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I F’ing called it!

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Zewrath, Mar 29, 2019.

  1. the huanglong

    the huanglong Well-Known Member

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    Assault pistols should be damage 11 and burst 3. It's a fucking Klobb for god's sake, it should not hit like a KF7-Soviet.
     
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  2. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Being honest, I think tweaking gameplay values because realism / lore / "common sense" is a big "no", lest we end up with barely justified stuff like "Has Rage against specific SM Chapter" or that Basic Impersonation clause about aliens.

    And I'd say there are enough arguments on the topic of SMGs to make just on gameplay basis.
     
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  3. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Just suffice to say I can't find anything iin this I can agree on. It is not a big "no", it does not lead to "rage against Dark Angels" (particularly since that isn't based on "realism", but rather that GW wants to build narrative of a grudge encounter) and there are arguments for keeping the GitS SMG on the models which need them just like they are (a Nox probably doesn't, but a Zhencha sure does).

    There's also no reason to name a particular weapon "Sub Machine Gun" unless you want to evoke the idea that the gun is not quite a machine gun and as such inferior than the game's machine guns.
    Take the Spitfire, for instance. This is not a light machine gun, as would be natural classification for it, it's a Spitfire. Suddenly you have bought yourself more narrative freedom.

    You don't need to conform the weapon to the narrative or the classification. You can actually conform the narrative to the game if you're clever or eschew the classification (i.e. just don't call it something we're familiar with)
     
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  4. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Aside from "realism" I also included "lore" and "because it makes sense" excuses, and building narrative is basically "lore" in this case.

    As for the rest, like I said, both CB and players are free to build any narrative they want as long as it doesn't get in the way of gameplay matters. I was talking about Infinity background mostly to keep in line with posts ITT.

    If people decide to cleverly integrate gameplay and story, all power to them, it's actually cool. But I would be happier if there was a clear explanation of reasoning behind any existing gameplay interactions in purely gameplay terms.
     
  5. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I find it annoying when people make use of Games Workshop as a cautionary tale or take it as some sort of insult to compare to them.

    In this case it's not "lore" or "realism" or "because it makes sense". Blue Space Marines hate Red Space Marines because "it's the entire fucking point of the game".

    There. Done. It's not a good comparison to make. You might not personally like it (I don't, which is why I don't play it anymore), but don't uphold that as a bad way of building the game that GW is trying to build when it's literally the game that GW is trying to build. It'd be like complaining that including GitS cameo was making Infinity anime.

    Also, remember that fad of an expression "ludonarrative dissonance"? Well, I'd not go so far as to hipster it up and say "ludonarrative", but if you make the game such that there is a disconnect between your narrative and the effects in game you create dissonance with the players. That's why SMGs don't have +3 rangeband up to 72" in this game, among other things, because it wouldn't make sense to people if it had 60" larger rangeband than an HMG.

    So as much as you might want to sell "only the gameplay matter", that's simply not true. It's part of the entire product.
     
  6. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    So what part of certain weapon being cheaper (to the point we call most of its wielders "optimized" just because of that) and almost always better than another one, and also usually issued to units that make the best of it and not hindered by the only downside of that weapon is a necessary element of lore, worldbuilding and other non-gameplay stuff that matters?

    It's a matter of price/quality. I don't see how it's even slightly relevant to anything but gameplay. Certain parts of the issue, like point costs, don't even exist in-universe.

    And also I do think using GW's franchise as an example is somewhat justified. I don't know many people who play Infinity thinking that CB should rather do what GW does with its games, regardless of whether they like them or not.
     
    #66 Barrogh, Apr 10, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
  7. Knauf

    Knauf Transhumanist

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    I just realized how to use this amazing sculpt:

    - Boarding Shotgun
    - Hacker
    - Pseudo-HI base profile

    -> Haidao KHD for my IA paintrain
     
  8. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Heh. It's been 3 months since I made this post aand people have started complaining about GitS cameos and anime Infinity in the News forum since then :grinning:
     
  9. A Mão Esquerda

    A Mão Esquerda Deputy Hexahedron Officer

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    Well, to be honest, if it wasn’t this, it’d be something else...
     
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  10. TanakoSkyler22

    TanakoSkyler22 Varunan Diplomat

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    ....Do they know where Infinity's influences come from? :P
     
  11. A Mão Esquerda

    A Mão Esquerda Deputy Hexahedron Officer

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    Don’t ask silly questions!
     
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  12. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    I hate that Tactical Rock, but I like the way you think! Since it is a 'Haidao', I'd replace the rock with something to imply Zero Gee. Maybe even leave the foot floating in air, but the pose doesn't really support that visually. I think I might mess with the floor angle...

    Paint the poncho in some blatantly naval 'camo' (probably one of the Chinese green-tan-blue patterns; but the USN camo is an option if you really hate yourself), instant Haidao.
     
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  13. the huanglong

    the huanglong Well-Known Member

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    You might have just sold me the model.
     
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  14. Knauf

    Knauf Transhumanist

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    The plot thickens:

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Knauf and A Mão Esquerda like this.
  16. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Does Infinity need to stay near its cradle forever though?
     
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