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How popular are/how do you run your single-group lists?

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by Maksimas, Mar 24, 2019.

  1. Maksimas

    Maksimas Heavy Infantry Addict Maxim

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    It's not the order efficiency that I constantly end up being confused over for JSA... it's managing to actually fit ~300 points into a single combat group.
    That being said... that is one angry army list right there.
     
  2. Nuada Airgetlam

    Nuada Airgetlam Nazis sod off ///

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    I have to admit I barely understood the reply. Care to dumb it down for me please? :)

    How should I counter multiwound models then? I thought that T2 Sniper Vassily and T2 Marksman Strelok plus HRL Tankhunter take care of that? All the four Scouts also have Shock ammo to make sure baddies go straight to Dead.

    For direction of attack, I have four Shock Ojotnik / Shotgun Camo dudes who can Infiltrate. So, I figured this out in vanilla then. Van Zant as the obvious backfield horror, using his LT token freely, when he dies, the hard armoured Moblot LT takes over and in case he also dies, there's still Vas. After Zant is dead, I can push the Cameronian on turn two on a merry rampage. Or use him to exploit a flank if available turn one, have him die and do the Zant dance beginning of turn two.

    Is this any better? :P Hugely appreciate the help :)


    Ariadna
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    VAN ZANT (Executive Order) AP Rifle / Heavy Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 39)
    STRELOK Marksman Rifle T2, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 29)
    SCOUT (Forward Observer) Ojotnik, D-Charges, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    SCOUT (Forward Observer) Ojotnik, D-Charges, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    SCOUT (Forward Observer) Ojotnik, D-Charges, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    VASSILY (Chain of Command) T2 Sniper, D-Charges / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (1 | 39)
    TANKHUNTER Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 29)
    TANKHUNTER Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 29)
    MOBLOT Lieutenant Rifle, Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    CAMERONIAN 2 Chain Rifles, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / AP CCW. (0 | 23)

    4 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  3. WiT?

    WiT? Well-Known Member

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    Been playing this game for over half a decade, and got to say I just can't get past running some expendible speedbumps in a second combat group. I like to play heavily in the reactive phase rather than just hide and cover limited lanes, and feel that with the power of the active turn there aren't many ways to do this with a LI list. I also strongly dislike the dynamic I've encountered in LI vs LI of early kills leading to a snowballing lead in terms of orders.

    Also been finding that overall it feels like quality just often doesn't pay for itself. I've had many good models fail in F2F with something like a warcor, or be stalled by extremely cheap mines, warbands, jammers etc that seem to counter them for a low cost. This seems to happen for me far more often than the inverse - where elite units are so dominant that active turn weaker units are killed as they attack them.

    That could just be a consequence of my personal strengths and weaknesses in the game, but that said, I've built up the style that I have through many games over a long time and exposure to a lot of different situations. This "quantity beats quality" element to the game has been consistent throughout, to the point that I'm genuinely impressed if I run into someone who does well with a low order count list in my meta.

    That said, the most fun I've ever had with the game was with a LI Avatar list, so clearly nothings fixed in stone...
     
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  4. Maksimas

    Maksimas Heavy Infantry Addict Maxim

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    The dice deities are not fans of consistent results, as is well known.
    For me, personally, the inverse tends to happen staggeringly often, wherein an expensive sniper somehow manages to snipe hapless Impetous bikers as they are forced to drive across a fire lane or a supressive fire HI stunts ( Bit of a side note here, but it's genuinely kinda funny when a single goddamned Tiger manages to hold off an entire Myrmidon link, Patroclus and Ajax from moving across a small clearing. Pretty sure that little bastard Tiger even critted Achilles to death in the reactive turn before going down... ) the enemies advance across an entire lane...
    Though I have had the inverse happen as well, most often involving some random schmuck 10-15 points Forward Observer marking my units despite all Camo, range and cover MODs being stacked against them..

    As I always say: if it ain't broke, why fix it? If it works for you, that's more or less all that really matters, is it not?
    Though I do suppose, as it always does, metas have a measure of influence over how well such lists can perform. Pretty sure that's why I managed to get away with SCGs so well: the people here, outside of LI tournaments, probably thought those lists went extinct, heck, one guy had the purest expression of surprise the first time I told him I have a single combat group. I suppose it was just a stabilized meta at that point... but then the State Empire attacked. ( Sorry I could not resist. )
    Might be that your meta is a LOT less favorable to SCGs I suppose.
     
