1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hemos actualizado nuestra Política de Privacidad acorde con la nueva RGPD. +Info // We've updated our Privacy Policy to comply with the GDPR. +Info
    Dismiss Notice

How do you Aleph?

Discussion in 'ALEPH' started by regelridderen, Jan 5, 2019.

?

Make a choice

  1. OSS

    39 vote(s)
    66.1%
  2. ASS

    12 vote(s)
    20.3%
  3. Vanilla

    21 vote(s)
    35.6%
  4. I don’t play favorites.

    4 vote(s)
    6.8%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Nenyx

    Nenyx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    749
    Likes Received:
    766
    YES ! Breaker combi and Heavy shotgun would be definitely nice ! Well that would make dakinis a bit like karakuris through. Well, i wanted to have something like them, so i wouldn't mind.
     
  2. Kir

    Kir Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2018
    Messages:
    113
    Likes Received:
    80
    Theres a NCO HMG yadu which you can put in a link with said asura to be able to spend either 12 on her or 12 on the hmg.It's pretty potent.
     
    TheRedZealot likes this.
  3. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    Sorry, but:
    [​IMG]
     
  4. TheRedZealot

    TheRedZealot Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    950
    Likes Received:
    1,463
    Breaker combi would be dumb, IMO. BS 14, Burst 4, Essentially DA, Mimetism, Ignores Cover. But you can put a breaker combi in with the CSU and a Light Shotgun if you want. Thats the one thing I think is very elegant about the CSU option. As for the other profiles sure I suppose I would have liked to see another REM option in the link instead personally.

    Little known fact, the super jump springs in Ekodromoi legs are actually the same springs mounted in Garuda legs. The big metal booty just makes it so they work like shock absorbers instead.

    On the game play side, why do we want to make Garuda more like Ekodromoi though? Right now they're like Discount Tiger soldiers? The only change I'd like is a repeater on them but thats probably too greedy...

    *shrug* I dont see the need for smoke and LT2 is still really good on the Asura.

    OSS doesn't do anything crazy or different thats true but we got some nice new rules and some solid new units that fill some interesting gaps. I'm not sure what else I could have wanted TBH. Honestly if they pulled Posthumans and the Named characters from OSS I'd probably be more happy with them over all but they would probably be on the weaker side then.

    Have you used it? NCO Yadu is a solid 9/10 model. High value good unit fits nicely with the Asura LT.
     
    moyamoya likes this.
  5. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    You are right, I completely forgot about combination of Breaker and Shock. Yeah, that'd be relatively strong - I don't think broken but yeah, fine, we shouldn't get it.
    CSU in the links is okay, I like the models and profiles so I don't mind having them but honestly I would've preferred more Dakini profiles instead.

    Still, I'm all up for other options. I don't think they'd increase the power level but would still increase enjoyment and variety in the faction.
    For one thing, I don't play Ekdromoi so I really don't give 3 flips about what they have. Their weapon loadouts and profile makes them uninteresting to me.

    I don't want Garuda more like Ekdromoi. Idea is to give them Super Jump INSTEAD of AD, not together with AD. That way, you can choose : air drop the Garuda, or have it start in DZ but Super Jump. It would fit the miniature, it would give an interesting REM option to Aleph / OperationS, it would make it pair well with Asura HD+ (since it'd be in range to be buffed), it would be different enough from Dakini to make sense, it would go well with elite LHosts leading REMs theme.
    Lt2 is decent on Asura, no complaints there. I don't even care about those 2 extra points - if you're paying 76 points, 2 more points is whatever. Also, given how much we overpay just for MSV3 it really makes it even less of an issue. But it is indicative about how much attention and understanding CB gave to different units and armies.
    Nice new rules... What gaps have been filled? Andromeda is basically forced via one specific mission (even that only kinda works if you have first turn) on us by literally not giving us any other meaningful way to achieve it (you can theoretically get DCharges with one of the specialist from the Panoplies, then use your CC13 XD at -3). If you don't need DA weapon, there is no way a Dasyu or even a Naga won't be better for any other role you can imagine.
    Look, you wanna pretend they're good, go ahead. All I can do is hope to meet you on a tournament and have an easier game.
     
