Bringing this one on from Infinity the Discord. It is a request for clarification of the FAQ entry rather than an actual question. The FAQ PDF says: 1. Use his full MOV value. 2. End his movement as far as possible from the movement's starting point. 3. End his movement as close as possible to the enemy Deployment Zone. Meanwhile the version written on the wiki says: * Use his full MOV value. * End his movement as far as possible from the movement's starting point. * End his movement as close as possible to the enemy Deployment Zone. (Not copied verbatim since the wiki is currently 503) The important difference is that the PDF indicates that the most important thing is to use the full MOV value, but when you remove the numbering it seems like we are expected to pick the end point that fills as many points as possible to as full extent as possible. There are cases where paths can be blocked or where Small Gates may or may not force a unit to dismount their motorcycle, etc, where this is important. Since this is not a voluntary movement, it kind of needs to be spelled out when and who has agency if there's choices involved.
Since me and @inane.imp already have argued over this and come to an understanding I'll note that ignoring the numbering and trying to check as many of the bullet points as possible and to the greatest extent they are able to be completed does yield the most consistent aggressive movement, which is most likely the intended way to handle this. Adding this thread for discussion since it has been brought up by other people to increase the visibility of the discrepancy.
It's really a conflict between (2) and (3), since (1) can always be achieved by oscillating. It would help to have a specific example where there are two potential movement paths, one of which goes farthest towards the DZ while the other goes farthest from the movement's starting point. Speaking of which, I don't think it was ever resolved whether "distance from starting point" gets measured by movement path or as the crow flies for this.
Well, 2 and 3 are what's preventing you from oscillating so there is a natural conflict between them and 1. So here's an example. The mission is Armoury and Penthisilea is sitting on her bike at the Armoury door closest to her DZ and there are no enemies nearby. When she activates impetuously; Will she prioritize (3) and get off her bike and run forward 4" closer to the enemy DZ into the middle of the armoury? Does this count as fulfilling (1)? * Will she prioritize (1) & (2) more and stay on her bike and move around either corner and then roughly 3" closer to the enemy DZ? Will she prioritize (1) & (3) more and stay on her bike and move around directly off to either side in an 8" linear dash exactly 0" closer to the enemy DZ? Another example. Penthisilea is now on the very left edge of the map. The terrain is dense, there's a short but tight corridor straight ahead, and towards the middle of the table there is a zig-zagging corridor thanks to a couple of parked VW vans. Activating she finds out while measuring her movement that she can not quite squeeze past the tight corridor because she's starting too far away; Will she make a compromise between (1) and (2) while prioritizing (3) and move forward towards the gap between the edge and the building, using 4" movement ending up 4" away and 4" closer to the enemy DZ? Will she prioritize (1) while making a compromise between (2) and (3) and move in towards the middle of the table; using 8" of movement, ending up 6" away and 2" closer to the enemy DZ? * Will she prioritize (1) and (2) more and completely ignore (3) and move directly towards her own DZ; using 8" of movement, ending up 8" away and -8" closer to the enemy DZ? So beyond reconciling the difference between FAQ and Wiki; we have a few questions that may or may not be obvious. If she can fulfil two of three, but not all three, can the player choose among the several resulting options? Or do we use the priorities as tie-breakers? Does fulfilling one of the bullet-points partially count for something? * The two suggested paths marked with * are, in my opinion; a. the most correct according to the spirit of the rules and b. the most incorrect according to either way of prioritizing the bullet points.
This is right? 1 is on foot 4" inside 2 is 8" around the corner 3 is 8" directly on side The path 1 should not be considered unless she can engage an enemy model. She can move 8", so she shouldn't be able to move less than that (weird things apart, like she cannot move more than 4" on bike due to narrow alleys) The path 2 (on either side of the armory) should be the correct one. The path 3 (again on either side of the armory) does not fulfill at all the "closer to enemy DZ"
I think that path (1) raises a separate question about motorcycles (and TAGs). The unit has to "use her full MOV value." If she Dismounts, her full MOV value is 4, if she doesn't, it's 8. In either case, she's using her full MOV value. When a unit has two profiles with differerent MOV values, are they required to choose the profile with the higher MOV (i.e. does "use her full MOV value" actually mean "move the farthest distance the unit is capable of"?) It's an interesting question but I think it's separate from the OP question so I propose to not address it here. I'm going to assume that the armory doors are closed, so the unit is choosing between paths (2) or (3). The second question, then, is whether "as far as possible" is measured by shortest movement path, or as the crow flies. If it's shortest movement path, then (2) and (3) both move as far as possible (8") from the starting position. If it's as the crow flies, then (3) moves farther away from the starting position than (2). @Mahtamori you persuaded me here: https://forum.corvusbelli.com/threa...ock-of-the-situation.39407/page-2#post-411463 that it must be shortest movement path. Basically for the same reason as illustrated above - if it's as the crow flies, then impetuous units can basically never turn corners. If it is shortest movement path, then there's no issue in the example. (2) and (3) both move maximum possible distance, and (2) gets closer to the enemy DZ, so the unit must choose (2).
Inane and me discussed that and I had to concede that it's like 99% to be treated like being Prone. No can do unless it literally actually definitely is the fastest, farthest, and reaching closest - which it almost never is. What we settled on, btw, was that you tick as many of the bullet points as possible, but there's still some pretty weird situations.
It only makes sense 'as the crow flies' but also taking into account 'measuring distance' rules (ie use the same point on the SIL to measure from - this is only relevant when base sizes change). If you measure 'movement path' then there is no difference between 1 and 3: both will give you the same answer.
I don't think there's any way to read the FAQ that doesn't involve some redundancy. I agree that 1 and 3 would be pretty similar, but they wouldn't be identical. I think it's "shortest movement path," not "movement path." It prevents oscillation to reduce movement distance - if you oscillate, then your distance travelled will be 8" but your distance from start to end point will be less than 8". As the crow flies is worse, since it reduces to "you must always move in a straight line." I've never seen anyone play it that way - we're all playing that you have to round corners and head towards the enemy DZ.
We had a forced dismount yesterday, never happened before At table corner, Green is Impersonator Marker, Red is Kuroshi Rider. There is not enough space to pass between IMP and table edge, nor between IMP and building. Measuring, the only way to advance was dismounting.
Couldn't the rider move between the building and the back edge? I guess not with his Impedious activation as to not "double back". https://infinitythewiki.com/Move "Any surface they move on must be at least half as wide as their base."
The 1.1.1 FAQ has effectively removed "without doubling back". We can only assume that the top opening in the is 27mm or lower, image not to scale and all that. The unit would not be allowed to touch the IMP unit so squeezing that space would be impossible.
As I wrote, we checked the path passing behind the building but there was no way the final point were closer to the enemy DZ than with Dismount and go...
Well trhe only choise is go impedious and dismount, or just don't and stay where you are. Still better then old Bountyhunters with snipers on roofs that "just" rolled the 18 and now spontanously draged a bike (with mystery stats) on there. ;D
