I could've sworn it had Courage when I was looking at it earlier, but upon double checking it is indeed missing the skill. TAGs in general are far from busted; the Gator, however, is, and I outlined why; it's only slightly less effective (IMO) than a Raicho, but quite a bit cheaper. 4 points cheaper than it "should" be would, in fact, make it pretty close to the most undercosted thing in the game; I struggle to find other profiles that I would similarly recommend a 4-point increase (or SIX points for the NCO profile). Not even Frenzy HI get that kind of discount, and they at least pay for it a non-zero percentage of the time. The Gator is cheaper simply because it's new and shiny; there is nothing in its rules, no significant weakness over other, similar, more expensive models, that justifies its point cost.
My guess would be: [CB headquaters] Person 1: Guijia has supercoolmini [Narrator Voice: "It does"] Person 2: But it still doesn't sell Person 1: So the next, similar TAG has to be better for the points. I have no bloody idea if Guijia sells or doesn't but I do have a suspicion that TAGs aren't CB's best income makers. "Arguably" does some work here. NBW only works against MA, MA works always, and against MA 2 is about as good as NBW. And there are some CC monsters that are unaffected by NBW but are affected by MA (like Zuleyka). Personally I would prefer MA, cause I really like the idea of TAGS rotflstomping stuff instead of pewpewing it, and I think that dismal CC capability of TAGs across the board is a serious mistake on CB's part. The TAG CC scene from Outrage! was really cool, to bad it never happens in the game.(Don't get me wrong though, I do think that Guijia is a worse deal than Gator, but maybe it's more of Guijia problem than Gator problem?) And that is why CB should push new TAGs. To sell them! TAGs are cool. They should really be a bigger part of the game. But right now its usually hard to justify the big purchase. I do hope all the midline "boring" TAGs wil get some love. Preferably the kinda of love Gator got - that is one making it less of a paper tiger not more of a Alpha striker. Maghariba ARM 9! Guijia with EXP CCW and emc:hacker -3! Zeta Sixth Sense! I do not. F***kin Q-drone should be at least 3 points more expensive than it is. Mimetism shouldn't be a 1 point skill and definitely not on a total reaction unit. (I'm half joking but I'm half serious too). Also you kinda have to look at it from a percentage point of view. Spammable troop that is undercosted two points will probably save you more points that a single Gator undercosted by 4. If the extent of Gator brokeness is about one warcor or adding a grenade launcher to an alguacil, then I do not think it is very broken.
Looking at this tag and Maggy from Haqqislam I know we got a bad deal. If the Gator stays as is our tag needs a massive point reduction and less bloat.
I do not disagree. Never have I thought "I have to get this sweet profile fighting for me next battle" when looking at the Big M. I like the idea of a Spider Tank, but those points can be spent on something as capable and less prone to Speculos. (and also cheaper to buy, easier to paint, and waaay easier to transport) Yeah, Gator seems better than similar TAGs. But maybe its them that need to change.
Guijia is now on a ridiculous point, having only MA2 and Super Jump makes it over 80 points? Hopefully CB just forgot updating the points cost of it into N4 settings.
That works too, I always regret taking out of the cabinet and putting it on the table (when Im not using it to proxy something). YuJing really needs to sit down and figure out how a multi-planetary empire with near limitless R&D and production is getting dumpstered by a bunch of (presumably) coked out, somewhat hypoxic mad scientists in a tin can.
I completely agree as a CJC player. Would have much rather had a rework of the Iguana and Geckos with some new models.
Their models are fine for the most part, and Geckos got their rework, theyre pretty good on paper, Iggy needs and overhaul. and then there is the lizard, at least the Iguana is so bad it gets remembered.
Some of you seem to think that all units should be costed following a very strict, rigid and consistant scale. Why? It's boring. It's nice that some factions get units that are a bit stronger/cheaper than their equivalent in other factions (the Q-drone for example). To me, it gives flavour to the game. What would be the point of all getting the exact same perfectly balanced stuff? Perfect balance is an illusion anyway in a game like Infinity. What matters is that all factions get a few of these fancier toys (and I'm not saying it is the case, unfortunately).
