Cancelling Retreat for Antipodes, how many tokens?

Tema en '[Archived]: N3 Rules' iniciado por Spleen, 26 Jun 2018.

  1. macfergusson

    macfergusson Van Zant is my spirit animal.

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    That sounds to me like the exact opposite of what the rules actually say, but you seem like you're not going to be convinced that you're wrong, so this seems like it is turning into a pointless conversation.
     
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  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I can see it going either way, but only because the Antipode rule isn't widely used. That said, the argument is the same regardless if you see it or not, but do read coordinated order once again since some of the wording used in both the Antipose rule and Coordinated is remarkably similar.

    I'd say that if one Antipode is Isolated, it can't eeceive orders from the pool, meaning if you're trying to spend a regular order on the pack then any Isolated Antipodes will simply be unable to execute any skills of the order aand remain Idle.

    I can see an FAQ on this go roughly three ways:
    1. The Antipode that's Isolated won't even be activated (unless you're using their own Irregular order)
    2. The Antipode that's Isolated will activate but be forced to Idle (unless irregular order)
    3. As long as at least one Antipode is not Isolated, the pack can receive orders.

    I do not believe in that Isolated spreads nor affects any other member of the pack, neither that that is a correct interpretation nor tthat an FAQ will say this.
     
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  3. Spleen

    Spleen Well-Known Member

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    so, I think it's two different matters in regards to isolated personally.

    I'm happy enough to generally write off the "as a single trooper" as just meaning for combat group sizing purposes and still feel given the nature of antipodes and retreat there is a case that 1 token might fully cancel it for all 3. I don't think it's meant to mean all states are shared between all the models involved in either case.

    Given that, if you look at the G:Sync rules:

    G: Synchronized troopers don't provide Orders to the Order Pool, and cannot receive Orders from their Order Pool.
    And what are the primary effects of Isolated?:

    While Isolated, troopers cannot receive Orders from their Order Pool.
    If, at the start of his following Active Turns, the trooper is still Isolated, then he is considered to be Irregular and it does not add his Order to that Turn's Order Pool.

    It seems both these effects are already hard-baked into the nature of G:Sync, so RAW, I think isolating them does nothing to their functionality and they continue to operate when their owner activates. I'd expect a FAQ to probably say they go disabled and would be happy to play that way.


    What that means for Antipodes though, I don't know.

    When you spend an order on an antipode pack you are giving it to 1 of 3 options this much seems certain:

    1. The entire pack as a single entity
    2. Each individual member of the pack
    3. The spearhead who conversely activates the others

    But which of those is accurate? There just doesn't seem to be enough RAW to clearly draw a conclusion to me.

    It would be in keeping with G:Sync to just have them be unaffected and all 3 activate, but again I'm not sure that's what CB would tell us to do in a ruling, and locking down the whole pack because one is isolated seems prohibitive.

    I'd strongly argue for allowing the pack to still activate and saying the isolated trooper can't receive that order so the "if one member of the pack can't execute" clause kicks in and he idles. But that's purely based on what feels right to me.

    As to my original question of Retreat, it seems generally people are on board with 1 token, but again, who knows what the intention might be.
     
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