  6. TheRedZealot

    TheRedZealot Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    950
    Likes Received:
    1,463
    Andromeda went from a unit that was borderline unusable to one that has a reasonable chance to get where it needs to be and do what it wants to do. I'm not going to say Andromeda is supremely good but they took the biggest problems she had (range and infiltration distance) and gave her a replacement. Why take Andromeda over a Naga or a Dasyu? Well for one out of the 26 missions sure, or because you want to take all the Dasyu and Nagas as well.

    You've completely ignored all the other things we got.

    Apsaras gave us a new interesting rule to make our Dakini Link a little bit different. Not to mention a rock solid KHD profile.

    Shukra gave us a better COC model than the Myrmidon and a wonderful LT option.

    Deva's got new loadouts to fill in some of their gaps.

    The Arjuna is a fast aggressive utility piece that brings a suite of tools to the table.

    The Yadu are a durable unit with either broad utility or a specific role to fill. They fit nicely between the lighter on the ground Deva and the heavier points investment of the yadu. They can bring generally useful tools (multi rifle profile) or Specialized weaponry that synergizes with the rest of your list (HRL, HMG NCO)

    Rudras is similar to the Yadu in that it brings a suit of tools on a chubby body. But brings in the utility of climbing plus.

    Dart is a step between Dasyu and Nagas. Optimized to hunt down other Camo/Mimetism wearers.

    For me the Yadu bring a lot to the table and fit nicely into many lists. Drop Bears and E Marats have useful abilities. HMGs with NCO are undeniably a nice combination. I can acknowledge that you might have different experiences but its almost like the game has different metas and different players. And that peoples mileage on units may vary?

    But to be honest my feeling is you just don't like the Yadu so you dont bother to try it in game. Though I could 100% be wrong.
     
    Abrilete likes this.
  7. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    I'm not saying we didn't get an upgrade to Andromeda - we did. However, I really don't like they included any* ASS troopers in Operation Subsection, particularly not the fact they the one they did include is basically the only way to play a mission.

    *Note: I do admit that as far as any ASS troopers go, Andromeda is probably the one choice that makes most sense (with Atalanta being the other). However, I still dislike the whole deal.
    I did not, I just don't think what we got is really worthy of a sectorial release.
    They gave us A rule. Interesting? Hardly. We already had the way to do very similar thing. Frankly, given the scope of things they could do, they went for the dullest option imaginable. KHD profile is only notable for its cheapness.
    Shukra is... Okay CoC. Honestly, that whole model is just placeholder for CoC & Counterintelligence. Is there anyone that is actually excited about using them? (and I mean spending orders on them, not just having them in the list).
    As for Lt version, it's actually quite bad. I mean, Strategos L1 is a nice thing, but this is Aleph - almost everyone will know immediately who the Lt is, and Shukra is many things but it is not tough. You need to spend resources defending him, which again, a problem for overall high-cost faction.
    Don't get me wrong, Shukra as a whole is nice addition, but hardly interesting or enjoyable to use. Which is a damn shame because I find its lore actually very interesting.
    True. In fact, I consider Deva AHD+Lighting one of the best new things we got.
    It's a fast and aggressive specialist for sure. Bots are also cool, except I hate E/M weaponry and try not to bring too much of it to table. I enjoy Infinity when we play with big guys, you know, the ones that get screwed over the worst by E/M.
    ... Will you stop trying to get me to talk about Yadu? They are far too expensive for what they try to do.
    Rudra is... Expensive. I mean, I like it, kinda, except again we see just how much thought and effort they spent on designing the faction by the fact the only B4 weapon it has is Red Fury. Which combines oh so well with Marksmanship L2.
    Yeah, Dart is amazing. Although I have a bit of problem with her lore, but yeah, Dart is nice and combines well.
    But to be honest my feeling is you just don't like the Yadu so you dont bother to try it in game. Though I could 100% be wrong.[/QUOTE]
    I don't like Yadu and every time I try to put one in my list I take it out because it's so expensive and limited. The cheap option (FO) don't really bring more than 1 thing to game, the "default" loadout (MULTI Rifle, E/Marat, Drop Bears) is too expensive for what it brings, and HMG NCO is mindbogglingly useless. Maybe if you're bringing Lt Deva where you don't want to spend the Lt Order on it? But even then, 40 points for a BS13 HMG nothing else is far too expensive. I really don't understand what kind of opponents are you playing where a BS13 trooper for 35+ points (yeah I'm ignoring Combi Rifles) is considered good. A TO Camo NWI Infiltrator costs that much.