I agree this can be a way of bringing more flavour to the game, but then it should at least be consistent with the faction. NCO and CC proficiency (even if it's largely defensive) are not particularly representative of Nomads. One would have expected these in YJ and JSA respectively. For Nomads, this should lean more heavily into the infowar aspect of the game. Give him Zero Pain to make him strong against comms attacks, have his mine dispenser shoot Cyber Mines instead or add a Fast Panda. Problem is not that the Gator is super optimized, he is optimized in areas he shouldn't be.
While I mostly agree with you (especially about the "typed" sectorials, I like when there is a defined and characteristic style), I'm not sure that most of the people would stop complaining if the changes you described were applied to the Gator...
Used a Gator against Ramah yesterday, and it was fun and effective. Having essentially two free orders (tac aware + NCO) let me redeploy multiple times. Movement + multi-HMG let him run around the board taking out multiple threats, including a fully-linked HMG Zhyaden and putting two Muhktars into NWI. CC 20 + NBW meant he could risk getting CC'd if necessary... Only downside was when he got randomly stunned by an Unmasking HVT and had to end his last attack run :(
Bureaucracy? I'm really hoping next year is a Yu Jing year. ISS while made a lot better recently still could use some work and new figures. Hopefully a TAG added too.
To be fair since Corregidor fireteams have been heavily nerfed they needed some nice things, the Gator is just one of them. Sure it's a bit undercooked but considering that it's very hard to receive compositional benefits in Corregidor, I think it's justified, especially when you compare the Gator to the steaming pile of overpriced shit the Iguana is. I would have preferred that they gave the Iguana a few buffs and made it playable.
What are you even talking about. You got the exact same nerf that everyone else got; -2 BS in a Mixed Core. Most of your shooters hit BS 14-15 in a full core, even if Mixed, which is *exactly* where everyone else is (with the exception of PanO). Boo-hoo. The Vostok is now "only" BS 13 with Mimietism (-6) and Marksmanship, I'm sure it's completely unusable... As far as fireteam compositions went, you lost the ability to put Evaders in a Jaguar Core. No, I'm not going to pretend the other things ever mattered; all I ever saw on the other side of a table was Jaguar Soup Core + Jaguar Soup Haris. Meanwhile, you gained the ability to form a Haris with Alguacils, include Wild Cats with Alguacil Fire Teams, form a Haris with a Gecko, Wildcat Wildcard, Digger Wildcard, and a handful of smaller things. Oh and Jazz FTO went up by 3 points. Which is a nerf, but she swapped her SMG to a combi rifle. She's still the best hacker in the game, but at least you're now paying closer to what she's actually worth. Also, SMG to Combi is normally a 4-point increase. To summarize: you lost 1 relevant fireteam option, gained half a dozen new ones, and want to claim that you were "heavily nerfed." Please.
Speaking of fireteams, the Gator can also Duo with a Geko, Tsyklon, Vostok, Wildcat Engineer or Hacker, Jazz, Lupe, even a Digger. Guijia can duo with some good things in IA but nothing as cheap and good as those. Any of the ones I mentioned are good in some way. Lupe for smoke, ENG to fix, hacker to hack back, Repeater plus firepower with Tsyklon and Vostok. (WTF did they allow these to be wildcard?)
"Good wildcard now makes Fireteam mixed" is not a nerf specific to Corregidor; it's the same nerf basically everyone got. Considering Matt's initial claim was that Corregidor's fireteams being heavily nerfed [in the context of the overall game] justify the Gator being OP [in order for Corregidor to remain viable], Jazz making fireteams mixed is zero-sum in the context of the overall game and thus invalid as a supporting argument. In my opinion, excepting the same nerfs that literally every sectorial (except Steel Phalanx? Maybe?) received, Corregidor came out with better, more varied Fireteam options on the whole. Yes, Corregidor lost the Jaguar Core option, but there's a lot more options overall that breathe new life into units like Wildcats that previously saw extremely little play. There's also the points to be made that A: one thing being bad does not justify something else being OP, and B: Even if it did, Corregidor's loss does not justify Vanilla Nomad's gain.
It is not the same for all sectorials and all units, but, yes, many great units got the mixed fireteam treatment, that does not make it less of a nerf because many got it.
