but he'll do more for your army beyond the room.

    Sure, it's a bit of a stretch with the ~25 extra points, but the Hulang already feels like he has to be forced into lists anyway.
     
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  8. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    Unclear. Hack Transport Aircraft is outside of the normal ARO sequence, and it's not clear that choosing not to use it forfeits a future chance to perform an ARO in the same order. Ask your TO.
     
  9. IAGO242

    IAGO242 Executive Officer

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    Oh Be sure, I'm running him too! I actually managed to steal points for dominating the objective room by ARO dodging into the room one game with the hac tao thanks to Kinematika!

    Here's my current thinking for objective room missions:

    The plan if for a flash pulse to run up and drop sniffers for a sat lock missile strike (if its necessary) or to sat lock to lob the EM should the Hualang survive. But I have a pretty decent ARO game with the link and the Over-clocked bots.

    Unit 242 Objekt
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9
    HÚLÁNG (Fireteam: Duo) 2 Submachine Gun, E/M Grenades, D-Charges / Pistol, Monofilament CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 41)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 37)
    ZHANSHI HMG / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 19)
    ZHANSHI (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 11)
    ZHANSHI Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 11)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Smart Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 18)
    MECH-ENGINEER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    WÈIBĪNG Yaókòng Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]5
    HAC TAO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 67)
    PANGGULING Hacker (EVO Hacking Device) Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 25)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    PANGGULING (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    4.5 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  10. ObviousGray

    ObviousGray Frenzied Mushroom
    Warcor

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    I'll just cram in Crane for that.

    He shines. Really.
     
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  11. fatherboxx

    fatherboxx Well-Known Member

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    Yes? Ask your firendly Haqq and Ariadna players. Skirmishers with a proper marker state easily get into 0s of a sniper rifle or Missile Launcher or in -3s of a TR bot and stack on their camo mods - not to mention the old place a mine->shoot maneuver.
    And it is not just linked ARO pieces but wandering fireteams as well.
     
  12. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    Do you know what Cautious Move is?

    Also, you not making the Kanren work sounds more and more like a you problem, than a problem with the unit.
     
    #132 Zewrath, May 13, 2019
    Last edited: May 13, 2019
  13. fatherboxx

    fatherboxx Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it is order intensive unless your name is Su Jian or Hollow Man and does not work on open tables.
     
  14. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    1. It’s usually ever done once, so no not really.

    2. It absolutely works

    3. Why are you playing on open tables?

    4. Your arrogant answer that advices me to ask my local players who uses skirmishers (even though I also play Nomads, a faction with skirmishers than Haqq), contains advice that are just as order intensive and in some instances even more so.

    5. Definitely a you problem
     
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  15. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I'd say it's excessively clear that the hacker loses their ARO, but enough people really don't want to end up in a position where they can't pick and choose their ARO (even if it is the strongest response for nearly all hacker and the most likely to succeed for a significant enough amount of them).

    Check with your TO if they house rule this, but absent house rules it's very clear how it works.
     
  16. ObviousGray

    ObviousGray Frenzied Mushroom
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    Do you.. Go head-on into 5 men link?

    With Kanren??
     
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  17. fatherboxx

    fatherboxx Well-Known Member

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    With Kanren you obviously dont, which is why it is a worse unit than generic camo skirmishers - or hulang, who has trouble getting in positive ranges for smg but at least can stack mimetism in its favor.
     
  18. ObviousGray

    ObviousGray Frenzied Mushroom
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    Now I get it. You expect Kanren role as a skirmisher, but in fact he does not. Having a FD is an option - which Kanren can abuse with. If you want something roles as Camo man, go for Guilang brothers.

    His roles are little bit complicated than all day Camo men. He's more like a sucker punch, or a counter-attacker, and if the odds are met, an assassin.

    Holoprojector lets you misguide enemy units. When you are in second turn for example, try turning him into some order winnies like Zhanshi FO or Kuang Shi.

    It do poses a real temptation taking them out. And when their attack is done, Kanren can easily sniff his mono-CCW or peck him with fresh Holo.

    And thats mere piece of his works. He can say screw you by putting a minelayer sniffer, support with HDs, and I'm not even talked about Madtraps.

    Your words suggest you got some good experiences playing Yu Jing, and your position on Tournaments mean you got some knack about it.

    Try using him differently. You sure can. It will pay. ;)
     
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  19. fatherboxx

    fatherboxx Well-Known Member

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    Well the Kanren discussion started with the Hulang comparison since they both have FD and a monofilament and maybe a combi.
    Of course I found defensive use for him, like extending the LT shell game or pretending to have a Hsien HMG to scare off Mk2s from appearing or to bait out assassins; and the madtraps version makes a decent Moran-like. But the lack of proper offensive potential hurts and makes his toolbox poor.
     
  20. IAGO242

    IAGO242 Executive Officer

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    Kanren are pretty good at fighting other skirmishers or clearing away mines with their holos for you to advance other units later.
     
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