1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Betrayal - spoiler free

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Triumph, Aug 19, 2020.

  1. Paegis

    Paegis Vincible Officer

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2018
    Messages:
    187
    Likes Received:
    166
    Finally got my hands on Betrayal. Was a really fun read and really neat to see the stuff I see on the tabletop played out in graphic novel form. Seeing Adil and Ko Dali as characters rather than just unit profiles was cool. I've read 3O, but so much of that is written more as in-universe propaganda whereas this was a more on-the-ground look at things. Nice to see YJ being treated as the morally grey faction it is and not just the "bad guys" of the Human Sphere. Definitely makes me hungry for more, gonna probably start looking for Outrage now heh.

    Also, absolutely hilarious coming back to Triumph's first post in a post-N4 world.
     
  2. dhellfox

    dhellfox The keeper of the Forgotten

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2019
    Messages:
    589
    Likes Received:
    509
    as i mentioned in the spoiler thread, art wise it is a massive improvement over outrage, there's so much 'noise' in (outrage) pannels that it was difficult to tell what was going on or trying to convey at times.

    everything else i had is covered by this thread's opening post
     
  3. Lucian

    Lucian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2017
    Messages:
    431
    Likes Received:
    732
    Phew. It took me two weeks to finally sit and read it after getting the book.
    First impressions? The book is awful. It would be real nice if CB could just stick to one book size instead of using something between A4 (rules) and A5 (outrage). There's no extra cover this time; I really liked Outrage's manga-like paper, this time its a regular glossy paper; and there's no extras (no concept art, stories or funny comics).
    I'm not gonna lie, once I started reading I was hooked and didn't want to stop until I was done. And in the end It just... it felt empty. The story was so uneventful I can hardly recall what it was all about. There's no feeling of some journey like in Outrage, or jaw dropping scenes like their first mission on svalarheima.
    I get it that this story takes a completely different approach, but it I cant shake the feeling how good it could be if it was played like a detective story (since MC is technically a detective).
    The 'spy' thing for example, It unfolds REALLY fast. Imagine the tension if the mystery remained for a good half of the book? Or other bits and pieces about the events prior to the story.

    It's funny how Outrage set my expectations so high I pre-ordered Betrayal as soon as it was available and now my expectations for next book will be so low that i'll only buy it if the mini will be nice.
     
    Nuada Airgetlam likes this.
  4. toadchild

    toadchild Premeasure

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    3,887
    Likes Received:
    7,372
    I haven’t gone back and re-read Outrage, but I felt like it had a more interesting story than Betrayal. Betrayal was interesting from a setting / background perspective, but I felt like it fell very flat as an actual story.
     
  5. atomicfryingpan

    atomicfryingpan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2017
    Messages:
    660
    Likes Received:
    1,241
    Just got my copy the other day and I think @Triumph hits the nail on the head. Not as good as outrage but I wouldn't call it bad. I liked that we got to see what k1 ammo looks like. I wish we would have found out more about Ko Dali. I'm always down for more infinity fluff am happy to see they have 2 actual novels in the works.
     
    the huanglong likes this.
  6. jake richmond

    jake richmond Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    166
    Likes Received:
    292
    (My thoughts as someone who makes comics for a living)

    I thought Betrayal was pretty good, but not great. It told an interesting story, but it really felt like it needed more time for its story to unfold and its characters to develop. I found the art to be fairly mediocre. There was some fantastic backgrounds and vehicle rendering. The chase scene was really nicely paced and framed. However, any scenes that just involved characters speaking to each other was very visually dull. And unfortunately, this includes nearly all of the most important scenes of the story. It also bothered be that KoDali doesn't look Chinese, while the rest of the cast does.

    I thought Outrage was also pretty good. But like Betrayal, it feels like it ends just as its getting started. It feels like a film with no middle act, where every character is extremely under developed. The art in Outrage is much better than Betrayal, although there are pages that are too complicated to easily read.

    Overall I'm eager to see more Infinity comics. I hope they'll consider longer volumes.
     
    Usashi and toadchild like this.
  7. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    826
    Likes Received:
    1,122
    I feel Outrage definitely needs a sequel. It set up a lot of characters and relationships that don't feel like they were brought to a satisfying conclusion. Adil was built up as a character that really wants more development (he also needs to climb his ways back up the ranks and give us a climactic duel with Nourkias so that the latter has a reason for even existing).

    And in reference to the art, I think it's kind of transparent that the only reason Adil takes off his armour is because the artist got tired of drawing it. Real shame, too, since the Crane armour is such a cool design.
     
  8. jake richmond

    jake richmond Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    166
    Likes Received:
    292
    Possibly, but I doubt it. Comic artists don't typically have that kind of freedom unless they're also the writer. And plenty of the comic involves complicated machinery, ships, vehicles and armor, so I doubt that was a problem for the artist. My guess is that the writer specified which scenes Adil wears armor in.
     
