Expanding the rules discussion from this thread here, in order to keep the discussion in the right place. When a holomask unit replicates a unit with repeater, is the holomask unit allowed to check for rangebands concerning repeaters? Ex: Catherine Cho use holomask to hide as Saladin. Her public profile is now Saladin, which bears a repeater. Case 1 : a hacker tries to hack trough Cho's holomask repeater. Case 2 : a Player asks for repeaters coverage after moving a unit - outside repeater coverage Case 3 : a Player asks for repeaters coverage after moving a unit - inside repeater coverage No: The repeater does not bear a holomask, the measurement check isn't allowed. -> 1), 2) and 3) are enough to understand that the repeater is a holomask Yes: The holomask mimics a repeater until the point where it prevent an order to be fulfilled, if so, the holomask player has to inform that the equipment is fake. -> 1) is enough to understand that this is a holomask : the hack order cannot be performed, Cho's player inform that the piece of equipment is fake, coming from a Holomask state. -> 2) Cho's player inform that the unit is outside repeater coverage -> 3) Cho's player inform that the unit is inside repeater coverage. As meta-game, if Cho's player does not hack, it gives signal that this may be a fake repeater. I think this rule point is really important as it changes the approach of how holomasks can perform in this game as hiding other profiles. Thanks @Mahtamori for the explanations and links on this subject Trooper activation Holomask state
Just one moment - all measurements here are made from the active trooper. So the only thing that hacker would know - model with something looking as repeater is inside/outside his zoc... until he declares hacking...
https://infinitythewiki.com/Hacking_Area "Players can check the Hacking Area. Measurements must always be made from the Active Trooper and their Repeaters, checking a maximum of 8 inches from any point along their path." Hence the problem.
Whenever a model activates, you need to check the ZoC of the active model and all of their Repeaters. Saladin is a Repeater, so you need to check his ZoC. If something is holomasked as Saladin, they do not have a Repeater, so you do not check their ZoC.
Exactly. Same case as if a trooper is declaring a BS attack against a model that is holomasking as a model MIM -6 when they have no mimetism themselves. You MUST declare your opponent that his target number is the one without counting the MIM -6 at the very moment they reach the OES item number 5. In this case, when they try to check the 'holomasked as Saladin' troop ZoC for hacking area purpouses, as they do not have a repeater, you must inform that there is no repeater, so he can not check it. Therefore, they will know automatically that given Saladin is the holomasked trooper and not the real one. Sorry! Holomask is just... quite meh in N4.
Thanks for these clarifications. What about any model activated in Saladin/Cho army ? Can we also check the repeater range of the holomask, even if it's not a "true" repeater, to keep the illusion ?
A holomask doesn't have to say it does not have mimetism -6 or a missile launcher just by checking range or LoF - it only specify it when an order is consumed. Why hack would work differently ? Edit : typed faster than I thinked, I removed some nonsense
If our fake Saladin is not active trooper he can't check his zoc. Only active trooper (hacker in our case) checks his own(and his repeaters) zoc.
Incorrect unfortunately. The very moment you activate any model of your army your opponent has the right to check his ZoC and his Hacking area. His ZoC extends from his model, and his Hacking Area is equal to his ZoC and friendly repeaters. Otherwise... how you can legally check if an Killer Hacker Holomasked Tian Gou that is faking being a regular bluecoat is allowing to declare reset to a model in the other side of the table but within a repeater? In the scenario you're proposing, a Holomasked Hacker would be able to make the enemy to forfeit their ARO declaration altogether because they don't know if they're in the hacking area or not... In other words, we would be back to the same scenario that N4 was before any FAQ to solve the 'I should ARO but I don't know If I can ARO or legaly allowed to even declare ARO'.
Is an active trooper allowed to check ZoC around his holomask-fake-repeater ? Does an active trooper must check ZoC around his repeaters ?
https://infinitythewiki.com/Trooper_Activation#Order_Expenditure_Sequence 2.1. ARO Check. The Reactive Player checks if they are allowed to declare AROs with their Troopers. Players(plural) can check from the Active Trooper(single) if any Trooper or Game Element is inside the Zone of Control (ZoC) of the Active Trooper.
You can check being discussed with IJW in the N4 and BuGs the need to add it in the EOS page as people stop it there first, instead of looking at the errata of hacking area. https://forum.corvusbelli.com/threads/n4-and-codeone-wiki-bugs.38492/page-5
First of all, the one who is going to request for sure to check the Hacking Area of the active trooper is not the active trooper player, but the opponent, because he would want to know the ZoC of the active trooper and Hacking Area. Second, you can NOT fake measuring a 'fake repeater' hacking area. It is not there, it does not exist, you can not check it. Third. You must check ZoC around repeater, if your opponet request it.
It is already added to wiki recently. And it says - check active troopers zoc. Show me such rule please.
I invite you to read IJW answer in the thread I linked: https://forum.corvusbelli.com/threads/n4-and-codeone-wiki-bugs.38492/page-5. Let me reproduce it here for your convinence: Second paragraph of the first green box found in the following page: https://infinitythewiki.com/Hacking_Area You can technically say 'but is the other player who is checking it, not forcing me to check', but then we enter into the area of going againt the fair play and speeding up the game if you're not helping the player to measure and check things.
It was abotut types of ARO allowed through repeaters. And its again: "Measurements MUST ALWAYS be made from the Active Trooper and their Repeaters,"
This is where I disagree : the holomask-repeater is here until an order is used to prove the opposite by hacking trough the repeater. Same as BS Shooting : it's a mimetism -6 Missile Launcher until you make a BS attack against it, proving it's just no-mimetism combi rifle by forcing the use of mimetism rule. Holomask replicates equipment : the unit count as holding a repeater the same as it counts for a WIP 15 or a specific loadout; it's true until we need to throw dices. Only equipment holomask cannot replicates are deployable weapons : https://infinitythewiki.com/HoloMask_State IMO this approach does not violate any rule and is closer to the intent than "revealing holomask by meta-game" Maybe we need an official FAQ concerning this?
You're ignoring the key bullet point: However, the player will use the real Unit Profile of the HoloMask bearer, just as it appears on their Army List. His real Unit Profile does not have a repeater, therefore does not have a repeater area. Let me put another example: Holomasking as an Albedo unit. You don't have Albedo really, so your opponents MSV are not affected and they have legal ARO's when you activate the holomasking unit, and they have LOF to the holomasking unit when their MSV troopers activate.
