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Doctor in Invincible Army

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Geschmeidig, Mar 20, 2019.

  1. Geschmeidig

    Geschmeidig New Member

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    Hey guys!

    Do you think a Doctor makes sense when i have many multiple Wounds units? I always feel sad when i lose a 30+ points model... =D but on the other hand, it takes some time until i can put the Doc into good use.
    Any advice? Thanks alot!
     
  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    This past weekend I played in Nordic Masters and I lost two matches because (in part) that I prioritized Engineer over Doctor. Didn't need Engineer even once (even forgot to deploy it one game). Needed Doctor in two matches when my main link ate really unlucky AROs (or in one case, a stupid ARO and unlucky Fire saves).

    Yes, Doctor. All the time. Every list. Engineer? Maybe. E/M isn't that common.
     
  3. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    Well it made sense to me when I ran this list in the German Satallite. It was mostly about strapping the doctor on the Neurocinetics ML with duct tape and heal him if he ever died. The rest of the list really didn't matter that much as the link usually only dies when they are too far up the map anyways.

    Invincible Meme
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    TAI SHENG (Chain of Command) Mk12, Chain-colt, Stun Grenades / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 49)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Duo, Tactical Awareness) HMG / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (1.5 | 38)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Haris, Tactical Awareness) Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    HǍIDÀO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 26)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    DĀOYĪNG Lieutenant L2 Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    Zhanshi YĪSHĒNG Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    YĀN HUǑ 2 Missile Launchers + TinBot C (Neurocinetics) / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 56)
    ZHĒNCHÁ (Forward Observer) Submachine Gun, D.E.P., Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 34)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    5.5 SWC | 298 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  4. Geschmeidig

    Geschmeidig New Member

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    Ah thanks alot! I'll keep that in mind. In case of Engineers i rarely actually repair things - mostly breaching through walls for an extra entry point.
    How about the Yaozao? I often get the feeling its a waste of points, especially when i have such costly models in my list.
     
  5. Zewrath

    Zewrath Nordic Master

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    Well, again, it depends on the missions really. I used the Engineer as a datatracker, as that extra order for remote repairing and completing objectives was quite handy, this also almost always forces the opponent to use an extra order to put that ML REM straight to dead, because he knows you have the ability to repair the REM, as well as moving forward. Idk, I almost always find them to be worth the 3 point investment.

    Meme Team
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    TAI SHENG (Chain of Command) Mk12, Chain-colt, Stun Grenades / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 49)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Duo, Tactical Awareness) HMG / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (1.5 | 38)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Haris, Tactical Awareness) Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 37)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    PANGGULING FTO (Repeater) Light Shotgun / Electric Pulse. (0 | 13)
    DĀOYĪNG Lieutenant L2 Hacker (Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 29)
    ZHĒNCHÁ (Forward Observer) Submachine Gun, D.E.P., Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 34)
    HǍIDÀO Engineer Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 28)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    Zhanshi YĪSHĒNG Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
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  6. Geschmeidig

    Geschmeidig New Member

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    Do you think i should put away the Haris option so i can add a Yaozao for my Engineer in this list?


    Invincible Army
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    ZÚYǑNG Lieutenant Combi Rifle / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0 | 27)
    TAI SHENG (Chain of Command) Mk12, Chain-colt, Stun Grenades / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 49)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Haris, Tactical Awareness) Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 37)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Smart Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 18)
    LÙ DUĀN Mk12, Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (0 | 21)
    HAC TAO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 67)
    WÈIBĪNG Yaókòng Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16)
    MECH-ENGINEER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    Zhanshi YĪSHĒNG Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)

    3.5 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  7. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Yaozao are very useful. I've used them to halt the progress of Achilles, I've used them to provide additional Discover checks, I've used them to get in the way and block my models from gaining cover. Try not to do the last thing. But always they are faster and thus more order efficient than the Doctor/Engineer. Sticking two of them on a Doctor allows the Doctor to sit in proper cover while still being present on both left and right flanks!
     
  8. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    No. That Zuyong is providing Tinbot B and a Tactical Awareness order, both of which I would value higher than Yaozao. I would rather re-evaluate the decision to put both a Chain of Command and the LT in the same link.
     