    Just to be clear, I did play a few games with Shakti (linked) because I thought she's good. Was disappointed. Now rate her at "middling". We simply have much more effective AND interesting options in sectorial that these guys are just waste of space.
     
  8. Nenyx

    Nenyx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    749
    Likes Received:
    766
    After some uses, i'm not that sure rudra really need marksmanship L2 that often. It's dependant on the table, on the meta ... but i found that with climbing+ and it being S4, it can find line of fire where the opponent doesn't even have cover. So i can understand the red fury option on it.
    I'm personnally still fond of the K1 marksmanrifle on it. Good range, and can kill anything. I'm in a meta where MI (with forward deployment thanks to ITS10) and HI are a frequent sight, so i appreciate the K1.
     
  9. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    What kind of argument is that even...

    Whatever. Tired of this. OperationS is obviously the bestest and most innovative and greatest and everything sectorial and CB does everything perfectly.
     
  10. Nenyx

    Nenyx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    749
    Likes Received:
    766
    There is a difference between saying that everything is bad, and everything is perfectly well. When you say that yadus are bad, it's too extreme. They are not op. They may be average at best (not my opinion, but why not). They may not suit you, that too i can understand. But bad, no. Especially when they bring things that didn't had any equivalent till now ... Drop bears (yeah, we have mines, but ... hey, that's a different tool for different usages !) Shock immunity in an army that usually suffers from shock. Unhackable and immune to isolation. That sort of things.

    About rudras, yes, it's just my little experience with them till now. I didn't used assisted fire that much on them, even if i could (asura hacker L2). Why ? Because i didn't need it to begin with. Since we were playing with many sceneries, and since that sweet thing has climbing+, i could manage to get some line of sight without cover for the target - assisted fire wouldn't have given much (once again, assisted fire DOES NOT give +3 BS, it's just a +3 BS equivalent if some conditions are fulfilled). If your meta is such that you encounter many impetuous or you can make full use of it's mobility to catch the opponents off cover, you are better with the red fury version, that's all.
     
    moyamoya, TheRedZealot and jherazob like this.
  11. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    No. They're bad. They're not the worst trooper ever, but they are too expensive for what they do, and they're too expensive in an army that's full of too expensive troopers. Moreover, there's plenty of better choices in the army for everything they do do (even if its not all in one model, but that is not a disadvantage). Toolbox approach works only if the toolbox is either dirt cheap or can do at least one thing well. In Yadu case, they are expensive, and they do nothing well.
    You want E/M defences? Bring Arjuna, much superior for that.
    Want anything else? Dasyu Boarding Shotgun for example.
    These are solutions to nothing. Unhackable is applicable to most troopers in Infinity, including Aleph. Isolation immunity is kinda nice, but since Yadus aren't actually good at gunfighting - so what? Shock Immunity doesn't help rest of the army. Just makes them slightly tougher, but hey, back to the problem you don't want them in a fight in first place.
    Usually if you're Climbing, you yourself are out of cover, or you are spending lots of orders to move around to get to at back of an enemy. Which is nice, but you know what's also nice? Straight up engaging the enemy while ignoring their cover penalty. You know who's also excellent at getting the enemy from behind? Garuda. Yet we still wish for ability to get them into repeater ranges of our own troops.
     
  12. Nenyx

    Nenyx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    749
    Likes Received:
    766
    Well, you usually use climbing+ to try to catch people that are actively trying to hide from your killers. Your dakini may not have the line of fire on some support or specialist troop, but a rudra can.
     