  5. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, those are very fun, if at little weak at button-pushing.


    Is there ever a choice besides Oyama?


    Allow me to give you an idea:

    Samurai Seven
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]4
    OYAMA Lieutenant Chain Rifle, E/M Grenades / Breaker Pistol, AP CCW, EXP CCW. (0 | 28)
    DOMARU Spitfire / Pistol, E/M CCW, Shock CC Weapon. (2 | 39)
    TANKŌ Missile Launcher / Pistol, Monofilament CC Weapon, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 32)
    TANKŌ Flammenspeer, Contender / Pistol, Monofilament CC Weapon, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 23)
    TANKŌ Blitzen, Submachine Gun / Pistol, Monofilament CC Weapon, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 23)
    O-YOROI AP HMG + Heavy Flamethrower, CrazyKoalas / EXP CCW. (2 | 86)
    YOJIMBO Contender, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 21)
    KEISOTSU Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 17)
    TOKUSETSU EISEI Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    TOKUSETSU KOHEI Engineer Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Not exactly subtle, you are basically using the TAG as a Distraction Carnifex to let the DoTanko link beat on things, while the Hacker casts Fairy Dust and the Doc/Engineer hide (or go into Suppressive Fire on a coordinated order).
     
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  6. Maksimas

    Maksimas Heavy Infantry Addict Maxim

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    For some reason I instinctively grab for Kuroshi Rider...

    Subtlety is overrated, amirite?
     
  7. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Subtlety is for dishonorable Ninjas, not Samurai!
     
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  8. Aspect Graviton

    Aspect Graviton Friendly Alien Overlord
    Warcor

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    Dumbed down version: At some point you'll fight a force that's good against Camo and is better at shooting that you, (my example was Imperial service who are kind of worst case scenario) at that stage you'll likely be playing attrition in basically a pitched battle since your only attack vector is from your board half and much of your opponents army is resistant to or immune to your tricks and traps and probably have a wave of disposable impetuous dudes with direct templates to flush out your mid field.

    Personally I'd say that list is a lot more threatening, The cameronian gives you a distraction / smoke / beat stick, and Van Zant is generally horrifying, pairing him with CoC means you can be somewhat suicidal with him.

    Vassily's T2 sniper isn't something I'd want to hold ground with, as sooner or later he'll be your Lt but he makes a great ambush predator.

    The Scouts with ojotniks are great but there is only so far you can go with an ojotnik, shock will take care of light infantry, AP will dent heavier targets, the issue I was trying to point out is that if you reveal a 30pt ojotnik to kill something in reaction then now it's lost it's camo and only has a B1 reaction that scout is probably going to die to whatever support is behind your initial target, so you have to be pretty certain you want a piece exchange. Ojotniks also can't suppression which is a big defensive boost to slow down your opponent in reaction. The related issue to that is Ojotniks are B2 in active, every now and again you're going meet a target that you'll just have to brute force your way through by rolling more dice. You have now mitigated this somewhat by adding in Van Zant and the Cameronian who can give you a sneakier alternative to brute force. At some stage however you're probably still going to have to put a less optimal unit into some horrifying death merchant like a Charontid/Hsien/Aquilla/Intruder HMG that ignores most of your camo tricks.

    That kind of leads me to the strelok T2, it doesn't quite have the punch of the T2 sniper but it has the same kind of role as your scouts, it can suppression and it can potentialy take a 2W HI to unconcious in reaction and it's loss isn't that upsetting (no Loss of Lt or specialist) it also comes with 50% more active turn dice as a bit more of an assault piece.

    Tank hunter MLs are horrifying ARO pieces, personally I wouldn't use 2 (there is something to be said for functional redundancy but if one ML doesn't do the job you probably want another tool), so I'd probably see if I could stump up for an AP HMG tank hunter or a spetsnas HMG maybe by swapping a scout for a foxtrot or hardcase.

    Best bet is just to try a few lists and see what works for you
     
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  9. Maksimas

    Maksimas Heavy Infantry Addict Maxim

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    Subtlety is reserved for those that cannot afford power armor.
     
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