1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hemos actualizado nuestra Política de Privacidad acorde con la nueva RGPD. +Info // We've updated our Privacy Policy to comply with the GDPR. +Info
    Dismiss Notice

Asteroid Blues - Arrival

Discussion in 'PanOceania' started by AdmiralJCJF, Aug 26, 2019.

  1. SpectralOwl

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    587
    Likes Received:
    928
    That imgur gallery shows that a user called TheFit nicked some of the Admiral's pictures, and badly might I add since the troop choices were different. I fail to see how this is definitive proof that anyone except TheFit has acted improperly.

    Also, @AdmiralJCJF, may I suggest that your links to the Heart of the Hyperpower fiction pages be reposted under FanFic? It seems like a more appropriate location, and less likely to be derailed like it has been here.
     
  2. Mc_Clane

    Mc_Clane Zhànzhēng bùzhǎng
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,020
    Likes Received:
    2,336
    Dude, do you take into consideration that any player can make another profile and that's as far as a ban goes? This is internet.

    And what are your reasons to say to a player, no, you can't play. That attitude is toxic.

    No if the fake reports are being nullified. Remember there's a limit on how many reports you can make a week. so making those reports null is taking away some power of hardcore players
     
  3. meikyoushisui

    meikyoushisui Competitor for Most Ignored User

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2017
    Messages:
    1,385
    Likes Received:
    1,892
    You're right, we can't stop 100% of cheating so we should do nothing about any of it. Do you see why that's a terrible argument? Besides, they have to play against other people, and at least other people might be more scrupulous than them.

    I think cheating is a pretty good reason to not allow someone to play, personally. Allowing cheaters to participate creates a much more toxic environment than banning them. Do you disagree with that? And if so, why?
     
  4. A Mão Esquerda

    A Mão Esquerda Deputy Hexahedron Officer

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,892
    Likes Received:
    1,913
    Or repost once the In Character threads are started.
     
    AdmiralJCJF and SpectralOwl like this.
  5. A Mão Esquerda

    A Mão Esquerda Deputy Hexahedron Officer

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,892
    Likes Received:
    1,913
    The righteous certainty means there’s no need for reasons.
     
    AdmiralJCJF likes this.
  6. gregmurdock

    gregmurdock Extremely Beloved Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    452
    Likes Received:
    925
    lmao at imagine giving a shit about this but also lmao at cheating when we know the "winners" are already predetermined
     
  7. Mc_Clane

    Mc_Clane Zhànzhēng bùzhǎng
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,020
    Likes Received:
    2,336
    Dude, those things are taken into consideration. The lack of public info about them doesn't meen they're not doing anithing

    And when you say cheaters. You mean allegedly cheaters. You really don't know if their opponents are fake or not, if their report are copypasted from last year or whatever. You just wan't to believe it and because you can't be wrong you're right.

    I've seen some shity reports like a guy playing on his bed on Icestorm material with his wife laying down on the other side of the bed... but I have my doubts that even that means shit. Has a dude that purchases his first Infinity staff not allowed to poorly play and report the game? You're just imposing your moral standard

    Let the cheaters cheat, they'll be caught, they'll ruin their faction. Because their faction takes action acording to the numbers they see, not the real ones. When the filters are set and the fake/unvalid reports are nullified, their faction will pay the price. They'll Will be seen as cheaters, and fingers will point. That's how this crappy campaign system works. I would love to have a better one... but this is what we have

    PD. If @AdmiralJCJF was indeed a cheater during last campaign... maybe that's the reason pano didn't perform so well. But I'll break a lance in it's favor presuming He wasn't. Even if I don't know the guy in person or if he has so bad taste to play pano as main faction :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
     
    #47 Mc_Clane, Aug 27, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2019
  8. Jimbro

    Jimbro Camouflage Token

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    43
    I wish I could say that I'm righteously certain that you'd be opposed to playing against someone you unequivocally knew cheated in a game against you, but your responses so far don't seem to indicate that you'd care, which is really strange.

    I'd probably have moved on after my first post if I didn't have to defend the idea that cheating is bad, but here we are.
     
    SKOZZOKONZ, Pierzasty, Lesh' and 3 others like this.
  9. meikyoushisui

    meikyoushisui Competitor for Most Ignored User

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2017
    Messages:
    1,385
    Likes Received:
    1,892
    There is a difference between making mistakes and cheating, conflating them is a bad argument.

    Clearly not given the number of people defending the cheaters here

    No, as has been highlighted earlier in this thread, inflated counts of battle reports can discourage players from taking certain actions, even if those reports are ultimately thrown out.

    That's the opposite of how the burden of proof works. The fact they have said and shown nothing means we should assume they have done nothing.

    And you repeated the very poorly constructed "we can't stop all of it so we should do nothing instead" argument.

    Is this really the hill you want to die on?
     
