1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hemos actualizado nuestra Política de Privacidad acorde con la nueva RGPD. +Info // We've updated our Privacy Policy to comply with the GDPR. +Info
    Dismiss Notice

Deploying Ten order list?

Discussion in 'PanOceania' started by andre61, Apr 24, 2019.

  1. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    409
    Ok! I came up with a new Joan list for my MO army, I really never played a 10 order list, And I have no cue on the best way to deploy it, I'm not sure if I should try and deploy it like a 13 order list or if I should do something else? I feel this might be a too general of a question, but I just need some type ideal or what do vet Pano players do? Any feed back would be helpful.

    Crazy Joan
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (+1 | 49)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 39)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 35)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 35)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 31)
    BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)
    SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration, Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)
    SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)
    ORDER SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 15)
    MACHINIST (Father-Engineer) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)
    PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)

    4 SWC | 298 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  2. ijw

    ijw Wargaming Trader, Freelance Editor (UK)
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    5,375
    Likes Received:
    10,890
    I's probably going to work better with some concrete examples, for example if going first, going second against lots of Camo, second against an aggressive Fireteam etc. etc.
     
    andre61 likes this.
  3. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    409
    Ok, got it my bad, when I deploy my units and my list is lets say I have a 13 orders, I put 3 units on one flank and then I put 3 on the other then I always put my 5man fire team on the center, My flank units are always some type of LI with a combi and Flash pulse units but with a 10 order list I see I will not have enough to cover each flank, this was the issue I always have with 10 order list and it's why I never play them. Sorry I'm at work more to come later.
     
    Golem2God likes this.
  4. Teslarod

    Teslarod Trebuchet Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,438
    Likes Received:
    2,877
    @andre61 at 10 Orders (assuming Limited Insertion) MO starts functioning properly.
    Unfortunately LI has some problems but lets ignore that for now.

    Here is what MO really does well and what noone else can replicate in the same fashion.
    9 HI, 2 Links, Link flipping, options galore, resilient to boot and fun to play. Hacking can be a bit of a problem and Lt is still an issue but far less than usual.
    Military Orders
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]4
    KNIGHT OF SANTIAGO Lieutenant (Specialist Operative) Spitfire, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades, D-Charges / Pistol, DA CCW. (1 | 43)
    MAGISTER KNIGHT Missile Launcher / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 32)
    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)
    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)
    MAGISTER KNIGHT Panzerfaust, Light Shotgun / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 22)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 39)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (Fireteam: Haris, MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0.5 | 36)
    KNIGHT OF SANTIAGO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges + 1 TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 38)
    KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 31)
    ORDER SERGEANT Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
    Lesh', Skoll, mrstream and 3 others like this.
  5. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    409
    Very cool list, I like it but, if I may. what units will you use to cover your flanks and what units will covers the center, and how would you deploy if you had to deploy 1st. How would you play this list against a defensive link team?
     
    #5 andre61, Apr 24, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2019
    mrstream likes this.
  6. Teslarod

    Teslarod Trebuchet Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,438
    Likes Received:
    2,877
    If you go second start with the Magister Core and a Hospitaler Haris. Then just kinda hope the ML and Panzerfausts will be enough stalling (typical Limited Insertion problem).
    If you go first deploy your Magisters and the Lt in defensive positions (so Ex Imp doesn't kill them) and run the Hospitaler Core Hospitaler Core (3 Hospitalers, Santiago KHD and OS) right at your opponent, trying to get that BS23 Shotgun to win the game for you.

    Limited Insertion is much more of an arcade game and lacks the usual tactical depth unrestricted 300 points have. It's more about having fun smashing things than playing the complicated game that Infinity can be. That said you still have plenty things to play around with thaks to having Stealth and useable CC values on top of a full set of weapon layouts.
     
    andre61 likes this.
  7. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    409
    Also, how do you deploy a 10 order list on a WB table or a open table? I know this is a very open question because it depends on table set and terrain, Also do it make sense to put any units on over watch?
     
  8. Sedral

    Sedral Invincible Officier

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2017
    Messages:
    519
    Likes Received:
    866
    My usual go-to deployement tactics with HI fireteams are:

    - If I play first + deploy first, everything in the middle so I can go wherever I want without spending too much orders just moving laterally across the board because my opponent counter-deployed me.

    - If I play second + deploy second, I go for a refused flank and turtle in a corner of the board, this way i reduce the venue of attack for my opponent which makes it much easier to defend my army despite the fewer number of bodies.

    Your mileage may vary of course.
     
    andre61 likes this.
  9. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    6,146
    Likes Received:
    9,615
    While it's not MO-specific, my typical deployment for the Samurai 7 (HI core plus TAG) is to put the Core on one avenue of approach and the TAG on the other. Sam7 also has Yojimbo for a motorcycle smoke-chucker, he is often my reserve model to use to screen one of the two (either TAG or Core). Then I have a Doc, Engineer, and basic Hacker hiding in the backfield, usually facing my DZ.
     
    Skoll likes this.
  10. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    409
    Thanks you for every bodies feed back, this is what I was thinking about doing. but, I was not sure if it was the right way to deploy.
     
    AdmiralJCJF likes this.
  11. Teslarod

    Teslarod Trebuchet Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,438
    Likes Received:
    2,877
    Truth be told if you have that probem with a 10 Order List after you Link your Magisters and only have to hide 5 non Impetuous bodies that table will be won by your HMG alone if you go first and you'll always be up to your neck in trouble if you go second (well, more than you already are in LI anyway).
     
