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Bakunin Limited Insertion for Interplanetario

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by Ghost87, May 6, 2018.

  1. Ghost87

    Ghost87 Well-Known Member

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    Hello free Folk,

    I am attending a limited insertion tournament in the near future and chose to field Bakunin forces again. But have to build contrary to my affection of stuffing the list with Morlocks and alike to push hard and conquer ground fast. Granted, it is easy to build a 10-order list with Bakunin given the sweet Grrl links and this is my change to go full Riot! Normally stick with the Haris option.

    So here my thoughts about this list, please share your opinion about it. I will do many test games and will also test changes proposed here and give feedback afterwards.


    The Riot Grrls fireteam is the star of the show. Their good firepower, great stats, two wounds and ok armor as well as fast movement never got me disappointed. They are also cheap as hell considering they are HI with MSV1. Would have loved to include a Spitfire as well but not enough SWC.

    Salyut Zond for holding/denying an area. Mainly a zone in SUPREMACY where it also gives extra points for baggage, holds small corridors with its total reaction combi rifle. Ths lieutenant Custodier can easily provide supportware as the Zond carries its own repeater. The repeater should also deny room against hackable targets.

    Moira MSR for support fire and scalpel attacks against HMG nests, TR drones, other snipers and alike. Who dares to FTF against ODD? May gets eaten by MSV2 opponent snipers/HMGs but that's life...

    Zero Hacker and ADHL Prowler are mainly for forward deployment, holding ground with drop-mine-AROs and hacking area. During active turn the main purpose is stopping the enemy HI and TAGs with surprise shot ADHL and Hacking as well as pushing buttons. Pretty standard.

    I also thought about taking a Kusanagi Haris to support the Grrls but she is not ITS legal at the moment. A Taskmaster feels unnecessary with all the Grrls in the team and TAG is no option because I do not own the Lizard (still hoping for a resculpt in 2019).


    [​IMG] Bakunin LI
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 33)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL MULTI Rifle, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 29)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Boarding Shotgun, Stun Grenades + TinBot B (Deflector L2) / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    [​IMG] REVEREND CUSTODIER Hacker (Hacking Device Plus) Lieutenant Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] REVEREND MOIRA MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Shock CCW. (1.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] SALYUT (Total Reaction, Repeater) Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 21)
    [​IMG] ZERO Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 24)
    [​IMG] PROWLER (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Adhesive Launcher / Pistol, CCW. (0.5 | 33)

    5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Thanks
     
  2. helsbecter

    helsbecter Ultrademocratic subSenator, #dominion Module

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    I'd be really worried about E/M and other immobilizing/isolating things... Being that it's limited insertion, that stuff is going to be more common since folks know there will be heavy infantry and TAGs to use it against.

    It's hard to say I'd do because five Riot Grrls leaves you short of options. Maybe like this? I'm not sure.

    [​IMG] Bakunin LI
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 33)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL MULTI Rifle, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Boarding Shotgun, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Boarding Shotgun, Stun Grenades + TinBot B (Deflector L2) / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    [​IMG] REVEREND CUSTODIER Hacker (Hacking Device Plus) Lieutenant Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] REVEREND MOIRA MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Shock CCW. (1.5 | 34)
    [​IMG] CLOCKMAKER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 18)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] REAKTION ZOND HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    [​IMG] PROWLER (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Adhesive Launcher / Pistol, CCW. (0.5 | 33)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  3. Kwisatz Haderach

    Kwisatz Haderach Zelenograd Shasvastii
    Warcor

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    Whenever I've tried Bakunin in Interplanetario format - I get a starco............
    Recent thing I've came up with is 3 Chimeras with 3 pupniks and 3 Taskmasters Red Fury + some support
     
  4. Savnock

    Savnock Nerfherder

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    Things that we can get in Bakunin that we cannot in Starco, which might be really helpful in Limited Insertion:

    - Uberfalls (although Massacre has some overlap in function, he's not nearly as fast)
    - Zero/Prowler camospam. Especially the infiltrating camo Spitfire.
    - TONS of hacking
    - The Lizard
    - Meteor
    - Decent Lt. choice that is also a support piece (Custodier).

    Limited Insertion doesn't let you take many things to check off must-have boxes that can just sit around: maybe one or two troops can get away with that. StarCo has great synergies with doctors and engineers who also do other stuff. The Lt. is less of a good synergy, because I really hate having hackable Lt.s in aggressive linkteams. Bankunin's synergies with needed specialists are the Rev Healer (expensive), Custodier Lt. (awesome and useful but vulnerable to KHD) and Kusanagi Lt. (great but also a lot of points if not in your primary linkteam, so less useful if you're not going full-nuns-link). The Lts are the biggest knot in planning Bakunin for Limited Insertion IMO.