  13. TheRedZealot

    TheRedZealot Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    950
    Likes Received:
    1,463
    Your complaint I thought was that she was garbo. Which she was pretty garbo prechanges. I just pointed out the changes improved her dramatically. As I mentioned previously I'm not a huge fan of named characters in OSS and Andromeda is one of those.

    See my feeling was Jumper Z was bad. Like potentially not worth using bad but then I started fussing around with it on the Table and it actually seems pretty usable and it is quite different from the other rules we had. I dont think I'd want it every list but I can definitely see it being good. Counterintel, LT2, NCO and Biovisor 2 are all pretty rare rules that we got in this update as well.

    Maybe you don't face off against many Impersonators but I see them often enough that Biovisor 2 is useful. And the Shukra is a nicer COC model than the Myrimidon officer IMO.


    Thats definitely your choice.

    See my feeling is the K1 is the best profile even with the overlap of shock the ignoring cover part of marksmanship is silly good though.

    If you dont want to use them thats fine but lots of people are using them and finding them good. The problem I have is not with disliking or hell even being unhappy with a unit or the sectorial. But when every time someone brings up Yadu you disregard them like their some kind of joke I feel the need to present my differing opinion because the forums do shape what people see/play/use.

    I gave Shakti a shot but didn't find her that good. She doesn't bring the right mix IMO. Drop Bears are a huge asset for the Yadus.

    You've brought up a number of times that I might be playing in a shitty meta. I'm not going to claim that anyone here is some top 10 in the world player but hey that's just part of the game. The vast majority of people aren't playing with the highest ranked people in the game. All I'm trying to do is point out my experience of the game is different.

    Have you noticed that the answer about a lot of these units is 'I think its bad so I dont use it'? I'd encourage you to try some of them more or use them in different ways you might find that sectorial is more interesting.

    (Or you know just don't post shitty memes about the Yadu whenever someone says they like it and I'll probably stop noticing you exist, which ever works :stuck_out_tongue:)
     
    moyamoya and jherazob like this.
  14. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    I never said it was bad. I don't think it's bad, and yes, I occasionally do use Apsara. What I think is that it is a boring rule, and the unit it is on is very boring, as in, I don't feel any excitement about using it. That is my objection to it.
    sigh... We could've goten 50 new rules in this way and I would still have had objections. OR we could've gotten 0 new rules and I could've been overjoyed. It's not just about numbers and getting "new" rules. There's a lot on how and where and why we get them.
    Problem is that Biovisor2 is still meh. And Shukra is nicer CoC if you're not playing Asura or Marut. Otherwise, Myrmidon Officer wins as it also brings either Smoke or Eclipse Grenades.
    Plus, in the end, you're not following my points. You are not excited about using the unit, you're just happy to have CoC and CI in the army. At best you can say you're happy to have Biovisor L2 in the army and using it, use of which is really dependent on a) fighting against Impersonators and b) going first.
    Not touching that debate now. My point was entirely that one of the 3 profiles, the only one with B4, was with weapon which does not combine well with Hackers - and that it clearly shows CB doesn't care.
    Do what you will. Pretending Yadus are good to people asking for help is not useful.
    ...
    I'm not preventing people from playing Yadus. I'm just pointing out that they're not good. Nothing is stopping you from playing weaker units, in fact, I applaud it. I play Asuras ALL THE TIME. I think they're relatively bad, but I like them so I play them. But just because I like the units lore and enjoy the idea (and can also win games with them), I don't go around pretending they're good.

    Oh, and before complaints start, just because I also enjoy a unit I won't be claiming they're bad. Take Dakinis or Garudas. Profiles we have are great and don't need changing. We do need more profiles to increase variety, but their power level is perfectly good already.
    Have you noticed the only unit I said this for is Yadu? It's also kinda true for Andromeda (although for entirely different reasons); the rest I all tried and most of them still see table regularly. Hell, Arjuna is the only one I may not take frequently, mostly because I think she's too good against specific types of opponents, not because she's too bad.
    Or I'll keep disregarding Yadus, and you do whatever you want. ^^
     
  15. TheRedZealot

    TheRedZealot Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    950
    Likes Received:
    1,463
    Ah I did a bad job explaining there. I didn't mean to imply you thought it was bad. Just that when I looked at it I scoffed then I used it and realized it was pretty good. On a practical level it makes our Links feel pretty durable and different compared to other cores.