  12. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    409
    Ok, you are right, how would you deploy them?
     
  13. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

    Joined:
    May 23, 2018
    Messages:
    1,532
    Likes Received:
    1,236
    Now I have yet to get some good practice in with HI links, or links in general ( Filthy Vanilla plebian here. ), my general approach for deployment when running a single combat group list ( AKA Basically the only kind of list that I run. ) is this:

    Whoever wants to shoot far, gets placed where they can access the longest sight lines. Inverse for those who want to shoot up close, those get placed where stuff's the most cluttered.

    You really don't wanna start putting stuff out as sacrificial lambs: you don't have the bodies for this, nor should you be taking sacrificial lambs in a SCG list anyways IMO. That said, covering the table edges in case your enemy decides to pull off some sneeki breeki AD troops is a sound idea.

    If taking an actual dedicated ARO roadblock, I'd place them in such a way that the enemy can't engage them from their DZ, since in an SCG list, you aren't looking to kill or trade in ARO, you're looking to waste as many orders and possible. And that includes walking orders.

    If you go second and deploy second, do try to stay away from the big scary units. It's probably better to avoid having to ARO against them, since again, you're working with a limited body count.

    If you go first though, place stuff that'd make beelining them into position the fastest and/or safest.

    For reserves:
    If going second, keep the most valuable stuff in reserve and hide them as far away as possible from your opponents scary killers. Disregard this if you took an actual ARO roadblock: keep those in reserve, and just counter deploy.
    If going first, keep your most prevalent attacker in reserve and place him where he can start having an effect immediately, based on the enemies deployment. Like a Swiss Guard already within and order or two or the enemy TR REM, stuff like that.

    Beyond that, I like to have an equal-ish spread of influence over the table. Less work dragging a unit to the place they need to be when there's another unit that can attempt their job in place already.
     
    andre61 and Section9 like this.
  14. yoink101

    yoink101 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2018
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    380
    First, some shameless self-promotion.

    Second, @Maksimas expressed it better than I would have: you don't have bodies to bleed. The beauty of a second combat group with a bunch of fugazi and a warcore is that you can lose them all and you still have your main order pool.

    Play to the advantage of limited insertion in MO, use your multi-wound linked models. A magister knight in a full core team is pretty likely to still be on the table even after losing a face to face roll in the reactive turn. 2 wounds, BS15, good rangebands on a panzerfaust or missile launcher, and arm 6 in cover add up to mean you're likely to take 0-1 wounds even when hit with a linked HMG or multi sniper. Make sure to fall back into cover by failing guts when you lose a face to face roll. Ideally you can set up so that your AROs can't be engaged right off the bat with your opponent's big guns without spending a few orders to reposition first.

    If you get stuck going second and can keep your losses to 1-2 guys (definitely not more than 3) and can doctor them up as you advance up the table, you can get yourself into a good position for your counter attack.

    In some ways, deploying with 10 models is easier than with large order pools. You simply have a smaller footprint so you don't have to bunch or line up leaving yourself vulnerable. Instead, you can place every model in the exact place you need it to be. Which means, you need to go in with a game plan. You need to know what each model you have is going to accomplish during the game and where and how it will do so once you see the table.
     
    andre61 and Section9 like this.
  15. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    6,146
    Likes Received:
    9,615
    I very much agree with this.

    My vanilla YJ lists usually ran the Zuyong Automedikit HMG LT (obvious once you counted SWC), a Daofei hacker, some big beatstick like a Yan Huo HRMC, and a Guilang sniper (plus a Guilang minelayer for the extra camo marker). The HMG and 'other beatstick' both got put in different places. The Guilang got placed within 8" of the Daofei for maximum camo shenanigans, but usually pretty far back.


    I really agree with this. No matter what army you're playing, your plan for the game starts with Deployment and goes from there.

    Like I said about my Samurai 7 list:
    It's a *very* general plan, exact placement depends on the terrain.
     
    yoink101 likes this.
  16. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

    Joined:
    May 23, 2018
    Messages:
    1,532
    Likes Received:
    1,236
    For me it's often a case of a Spitfire Daofei on one end ( Albeit I have tried the Hacker before, but I just prefer the Spitfire, there are other good HI Specialist in YJ IMHO. ) and a Hsien/Crane on the other end ( Albeit I am still waiting on my order for a Su-Jian, so I may experience the true might of ''My HI is better than yours.'' With a Daoying Hacker too. ).
    A Daofei in reserve can give you a first turn deletion on a TR REM. Or a well placed Guilang Sniper, those can also ruin the day of any TR REM.

    I've used the HMG LT Zuyong before, but I have been having the worst luck imaginable with it TBH: it's ALWAYS somehow the nearest non-FD/Infiltration unit to hidden enemy TO beatsticks. No matter how illogical their starting position is. T:

    Also, bit of an unrelated thing here, but I should probably emphasize that having multiple redundant ''roles'' in an SCG list is pretty important. You don't take one-two beatsticks to be fueled with orders, you, at the barest of minimums, take two, and should maybe even go as far as four units that can act as primary killers. Again, limited bodies, you're already putting all of your eggs in one basket, no need to make it just two big eggs in one basket to ensure they all crack when you drop it.
    Plus it saves orders in the form of ''I don't need to take my Swiss Guard to kill this little annoying thing when I have an ORC HMG over in that part of the table already.''
    Walking is expensive, it appears.
     
    yoink101 likes this.