    Lesh' and Hecaton like this.
  10. SpectralOwl

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    587
    Likes Received:
    928
    While I don't agree that you have compelling evidence that OP is a cheater, I do agree strongly with this. The high number of rejected PanO reports had effects which altered the strategy of many factions; Ariadna wasn't free to pressure PanO, which meant PanO could pressure YJ, which meant YJ had to defend and couldn't launch an attack against NA2. Cheating has an undeniable negative effect on the campaign and has the potential to rob a lot of people of a well-earned victory or defeat. However, enforcing anti-cheating measures in this type of situation is pretty much impossible, so just do your best to make sure your own games and those around you are above-board as that is the most that can be done practically.

    Now, can we stop talking about Cheating At Toy Soldiers here at least, as it is wildly off-topic? Maybe make a new thread?
     
  11. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,810
    Likes Received:
    4,655
    I figure if TheFit was confirmed to be someone other than JCJF that's something we would have heard about.

    He's also been very consistent about cheating the batrep system by posting battles to different locations depending on the outcome.

    The whole thing is extra fucked when considering that I know other people have been banned from the BoW campaigns for far less. So there's *less* accountability for WarCors, I guess. And if a large portion of people are turned off of these campaigns because they know that their efforts mean nothing next to someone who falsifies a whole crapton of batreps? I guess that's acceptable.

    I mean, we know that JCJF's been advocating for playing below-board with the selective reporting and so on. CB/BoW probably knows a bit more about whether or not JCJF was cheating, but I'd think that if there was no reason to believe JCJF was TheFit, that'd be made public knowledge. I know I would want to know if that was the case. Rather, it seems to fit more closely with some of CB's other handling of misbehavior, which is making it a "private matter" and hoping to sweep it all under the rug in the name of harmony.

    Anytime it's JCJF posting about narrative campaigns, it's on topic.
     
    Lesh' and meikyoushisui like this.
  12. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,994
    Likes Received:
    3,981
    That is the plan.

    But, first things first.
     
    A Mão Esquerda likes this.
  13. atomicfryingpan

    atomicfryingpan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2017
    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    809
    Who and what did they do?
     
  14. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,810
    Likes Received:
    4,655
    Edited text into their batreps criticizing the points system for the campaign.
     
  15. atomicfryingpan

    atomicfryingpan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2017
    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    809
    Who was banned for that?
     
  16. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,810
    Likes Received:
    4,655
    A member of my local playgroup. I don't know what their ITS handle is, since they moved away.
     
    meikyoushisui likes this.
  17. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    2,994
    Likes Received:
    3,981
    Of course, the obvious idea that someone was caught and banned is clearly too challenging for some users.
     
    A Mão Esquerda likes this.
  18. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,810
    Likes Received:
    4,655
    [​IMG]
     
    meikyoushisui likes this.
  19. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2017
    Messages:
    949
    Likes Received:
    1,256
    I think @Hecaton is trying to make the point that when a member of his playing group spat the dummy and quit the campaign in a spectacularly public fashion he was asked not to continue participating because of the suspicion that placed on him by association.

    Members of your group reposted your pictures as false reports, in one case using your pictures before you had even posted them yourself, and where a video on youtube video exists of that same table setup with models and markers in the same place claiming that the other faction won...
    Additionally you submitted images dating back to before wotan as a placeholder, and also images from wotan that were used by the people faking reports.

    None of these things prove "cheating" however, they do raise a lot of suspicion. The problem we have here is that a lot of people have been making very loud accusations of cheating with no facts to back up the suspicion, which means that a lot more people are willing to discard any accusation regardless of evidence, reason or fact. The flip side of this is that by ignoring any accusation, the accused doesn't get a chance to properly defend themselves, so the people that think they're guilty are never shown reasonable doubt.
     
  20. Vaulsc

    Vaulsc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2017
    Messages:
    96
    Likes Received:
    283
    I've been playing AdmiralJCJF for the last 4 years and featured a lot of our games (including a few campaign games) on my YouTube channel. He hasn't cheated in games and hasn't in the campaign. It's obvious a small section of the community doesn't like him (I get annoyed with him during rules arguments at times, but we're cool), but these kinds of accusations really are out of line.

    It is possible that some of his reporting is careless. Last campaign, he accidentally put some photos of a game against me up into a report that was written about a completely different game. That was a one-off event, I talked to him about it on FaceBook messenger and could see where the mistake happened. Looking at pics of his other games, as I sometimes do, I can see which member of our community he played against, and can tell when and where the game was played. It's slightly disappointing that he spends more time playing against family/flatmates than people at the LGS who stand a better chance of beating him, but that's beside the point. He isn't cheating anyone.

    I really wish these repulsive campaigns wouldn't even happen in the first place though. They really bring out the worst in people. You really want to read batreps of a guy beating up on some defenseless noob again and again? You want to buy into a system that incentivizes that? Is it that worthwhile posting low-quality batreps and linking us to music videos that don't relate to 'the game you played'? BoW campaigns are honestly the worst time on the CB calendar by far. Yuck.
     
    Goonhammer, cazboab, volgo and 4 others like this.