    See this is where a playstyle difference is coming up here. To me if I have COC is going to sit in some corner getting guarded. If I have an MSV that needs smoke that smoke is going to come from other support models. Not the COC that is supposed to be the insurance against my MSV LT from dieing and tipping the game in
    I dont know if I've ever been excited to play a specific unit in any of my armies to be honest. Apart from maybe the Igao?

    Yeah see I wouldn't have said it doesn't combine well in that the most important part of Marksmanship is not the Shock. Its not ideal but its still a good ability to stack on.


    I think pretending is a poor choice of words. I legitimately think they are effective and have found success in using them. BS 13 is not as bad as you make it out to be. Especially on a durable maneuverable platform armed with decent weapons.


    Maybe I misunderstood I'm not sure but it seemed to me like your arguments were:

    Andromeda is bad, Dasyu and Nagas are better to take.

    Aspara is Bad/boring or there are other good options. (admittedly this is more on the boring side than the bad side).

    Shukra is worse than the Myrimidon Officer/boring/bad.

    Yadus are Bad.

    Rudras is 'expensive' which is infinity codeword for bad most of the time.


    (Surprisingly) I dont think you're the devil Nemo. Its just you seem very frustrated or upset over something you also don't seem willing to really give a chance? It perplexes me.

    As a random aside have you thought about converting up some custom minis for some of the units that you like in game but dislike background wise? Surely Aleph has other operatives than Dart that could be armed with something similar for example. Gives you a nice chance to stretch some creative muscles while also giving you a nice edge in game.
     
    DukeofEarl likes this.
  16. Arlic

    Arlic Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2018
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    36
    After making some games, I think Nemo is right about many points he brings on. And for oder half a year I thought he is just a crababy (sorry!)

    I agree with bim especially about
    -shukra and his biometric visor
    -Shakti wich isnt as good as I thought
    -Yadus (I was very excited atthe beginning, but now I choosedifferent units oder Yadu)
     
    Nemo No Name likes this.
  17. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    Honestly, I don't see it. It makes Dakinis a bit more fearsome - especially when you're going 2nd and it's first turn. But not that much different, since with Mimetism they are feared already.
    Well, yeah, some CoCs are only good for that, yeah. But problem with Shukra is that it's not particularly good at that either, just average. Shukra gives it's biggest bonus before game starts, then it's 25 point cheerleader most games. Is it bad? No. But it's hardly inspiring or great.
    I'll talk about Myrmidon CoC down.
    That's sad in my opinion. I mean, sure, sometimes it's not one unit but a link or something that gets you excited... But I want something to gets me excited. When I build lists, I come with units I want to use or a theme (lots of REMs, lots of token state, etc) and build from there.
    I agree that Shock is the less important part of Marksmanship (lets say 25% to 75% ignoring cover). However, when they give us Red Fury, it's not merely that we don't get the Shock benefit, we also lose 1 point of damage. Admittedly, it costs less SWC and slightly better rangebands, but I don't see either of those as good as that extra damage and making sure our efficiency is up.