    With all that in mind, if you do use some SoF, Emily and an aggressive or vulnerable Lt. would make a lot of sense, with maybe Yojimbo as your second choice (or a Yuan Yuan, Massacre, or someone else with smoke).
     
  5. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Morlock trainer
    Warcor

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  6. nazroth

    nazroth 'well known Nomad agitator'

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    [​IMG] Bakunin LI
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] RIOT GRRL Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 33)
    [​IMG] DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] BAKUNIN ÜBERFALLKOMMANDO . (0 | 23)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] CHIMERA Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Viral CCW. (0 | 20)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] x3 PUPNIK DA CCW. (0 | 3)
    [​IMG] BRAN DO CASTRO Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 33)
    [​IMG] TASKMASTER Lieutenant Red Fury, Pulzar, CrazyKoalas + TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Heavy Pistol, DA CCW. (1 | 53)
    [​IMG] ZERO (Minelayer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 19)
    [​IMG] ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    [​IMG] ZERO Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 24)
    [​IMG] PROWLER Spitfire, D-Charges / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 36)
    [​IMG] PROWLER Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Adhesive Launcher / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 32)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Would go for something like this.

    ML GRRL is for ARO, best Nomad ARO piece IMHO,
    Taskmaster is an LT that can handle most dangers. Not meant as assault piece, but rather a versatile LT, that protects itself. Option to bring death if required.
    Brando, Prowlers and Zeros varry from straight assault pieces, through forwad specialists, through mind games to denial etc, etc. Not taking Zeros in Bakunin is a sin.
    UberfallKommando is great. It provides Eclipse to cover approaches, or if you need to re-camo but doing so would otherwise mean getting killed. They are also bane of TAGs and HI links. Great counter against badass CC fighters as well.
    Last but not least is a Dactari to heal all this stuff when needed. 4 bots because they are both great spotters, can alarm rest of the company if something jumps at your back and can always try to ENGAGE when something comes from around a corner to take you out. Great thing to engage TAGs and other stuff - electric pulse is awesome and it turns Matrial Arts off.

    As for Riotgrrl link list - where's a doctor? These girls are shock immune, waste not to pick them up once they go unconcious.
     
  7. Recruit-3D

    Recruit-3D Active Member

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    Why would you fit 4 zonbots but only 1 operator?

    [Edit] Nevermind. You already gave the answer and I was under the fake impression, that you could only link 2 bots but re-checked the Wiki.
     
    #7 Recruit-3D, May 7, 2018
    Last edited: May 7, 2018
  8. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Probably had 9 spare points.
     
  9. Recruit-3D

    Recruit-3D Active Member

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    Thinking about it, i actually like the idea of Alarm-Spotters in your deploment zone.
    It also adds another defensive layer and your opponents will spend orders to get rid of the... for 3 pts.
    Intriguing .... .
     
  10. sarf

    sarf Well-Known Member

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    Why so? Just because she is such a order sponge with Dodge on 16? Only B1 in ARO and losing Cover bonus after first kill don`t ring any bells for me.
     
  11. nazroth

    nazroth 'well known Nomad agitator'

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    Riotgrrl ML has four out of five most important stats that translate into being a perfect ARO piece.
    * High BS,
    * More than 1 W (is shock immune, can take a hit and decide if she stays/hides),
    * High Dodge chance (flexibility of choice if MODs are against shooting),
    * Low points cost,
    The only thing she lacks out of five is High Burst (cuz it's not Tohaa, unfortunatelly),

    Now, what she has in return is:
    * Powerful Weapon (ML is a beast regardless of type of target, but excels in ARO due to being able to place a Blast Marker and take on additional helpless targets - that plus people piss their pants when facing ML),
    * MSV 1 (negating Mimetism, TO: Camo to -3, Smoke to -3, etc.),

    Being Shock immune means that usually she'll be there for you each turn.
    Freenzy is not an issue. Cover is nice and all, but she can Dodge like none other, usually is Unconcious at the start of each Active Turn anyway, then healed, stands up and is pain in the ass for the opponent all over again.
    Worth 33pts (11% of your points total) she usually takes out at least 5 enemy orders to be dealt with throughout the game. So in short this 11% of your points burns at least 16% of enemy Order Pool - usually more. Each time you use an order to heal (standing up might be done done with use of an Coordinated Order not to waste orders from the pool) you add to the number of order the enemy must burn to get rid of her, unless he covers the aproach with smoke or uses another route.

    She's a real deal pain in the ass. Tested a lot of ARO pieces. She is the best for me. Only real drawback is 2SWC which pains me a lot. Without Kusanagi it's impossible to fit her, Kriza HMG, Intruder HMG and 2 Morans alongside an Interventor into a single list - and that is pain.
     
