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IA fireteam changes

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Mahtamori, Mar 24, 2022.

  1. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    • Gongcheng are now Zhanshi linkable. Yisheng are not.
    • Rui Shi break consistency but are Zuyong linkable.
    • Yan Huo can not form a fully consistent Haris
    • Krit forward deployment can Duo with Hulang
    • Panggolin and Son-Bae still wildcard but break consistency everywhere
    Some sectorials received an extra Haris. IA did not.
    I think as a result Panggo and Son-Bae are no longer desirable in Fireteams, additionally seems like the over all firepower potency went down due to breaking consistency when slotting in Jisus.
     
  2. ObviousGray

    ObviousGray Frenzied Mushroom
    Warcor

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    OK, Yan Huo is now free from mandatory Zuyong and is REQ for Haris.

    That means ML Yan Huo + 2 Panggos are plausible, 66pt 1.5SWC Triple Missile, I'll buy it.
     
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  3. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    It is specifically Krit Forward Deployment and Hulang Forward Deployment options.
     
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  4. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    They've been free from that since N4 hit.

    I don't think anyone will ever make that distinction with how they have written the teams, nor care about that as a distinction enough to make that assertion - whether playing with or against IA
     
  5. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    That is not how the rules are written.

    In the annex rules explaining fireteams Point 7 makes the distinction that when FTO is mentioned in the fireteam chart it matters. There is no mention of the reverse being true.

    A "Forward Fireteam" can be any version of Krit, and any version of a Hulang. The FTOs of neither are required.

    However for the purpose of wildcards as specified further down in the chart only the FTO versions of Krit and the Hulang count for that.
     
  6. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    I think this may be the only instance in the entire fireteams rework across all sectorials that it matters.

    But yes in general when a unit has a name and a name +FTO these are two distinct options in fireteam composition.
     
  7. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Realistically it won't even matter for IA, if you're going to duo them it'll be the two FD+8 versions.
     
  8. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    Correct, that is the meaning behind the name of the fireteam "forward Fireteams"
     
  9. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Uhhhh, am I blind? Is Lei Gong no longer linkable in his home sectorial?

    EDIT: I am blind disregard.
     
  10. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I don't see this being corroborated in the Annex and if this is, as you say, the only place where it matters then it is immensely and needlessly petty. Annex only mentions that FTO is a limitation to ther profiles that have FTO on them, not that they get mutually excluded if the fireteam chart doesn't specify FTO. Absence of a rule does not make a rule.
     
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  11. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    I will look into it, but I do not think it really matters, much if at all.
     
  12. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

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    If FTO is listed, only the FTO options can be included. If just the unit name is listed, any option can be included.
     
  13. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Well I can guarantee you the power level went down. Haidao are critical to this army and including them messes up coherency with any fireteam core.

    Realistically it'll come down to whether their drop on the power curve was consistent with most other armies (given the vast majority of sectorials abused the shit out of mixed anything).
     
  14. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
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    I think you will find most if not all core (mixed) high BS fireteams of old lost 2 points of BS.
     
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  15. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I haven't seen any of the old style Heavy + cheerleaders with the old bonuses intact so far, but I think the impact on sectorials aren't even. My kneejerk analysis is that most sectorials as a result went down in the top-heaviness department. I think the ones that get the most benefit are the ones that get really good new link team options (such as White Banner) or extra Haris, or both (like ISS)

    Not sure what this means for IA, but I think the new top dog for Yu Jing is (besides vanilla and the hilariously strong Duos) White Banner
     
  16. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    I think White Banner will still struggle with SWC issues at 300 points. The new monk links are funny but they're not over the top points efficient like Kuang Shi and they're only delivering at best Jing Qo to the fray who's decent but won't carry a game on her own.

    With Vanilla getting buffed I think it'll still definitely invalidate White Banner for the most part at lower point levels.
     
  17. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Morats are the only one I've noticed so far.
     
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  18. darthchapswag

    darthchapswag Shandian Strike Team

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    Tbh I often ran a core of Zhanshi with a hacker, Haidao MSR, and Son-Bae as a defensive overwatch unit and then a Haris murderball + deep strike unit (either one with some way to push a repeater upfield).

    The core changes make the murderball Haris options better (looking at you Tinbot -6, +1B Ru Shi) whilst only knocking +2 BS off the overwatch FT Haidao and Son-Bae.

    Considering the nature of Guided strikes, I'm not hugely fussed, especially as I can bring an EVO and give the Son-Bae Marksmanship if I really want to employ it in the direct role.

    The test will be to see how the loss of those 2 BS impacts the overwatch FT in play but I'm optimistic. I reckon it'll just require some slightly more intelligent deployment of the fireteam, rather than just "how much of the enemy DZ/objectives can I get arcs on?".
     
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  19. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    Man Haidao keep wreaking my teams for the consistency. I want them and yet I don't.
     
  20. Miraclebutt

    Miraclebutt Well-Known Member

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    Only a handful of people I've talked to are trying to push back for their old numbers; specifically PanO are trying Bolt cores and Kamau Cores to keep their firepower lead, Grenzer cores in TJC have been prototyped but most of the players there seem content to take the -2 BS hit and slot it into a 'Tate core.

    At the moment the big numbers boogiemans people are pushing are the PanO Bolt and Varuna Cores, ForCo Bolt Cores, Ramah Zhayedan Ghulam cores, and OSS Dakini Cores (after turn 1). Everyone else seems content to eat the -2BS penalty for mixed core versatility.

    The overall BS of most active turn links has decreased, but the flexibility has massively improved. IA has gotten really lucky here now that it can take a bunch of Zhanshi to cheapen our links. I've got a couple games scheduled for this weekend and a few lists I've been playing with that I want to try out. Should be fun!
     
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