    And anyway, this is not "Red Fury is garbage" - it is not. My only point here is that CB obviously couldn't be bothered to consider how REM weaponry interact with rest of the game, and just gave us whatever. (Alternatively, I can also see them doing it to push us into linking it then putting Apsara bonus, which is so bad I don't think even they would do it)
    BS13 is okay when it:
    1. comes on a cheap platform - Yadus are not cheap,
    2. comes on a exceptionally manoeuvrable platform - Yadus are not, they're Infinity default,
    3. comes with visual mods - Yadu don't have any,
    4. comes with ability to ignore visual mods - Yadu don't have any.
    The best you can say is that they're (kinda) durable, except that's a trap. Aleph don't come with wealth of cheapish orders to spend time using it's "durable" troopers to remove a TR bot (and if you try to say you're just gonna use something else to remove that TR bot, that is the whole point. Yadu can't do it).
    If you leave Yadu out to ARO, you might as well just not put them on table.
    I was not saying I didn't consider (some of the troopers) boring or bad, but I was saying you are incorrect that I did not try those troopers. I at least a few games (using varied lists) with everything except Yadu and Andromeda - Yadu because I simply can't think of a situation where they are better than many, many alternatives we have, and Andromeda because meh, ASS in my OperationS. I even tried Shakti in a Haris with Asura.
    Well, I wouldn't say Andromeda is exactly bad. She's just not particularly good, and Dasyu or Nagas are better in almost any role you try with her.
    Here's why: if you are going second, you need to hide Andromeda, which means definitively not trying to infiltrate her past middle. If you do, enemy is gonna smoke her with one or two orders. Or just place proper ARO troopers and that's it. For a 31+ point trooper, that's too much to be cheerleading and hoping 3rd turn she's gonna do something.
    If you are going first, ha, now she has a role. She goes Superior Infiltration and if she succeeds, yes, she can start work cleaning up enemy weak guys, for sure - if enemy doesn't have decent ARO cover.
    My guess is, she'll be devastating in 10% of the games, in another 25% she'll do okay but not amazing, and rest she'll be a super-expensive cheerleader. Given that she doesn't excite me, I'm not gonna use her.
    Apsara is boring. That's the problem. I don't think her bonus is bad, it's actually about right on power level but in a very boring way. Still play her occasionally.
    Shukra is great on lore, good on power level (not amazing but not bad either, about right), but a very boring unit.
    As for Myrmidon Officer, in vanilla I would prefer it strongly in lists with Marut (due to price issues), and usually but not always with Asura - although with Asura, given we don't have the MULTI Rifle HD+ Lt option in vanilla, I'd probably pair a regular Myrmidon and Machaon Lt instead of either Shukra or Myrmidon Officer.
    You are correct here, and I will not play them.
    As I mention for Yadus, "too expensive" is bad. Expensive just means you will include the unit on purpose, not because it's cheap enough and usually does well. I play Rudra actually, and I think it has some potential, but I'm sad about its weapon options and how limited they are.
    I'm not frustrated specifically about Yadu or Andromeda. I'm annoyed that is all we got. If they gave us fun stuff AND Yadu, I would take a look at Yadu, yawn and focus my attention on other things we got. However, I don't have that choice, do I.
    I do that all the time for units where I don't like how they look. I often use Avicenna as Machaon (or Deva now that I'm playing OperationS), etc.
    Problem with lore is that lore stays the same. I can't override the lore in that sense - it's always there. Same as profiles. I was very much against Danavas because there is (STILL) Deva Hacker which is total garbage, whereas Danavas would be perfect for the AHD+Lighting that Devas got. But that's a different discussion, let's not get into it.
     
  18. Nenyx

    Nenyx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    749
    Likes Received:
    766
    Concerning CoC, i prefer the myrm officer for 2 reasons:
    1. he can throw smoke/eclipse
    2. he is a good fighter and a hard to kill specialist (ODD + NWI)

    The both combined means he has some utility during the game. He can move rather freely thanks to smoke, he can fight if needed, and thanks to all of that, he can effectively go and score what is to be scored.
     
  19. senso

    senso Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2018
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    6
    Regarding Rudras:

    IMHO I think the potential is there to really hit your opponent hard. K1/Multi Ammo, Assisted Fire, White Noise if needed, and mine dispenser. Take first turn in something like biotechvore and you could really hurt your opponent and shut down their DZ. Some factions, especially Ariadna, might have a hard time shutting down a STR 2 ARM 4 rem with no hacking in ARO.

    I think it's priced accordingly to how much damage it can potentially do.
     
  20. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    2,580
    :joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy::joy:
    That would be really bad way to price things. Also, anything can do that much damage.