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  12. sarf

    sarf Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for your detailed answer @nazroth
    I should give her a try))
    Where do you deploy her usually? At some rooftop to see a lot or watch some long single firelane?
     
  13. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Doesn't affect smoke.

    I have used some similar units to good success. I would consider it a pretty advanced technique though. Also I have a hard time not taking an Intruder MSR instead (outside Bakunin), but I understand the value of 2 W.

    2 SWC is the main killer. Bakunin's main SWC saver is the Red Fury Taskmaster, I would probably pair them to get a good higher ranged weapon while making up for the SWC.
     
  14. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    The general concept with ARO troops that aren't based around winning hard F2F's is that you want her to see the enemies that can't hurt her while the enemies that can have a hard time pinning her down. Hopefully that makes more sense after a few games of trying her.

    If you can see everything, everything can see you. If they have even one unit that can easily beat her it will do just that.

    If you can see across the board pretty far (diagonal) but not in to the DZ they at least have to tow their HMG out of their DZ or use up SK to get to her. All the while Warbands and Specialists can't cross the board until they do.

    Basically a narrow but long coverage that does not terminate in to their ARO clearer will add movement orders to dealing with her. Even if it does make it in to their DZ if you have deployment advantage you have the potential to deploy around them.

    However getting them to take their SWC guns out of the safety of the DZ is a favorite of mine since I almost always have an AD waiting to counter after they return to Total Cover.
     
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  15. nazroth

    nazroth 'well known Nomad agitator'

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    You're off course right. My brain melted - off course I meant Poor and Low vis zones. Against Smoke she can dodge with 16's. That's why you need high Dodge chance.

    Yup - been there first one and a half year intto Infinity. MSR Intruder was king back then to me - but afterwards it is an expensive sniper that overlaps with Intruder HMG (which is a must) and I grew to field Spektr MSR instead, to get a chance against full Fireteams. TO: CAMO -6 + 48" range is a killer against links, while Smoke+MSV2 trick is cancelled witth SS2 for 4+ linked troops. In my opinion nomads are about certain tools used for certain things. If you lack a tool - other tools will struggle dearly. Except Kriza Borac HMG - he's the ultimate tool :P

    Exactly what @loricus wrote above. ARO pieces are not meant to guard entire board - this leads to some badass counter taking ARO piece too fast. Riotgrrl is actually one ARO piece that I like to risk a bit, but always try to avoid setting her up across a unit that has a big advantage over her. Limited Insertion is a good format for this ARO piece - most real threats are easy to point out when setting stuff up.

    Either way - I like to place her on a building, in cover with a ZondBot somewhere close and covered from enemy LOF. She usually keeps one long firelane covered and has LOF to at least one objective. When I deploy her from Reserve I sually cover an enemy target so that it's activation would bring a Blast down some units nearby, thus posing a threat and denying enemy a possibility to activate some units. Usually this works fine.
     
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  16. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    The MSV2 is more about seeing through enemy smoke to WB counter than my own. I also find that SS2 is too prevalent on ARO troops to use it very often.

    I also make a lot of use of the MSR rangeband over HMG. Plus the Token State for a long range ARO troop can be brutal.
     
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  17. nazroth

    nazroth 'well known Nomad agitator'

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    I find Intruder ARO piece to be too easy to counter by many armies. With tools as fragile as an Intruder I'd rather keep them hidden in reactive, then use to full advantage in active. Exception is against Caledonia 30+ orders, where this guy would totally end up on top of the highest building with a JAG or Morlock close by to provide smoke the first time anything moves on the table - then start ARO'ing the shit out of the highlanders :P
     
  18. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    It's a delicate balance that requires a lot of prediction and behavior changes to your opponent. But it has been very vital for me.

    I wouldn't call it an ARO peice exactly, I usually don't overwatch until at least turn 2 after I've cleared enemy ARO troops.
     
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  19. helsbecter

    helsbecter Ultrademocratic subSenator, #dominion Module

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    This has been helpful to me
     
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  20. Savnock

    Savnock Nerfherder

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    I dig this list. If I go for Bakunin at the Interplanetario (currently deciding between that, StarCo, or maaaaybe Shasvastii), I will field something like this as my second list. It would get used for sneaky/area-grabbing missions against opponents other than ISS or other camo-heavy armies.

    Only alteration is I might consider dropping a Zondbot to make Bran a specialist. The boarding shotty is great, but being able to coordinate moves with 3 forward specialists to get the drop on objectives last turn is pretty priceless. The E/mitter could actually come in handy in Limited Insertion, too.

    Zondbots are frigging AMAZING in Limited Insertion. I end up using them to detonate things a lot, if I have 2 or more.
     
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