  9. the huanglong

    the huanglong Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2017
    Messages:
    1,989
    Likes Received:
    3,582
    I thought the same initially, she's got a pretty sharp nose, jawline and brow line in some shots although it is not as if these features don't exist in Chinese people. I expect it's hard to make someone look Chinese without dark eyes and hair.

    upload_2020-10-15_22-24-32.png upload_2020-10-15_22-25-24.png upload_2020-10-15_22-24-42.png
     

    Attached Files:

  10. SpectralOwl

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    1,449
    Likes Received:
    2,113
    Nourkias has been around for a while (at least in Infinity), he's the Samaritan who killed Toni Macayana and shows up in that narrative pack as a free Samaritan added to the CA force. Although, since he's apparently just an outright-better Samaritan from the looks of the profiles, this is ridiculously ironic considering that exact situation with Tikbalangs is why they killed off Toni in the first place- and why Adil can get the hell in line for a climactic duel; PanO's got dibs!
     
  11. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    826
    Likes Received:
    1,122
    Who's PanO going to send to deal with Nourkias? Toni's corpse strung up like a puppet?

    Adil was in no condition to fight Nourkias at the time, but let's not kid ourselves, we got blueballed on that one. He literally disappears a moment after musing all about his murderboner for Adil. Sure, for an Umbra, they pop one of those every time they make eye contact with anybody, but the fact that he didn't skewer Adil in a manly fashion in that instant sure as hell feels like it better set up for something.
     
    SKOZZOKONZ likes this.
  12. jake richmond

    jake richmond Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    166
    Likes Received:
    292
    Sure. Chinese people, like anyone, have a broad range of appearances. I'm sure you could find Chinese people who look just like her. So I was hesitant to bring it up. But it did strike me that she was the only human character that didn't look Asian. When you have a human cast of specifically Asian characters, and the center of the story is about how one of them betrays the state and the rest question is she's the same person as before, or even still a human and not an imposter or clone, it seemed strange for that character to look far less Asian than the rest of the cast. to the point where I began to wonder if Ko Dali wasn't ethnically Chinese, and I had just never noticed before.

    Anyway, its a somewhat minor issue. But it stood out since the artist actually does a good job of differentiating all the other characters. Maybe Ko Dali's appearance here is the artist's attempt to differentiate her even more?
     
  13. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    826
    Likes Received:
    1,122
    Well, to give the benefit of the doubt, when she's illustrated in flashbacks she doesn't look particularly asian either, so at least it's consistent. Considering her line of work before joining the Tiger soldiers, I wouldn't put cosmetic surgeries to make her more 'ethnically malleable' out of the question, especially considering how easy they would be in the setting.
     
  14. jake richmond

    jake richmond Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    166
    Likes Received:
    292
    I found Nourkias kind of pointless in the story. I feel like he could have been removed entirely and it wouldn't have mattered at all.
     
    toadchild likes this.
  15. jake richmond

    jake richmond Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    166
    Likes Received:
    292
    Yeah, that did occur to me.
     
  16. SpectralOwl

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    1,449
    Likes Received:
    2,113
    You know, that's a damn good question. PanO has diddly-squat for interesting, developed characters these days, since Knauf and Uma the Mistake are canonically not part of the faction anymore. I think Bipandra and Konstantinos are jockeying for the "Best Character in PanO" throne from the fluff perspective, which is sad.

    That said, I don't find any aspect of Adil's to be all that compelling either, nor any other recent YJ character. It feels like CB have dropped the ball on Infinity fluff as of late, which is sad becuase Aristeia! and what I've seen of Defiance are pretty well handled and cohesive.
     
  17. the huanglong

    the huanglong Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2017
    Messages:
    1,989
    Likes Received:
    3,582
    She certainly didn't look like her old self in the flashback

    [​IMG]
     
  18. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    826
    Likes Received:
    1,122
    That might be for the best...

    Although we do actually see her with that hairstyle briefly, before she joined the Tigers.
     
  19. Benkei

    Benkei Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2017
    Messages:
    1,625
    Likes Received:
    2,172
    That mini was maybe ugly and big headed, but I'd love to see it redone now as it has more character than 90% of the CAD designed miniatures.

    P. D: I still have it
     
    #39 Benkei, Oct 16, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2020
    Usashi likes this.
  20. Del S

    Del S Tunguskaball

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2017
    Messages:
    1,169
    Likes Received:
    2,544
    You gotta have a Shadow the Edgehog ripoff if you want a real manga feel, I'm told. And as you know, if an Umbra isn't an edgelord, it's not an Umbra...

    Excuse me, sir, but Angus. Angus is the best Infinity character and therefore best PanO character.
     
    SpectralOwl and Willen like this.
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation