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How and why do you split your combat groups? or How and why do you run just one?

Discussion in 'ALEPH' started by yoink101, Feb 16, 2020.

  1. yoink101

    yoink101 Well-Known Member

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    For the next installment in my “get discussions going on the ALEPH forum” series, I give you the combat group discussion.

    I usually like 15-16 orders, not counting impetuous. 20 tends to mean I’ve made too many sacrifices in redundancy and resilience in my experience.

    I tend to run Steel Phalanx with 13-15 orders because I like Myrmidons and they’re more expensive than most line infantry. They also function well with fewer orders because of the many fireteams. Not to mention that They have some of the only fireteams in the game that I think actually present a sufficient speed bump to slow my opponents down in most cases.

    In any case I typically do not like to run limited insertion as it often becomes more vulnerable to order loss. Just a few downed models can mean a significant reduction in efficacy and I can quickly find myself unable to accomplish the mission. Not to mention that any hiccups can easily become a drain on orders and I can run out of options.

    I usually like my second combat group to be filled with sacrificial pieces, one striker, and one objective runner. The idea being that the second group can sustain itself and help me achieve my goals (murder, mayhem, and/or mission) but is also where I want to take my casualties when I have to take any. This means flash pulse bots, warcores, minelayers, cheap warbands, or a Thorakitae fireteam. The first group usually has my core team, a Myrmidon fireteam, my main attackers, and/or at least 2-3 models that will accomplish the mission.

    Recently, with OSS, I’ve been experimenting with the second group containing my Dakini/Deva/CSU core team and the Apsara. This way, I feel better about leaving them out to ARO because they’re not losing orders from the main pool when the go down. It also incentivizes me to spend the groups orders on them and try to get their points worth. Historically I had been finding that I’d generally just leave the team idle for most of the game and spend the main pool’s orders on solo pieces.
     
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  2. RasPuto

    RasPuto Active Member

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    I'd like to see your SP lists, as I'm currently buying it and I'm super interested.

    Anyway, your thought process behind is extremely good: a bigger group with high-value pieces, a smaller one with sacrificial pawns.

    Coming from TAK, I generally want a 8-7 order pool for TW, but I often played with 9-7 and Strategos from Voronin. It's just different from scenario to scenario, what I want to achieve with a group or the other and so on.
     
    #2 RasPuto, Feb 16, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2020
  3. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
    Warcor

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    I have a similar approach to building second group; an assault piece, ARO units, doc/engineer to keep defenders operational (Sophotect goes here, if I'm taking it), Sensor/Sniffer net for cleaning midfield Camo and for orders. An AD if I can afford it. These are the usual components.

    But I think OSS can function pretty well in single group lists. I have good experience with Marut and Asura, which usually make for a good main strike unit (their Strat3/Lt2 skills also help). Such lists can take full advantage of our abundance of NWI. I might not have as many orders as my opponents, but they stay in play longer. This equalizes things over the course of the game.
     
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  4. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    I don't have much to add. I try to have CG2 have access to a few different tasks they can do. I'll put solo slow long range units like Atalanta in. I like to have a specialist in case there's nothing else to do. I like to have a smoke unit in both groups if possible. I'll usually have an AD to swap to CG1 later. Then usually some cheap AROs like unlinked Thorakitai chainrifles or flash pulse guys.

    Basic formation is:
    Expected casualties
    Unit for clearing AROs
    Unit for objectives
    Unit with airborne deployment
     
    yoink101 likes this.
  5. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    I tend to have it split Primary assault group+support and secondary assault across CG 1 and 2. Or Assault group and fire support group across them with the Thorakitai (with a handful of exceptions) team being in the fire support group with an Agema MK12, token hacker, and REMS. With the spitfire Myrm Mach team with the rest of the list's odds and ends in the primary.
     
  6. yoink101

    yoink101 Well-Known Member

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    Here are a couple that I've enjoyed playing recently-ish.

    Machaon Diomedes Scylla
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10
    MACHAON Lieutenant Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0.5 | 38)
    YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    DIOMEDES Mk12, Nanopulser / Assault Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 43)
    SCYLLA Hacker (Killer Hacking Device UPGRADE: Maestro) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser + 2 Devabots Charybdis / Pistol, E/M CC Weapon. (0.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] DEVABOT CHARYBDIS Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (7)
    MYRMIDON OFFICER (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (1 | 35)
    MYRMIDON Spitfire, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (1 | 31)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    NETROD Electric Pulse. (0 | 4)
    THORAKITES (Forward Observer, 360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)
    THORAKITES (Forward Observer, 360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4
    AGÊMA Marksman MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 30)
    NETROD Electric Pulse. (0 | 4)
    LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    PROBOT (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    4.5 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    This one says it's illegal because it has netrods categorized as remotes right now. I don't think that is correct, but maybe they've made the change and not told us?

    Machaon Hippolyta Agema
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    MACHAON Lieutenant Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0.5 | 38)
    YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    MYRMIDON OFFICER (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (1 | 35)
    MYRMIDON Spitfire, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (1 | 31)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    NETROD Electric Pulse. (0 | 4)
    NETROD Electric Pulse. (0 | 4)
    HIPPOLYTA Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Flash Pulse, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, EXP CC Weapon. (0 | 38)
    AGÊMA Marksman MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 30)
    THORAKITES (360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4
    THRASYMEDES (Fireteam: Enomotarchos) Submachine gun, Light Rocket Launcher, Nanopulser, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Shock CCW. (0.5 | 30)
    THORAKITES Marksman Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    THORAKITES (Forward Observer, 360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)
    THORAKITES (360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)

    4.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Same here. This doubles down on the strengths of ASS. If your opponent has the tools and skill to deal with your enomotarchos teams, you can find yourself in trouble really quickly. It is fun to play though.

    All Enomotarchos
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    PHOENIX Heavy Rocket Launcher, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Heavy Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 40)
    MYRMIDON OFFICER (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (1 | 35)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    EUDOROS Mk12, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 40)
    MACHAON Lieutenant Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0.5 | 38)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16)
    NETROD Electric Pulse. (0 | 4)
    NETROD Electric Pulse. (0 | 4)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1
    THRASYMEDES (Fireteam: Enomotarchos) Submachine gun, Light Rocket Launcher, Nanopulser, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Shock CCW. (0.5 | 30)
    THORAKITES Marksman Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    THORAKITES (Forward Observer, 360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)
    THORAKITES (Forward Observer, 360º Visor) Submachine gun, Chain Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)
    WARCOR (360º Visor) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    4 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  7. RolandTHTG

    RolandTHTG Well-Known Member

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    As a often limited insertion player with OSS, I like it because it feels that most of my pieces can a hit or bad roll and keep on with their mission. The lesser pieces might give me more orders, but if the attack piece goes down I have to spend those extra 4-5 orders to bring my next piece back up to the original attackers position. I'd rather still have that piece up there, ready to keep fighting.
    The big pieces also usually bring with them plenty of options for dealing with enemy HI and TAGs. Even the non-SWC options have multirifles, E-something or other, K1, etc. I might lose, but I feel like I have a chance, unlike when my big order lists have often just felt like i'm reduced to fishing for combi-rifle crits after my first two anti-armor options go down.
     
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