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Delayed AROs, and Camo Markers...

Discussion in 'Rules' started by Neath Leanan, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. Neath Leanan

    Neath Leanan Member

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    Hello chaps, I need some help to confirm if this order of operations is correct...

    On my active turn I activate a Camo A marker, and perform a short move.

    My opponent has his own Camo B and Model C with valid AROs. Both choose to delay their AROs.

    With my second skill, I wish to surprise shoot both models. Can I declare the BS attack vs the camo token? Do I have to declare how I will split my fire at this point? My assumption is that do and therefore I cannot target the camo token, so Model C gets shot (alot).

    My opponent now declares his AROs. Model C shots back, face to face. Camo B also shots back, and cannot be opposed...?

    Is this correct? Thanks in advance!

    Richard
     
  2. LZ35SRX

    LZ35SRX Well-Known Member

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    One of main points of Camo marker state is that you may not target it with anything except Discover. And you may only declare Skills that are valid at the moment of declaration.

    So yes, your Camo A can declare BS Attack only vs Model C, and if you do so in LoF of Camo B - it may shoot you unopposed.
     
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  3. Spitfire_TheCat

    Spitfire_TheCat Feel the Wrath of the Miezi-Bot

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    I may not be the rules-guru, but doesn't the Camo B reveal himself when delaying ARO?

    If so, Camo A can surprise shoot both models, because both are visible.
     
  4. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    No they don't. Delaying an order is not part of Camouflage' cancellation clauses. I think what you're thinking of is the Hidden Deployment FAQ where delaying while in Hidden Deployment forces you to reveal the position of the trooper, but that trooper can remain in TO Camouflage state.
     
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  5. Spitfire_TheCat

    Spitfire_TheCat Feel the Wrath of the Miezi-Bot

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    Interesting. So Camo is the best protection against surprise shots. I think we always played this wrong.

    Edit: not the best … the best is still stupid SSL2 because of fireteams, but … "good" protection.
     
  6. Alguaciles_Ortega

    Alguaciles_Ortega Active Member

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    what if the camo that declared the surprise shot, does have a shotgun, covering both the Model C and Camo B, instead ? Does that grant an unopposed roll on the camo ? that considering the camo not being the primary target, but being involved anyway.
     
  7. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    In that case Camo B could use their delayed ARO to respond with a BS Attack, Dodge, etc to make it a F2F.
     
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  8. Neath Leanan

    Neath Leanan Member

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    In this scenario Camo A was a Spetsnaz HMG, but the impact template scenario is good to keep in mind. Thanks for feedback, looks like we played it right :)
     
  9. Alguaciles_Ortega

    Alguaciles_Ortega Active Member

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    One more to clarify on the go, please.

    Was what said in the quote be possible if Camo B was behind Model C as the models being one in front of the other ? To make the sentence more clear, I would refer to a situation where Model A being totally covered from the silhouette of Model C, like the three of them being put in line, straight.

    In that case, could the shotgun's template still being able to hit Camo B ?

    I am asking, just because I faced a similar situation recently, having instead two models one in front of the other being hit by a boarding shotgun, and at today I am still not sure if we played it right.
     
  10. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    Troopers don't provide partial or total cover, so the template can hit the Camo marker even if there is no LoF to the attacker.

    Being hit by a Template allows a trooper to make a Dodge ARO, so the Camo trooper can still Dodge even if the Attacker is out of LoF and ZoC (albeit at a -3)
     
  11. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Troopers and Markers do not block a template. Markers do not block LOF unless otherwise specified (see: Holo2). Model C would, however, most likely prevent Camo B from drawing LOF to Camo/Model A which would limit ARO options - unless A had moved such that there was LOF to it at some point in the order.
     
  12. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit SecUnit

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    1. The active unit, in marker state, declares Move. It Moves so that it has LoF on enemy unit C (in model state). It would have LoF on enemy unit B (in camo state), but the LoF is blocked by C.

    2. C has an ARO, and declares that it will delay its ARO. B does not have an ARO, because it has no LoF to the active unit (it might be in ZoC of the active unit, but this doesn't grant an ARO because the active unit has Stealth).

    3. The active unit declares its second Short Skill, a BS attack against C with a shotgun. It places the template to also cover B. This declaration cancels the active unit's marker state.

    4. B and C can now both declare AROs. C because it delayed its ARO, and the active unit revealed. B because it originally had no ARO, but received one when it became the target of a template weapon.

    C will probably declare BS attack, or possibly Dodge. Either way, it will be F2F against the active unit's shot.

    B will probably declare Dodge (at -3 because it has no LoF to the attacker). This will be F2F against the active unit's shot. It will cancel B's marker state no matter who wins the F2F.

    If B instead decides not to react, then if the active unit rolls any successes they will hit B unopposed, which will also cancel B's marker state. However, in the very unlikely event that the active unit rolls only failures, B will retain its marker state.
     
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