  9. Geschmeidig

    Geschmeidig New Member

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    Right. I still need to figure out how to handle the LT properly. Perhaps i should drop the Hac Tao and get a cheaper Killer Hacker instead.
    I just love camo mission runners =D
     
  10. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    It's sort of difficult. Daoying is a stupidly good LT and fuels either Mowang or Tai Sheng nicely, but you'd still probably want the Haidao KHD if you drop the Hac Tao but you can't have both Haidao MSR and Haidao KHD in the same list. However, theoretically you could reform the Fireteam to replace the MSR with the KHD when it gets time to move forward.
    I hate doing this since it sort of breaks much of the point of your list (which I assume is the Hac Tao), but you could try this:

    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Duo, Tactical Awareness) HMG / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (1.5 | 38)
    TAI SHENG (Chain of Command) Mk12, Chain-colt, Stun Grenades / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 49)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Haris, Tactical Awareness) Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 37)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Smart Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 18)
    WÈIBĪNG Yaókòng Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16)
    Zhanshi YĪSHĒNG Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    HǍIDÀO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 26)
    HǍIDÀO Engineer Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 28)
    YÁOZĂO Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    DĀOYĪNG Lieutenant L2 Hacker (Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 29)

    5.5 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Removed Lu Duan (didn't want to add a second combat group for 1 model)
    Added Zuyong HMG TacAware to the fireteam
    Upgraded Gongcheng to Haidao Engineer
    Upgraded Zuyong LT to Daoying LT2 Hacker
    Downgraded Hac Tao KHD to Haidao KHD
    Added 3 Yaozao
    -> Use Haidao MSR to suppress enemy fireteams during turn 1
    -> Reform link to remove Haidao MSR and add Haidao KHD when pushing
    -> Use Zuyong HMG to push forward
    -> Use Daoying either to Fairy Dust or to fuel Tai Sheng
    Change the Son Bae SML to a Son Bae ML? You don't have much in the way of Forward Observer or Sat Lock ability and gaining access to EXP and hit mode could be very valuable.
     
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  11. Geschmeidig

    Geschmeidig New Member

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    Thank you! I'll try that out. I used to take the Lu Duan to safely clear mines but i guess i can clear minefields with the Yaozao if need be.
     
  12. zapp

    zapp Well-Known Member

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    If I play the Zhanshi Core, I often only use a Zhanshi paramedic. I still fear the EM/2 grenades, but they depend on the opponent I guess.
    Dart once disabled 3 of 5 Zuyongs with one grenade in turn1 and I was lucky to have an engineer in my list.
     
  13. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    That depends on your meta. Mine has 2 Druze, 2 Starco, 2 Vanilla Haqq, 2 Bahram and 2 OSS. There's an absolute assload of E/M of every sort. You don't bring an engineer around here you're gonna have alot of expensive bricks with IA.

    I do like the Doctor though with IA as well, OP. Just bear in mind it's not a silver bullet. Your opponents will often just take the extra steps to finish their kills if you have one available.
     
    #13 Triumph, Mar 20, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019
  14. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

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    Eh... I don't trust doctors. They always kill far more of my models than they save and waste a bunch of orders doing it.
     
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  15. ObviousGray

    ObviousGray Frenzied Mushroom
    Warcor

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    Aside from duct-taping high value HIs or running a Hac Tao surprise, I don't bring docs.

    Usually I pick Engi boy to patch up REMs, especially Son-bae.
     
  16. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    That's kinda the point. Especially valuable if you run low body count and expect to live through reactive turn without losing too much of your stuff. Having honest 2 wounds instead of this new hipster NWI + immunity setup on many of our units is actually a benefit in this regard.

    And besides, I'd rather have my opponent spending extra order to finish my piece off than having to spend mine to do it myself :P
     
  17. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    It has to depend on which model you're trying to save. 18 points and 0 SWC isn't bloody in a faction that naturally gravitates towards single battle groups and the fact that this model will make yoir opponent spend that extra order (or two) on killing your model typically makes it worth bringing.
    But if it's your only NCO that went down or your Daoying LT2 or your Datatracker, then maybe it's worth the orders and CTs trying to get it back up where as a Zuyong Tinbot can potentially be written off as a business expense.
     
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  18. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Well, attending to irreplaceable pieces is basically the point of healing, considering how order economy in this game works. Even in Haqq where it's very unlikely that you will finish your own folks off (aside from trying to Akbar another Jan or something) you still have to use that option sparingly to ensure the result will save you / cost your opponent more orders than healing attempt costs you.

    Well, sometimes it's not something truly irreplaceable, but maybe it's a point trooper or specialist in a link which you've sunken a lot of orders into to get them into position and really need that guy to do his job to make the investment you've made this turn worth it.