EFFECTS Using a SymbioMate also avoids having to perform a Guts Roll in that same Order. Yes: * avoid VERB [WITH OBJECT] 1Keep away from or stop oneself from doing (something) ‘avoid excessive exposure to the sun’ ‘Gerard avoided meeting his eye’ 1.1 Contrive not to meet (someone) ‘boys queued up to take Gloria out, but avoided Deirdre’ 1.2 Not go to or through (a place) ‘this route avoids downtown Boston’ 1.3 Prevent from happening. ‘book early to avoid disappointment’ 2Law Repudiate, nullify, or render void (a decree or contract) ‘if the original owner had avoided his contract with the rogue, ownership of the goods would have reverted to him’**
Considering how you do need to make an ARM/BTS roll or suffer a wound... yeah, I'd say a Guts check is one of the effects of suffering a succesfull attack
Just as an aside; we wouldn't be having this debate if failing a Guts Roll wasn't nearly always a good thing - for instance, if failing Guts Roll made the trooper Isolated for one or even two turns.
Specifically for, say, a Nikoul sniper it's often a very good thing. I think if I had my druthers SymbioMates wouldn't be bypassed by crits but rather by Surprise Shot/Attack, thus allowing more reliable penetration of their defenses while still providing a cost to their removal (Revealing one of their markers).
Ugh, this makes the already excellent camouflage rule even better (and punishes sectorials without many marker state troopers). Why not make fire ignore a 'mate? Most symbiotroops aren't affected by their fire vulnerability any more so this would add back some of that.
To be honest, I thought I remembered Symbiomates not protecting against fire. I was surprised when it came up in a game and I was mistaken.
Troopers in Foxhole state have Courage anyway. Yeah, that was the N2 version, they... improved somewhat.
So looking at reason (and the direct Spanish translation) no Guts Roll at all if you pull a Mate, even if you eat a Crit in the same Order?
That's a very polite way of saying it. Yes, but if throwing a symbiomate meant that you didn't get to make a Guts roll in the first place... you couldn't auto-fail it.
From the wiki: Sin embargo, aunque el usuario emplee su SymbioMate, todos aquellos Ataques que hayan obtenido un resultado Crítico se aplicarán siempre. Translated: "However, even if the user activates his Symbiomate, all those Attacks which had obtained a Critical result will be always applied". I'd assume that the Crits would force a Guts roll as normal.
@psychoticstorm @ijw would it be possible for you guys to get a definite answer on this from CB? It keeps coming up on the forums and tournaments enough that I'd make a claim it qualifies for a FAQ.
Given a guts role is an added effect of the attack I'd say yes. Since the attack was negated, it would be super weird to then take a guts role for a thing that never happened?
