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Aleph N4 changes

Discussion in 'ALEPH' started by Bard, Sep 25, 2020.

  1. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    I think Atalanta might be the first non-REM with total reaction, that's pretty cool.
     
  2. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
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    Some of this probably stems from the fact that one of the signature Aleph traits - durable units with NWI - are now just as frequent elsewhere.

    But as an OSS player I don't have a reason to complain. When OSS was released, it was crazy strong and flexible. It's even more flexible now, with less restrictive fireteam composition, while other armies are playing catch up. Vostok might be strong, but I think it's actually on par with Rudra. Sombras are good, but I prefer the options Yadu give me. Devas Wildcard, Posthumans with a well deserved nerf - and some boosts where needed, Mk512 and Mk3 will be fun - let's just say, that I don't really feel restricted or lacking for options, when constructing an OSS list.
     
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  3. Devil_Tiger

    Devil_Tiger Your Friendly Neighborhood Asura

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    Huh i don't feel like the proliferation of NWI+Immunity (Shock) is as much an issue in N4 as it was in N3, the new crit mechanic put those in severe danger of getting straight up killed, while in N3 they could just sponge the crit.
     
  4. Nemo No Name

    Nemo No Name Aleph Cultural Atache
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  5. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Being realistic here:
    • MULTI weapons got AP/Shock & DA modes (snipers, rifles, even pistols...)
    • This edition there is an intentional push for more elite lists, with HI and TAGs, or at least CB attempts to
    So, shock ammo will be there more. And NWI profiles tend to be low ARM too, specially in Aleph aside from the real HI troops.

    Should the Devas have Shock Inmunity? I think not, they are already awesome troops for their cost, evenif they require a little more finesse than a whole unit with standard gear and different weapons. In OSS, they also are wildcards, so...
    Should the Posthuman bodies have Shock Imunity? The 1W+NWI bodies... nope. Too cheap for mk1 and mk5.
    Nagas / Dasyus? I'd surely welcome the sniper profile with Shock Inmunity, frankly, so the sniper duel lasts a little more than a single roll (not that the sniper Naga profile is ever used, but...).
    Greek Characters? AB.SO.LU.TE.LY
    Atalanta, Penny and Andromeda already have it, Achilles and Hector get it for free with the 2nd wound. So, there is hope the named heroes with NWI will get it too (Myrm Officer? Not named, sorry but this is for named heroes).

    Let's pray for that, at least.
     
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  6. Iver

    Iver Human Plus

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    Wait... Can Andromeda use Guard to place D-charges on things from range? If so, that's a hilarious mental image of that dog plonking a slab of C4 on someone. I know her Martial arts won't add damage to the bomb since it doesn't use her physique to do damage but that's still a scary scary weapon to hit someone with.
     
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  7. SpectralOwl

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    Yes. It can kneecap them with her Breaker Pistol, too.
     
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  8. Iver

    Iver Human Plus

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    Guard is hilarious.

    Gonna bring her in every game from now on until I manage to pull that stunt off. Can't wait to see my roommate's face.
     
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  9. Teslarod

    Teslarod The Squeeze has not been Sqouze

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    Her CC Attack (+1 DAM) works though since it's not tied to her PH as MA DAM boni. DAM15 AP+EXP at 8" right there.
    I think of her as having a very nice Shotgun that rolls on 24s. Funny enough her worst enemy are competent CC troops.

    EFFECTS
    ► Allows the user to perform a CC Attack but with no need to reach or be in Silhouette contact with the target.
    ► Both the user and the target can perform Skills and apply MODs and CC Special Skills that require Silhouette Contact

    How exactly does an ARO against Andromeda work btw?
    To me it reads as if troops can ARO with CC Attacks against her from inside LOF and COC unless you turn off Guard (fortunately it is Optional, unfortunately that means it's on by default if you forget about it).

    The other interpretation would be this only triggers after you got targeted with a CC Attack using Guard, in which case it would be a hillariously broken counter against any CC troop. Move->trigger ARO->Then beat that weaksauce ARO with a CC21 MA2 FTF or follow up with B2 Shotgun DTW.

    The latter one seems a bit too broken to be reasonable and I'm inclined to read the rules as supporting the first option.
     
  10. Devil_Tiger

    Devil_Tiger Your Friendly Neighborhood Asura

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    Since the ARO is declared before the second short skill, maybe you can declare a CC Attack ARO, and if she do something else, the CC ARO turns into an Idle?
     
  11. Iver

    Iver Human Plus

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    Ooh, the Yadu NCO just went down to 1.5 SWC. Nice.
     
  12. Terrenor

    Terrenor Active Member

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    Finally, I had no reasonable explanation why the Yadu should pay 2 SWC. Same as the Marut.
    But in the first reply form Koni our hellouis they said the 2 SWC were intended.
     
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  13. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
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    They also said so about Celestial Guard sniper's and hacker's costs, which were fixed as well. They might not want to admit mistakes, but at least they fix them ;)
     
    #133 Stiopa, Oct 5, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
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  14. Sigeric

    Sigeric Irregular WB

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    I've been reading favorable comments about the Apsaras and how they go really well with the Zayin, however...

    We're talking about a 22 point trooper (1 CAP in generic) that only grants +2 BS to a TR bot. My concern is about the opportunity cost, as for more or less the same points you can get a dakini HMG, a proxy Mk. 4, a Krakot and a Liberto, etc.

    Sure, you can get the bot in cover, boost the BS, and then add markmanship to the mix, but the Apsara herself is not a superb gunfighter, the RemDriver is not a specialist and I think her points would be better justified in another ARO piece instead of boosting an existing one somewhat.

    But this is all just theory, as I couldn't try the combo for myself. Anyone had any luck with it?
     
    #134 Sigeric, Oct 7, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2020
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  15. Pen-dragon

    Pen-dragon Deva

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    Wow! Been out of the loop, what with the apocalypse and all. A lot of changes to digest. I realize that a new edition is a time to streamline, and Infinity definitely had some unit bloat. However I lost a lot of my go-to Aleph units. I had a lot of Greeks I liked to use in Vanila. The one that is really crushing, is the loss of Ajax. He was one of my top 3 favorite figures and profiles. He almost never survived a game, but regularly took out many more points than he cost. This has seriously cooled my enthusiasm for the game.
     
  16. Iver

    Iver Human Plus

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    We'll be getting SP back in November. A few sectorials (and Tohaa) were delayed. There's reason to be excited to see what they'll do to revamp the greeks, expect a whole lot of shock immunity.
     
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  17. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Well, one of the main problems that seems to come up in N4 is the lack of trustworthy ARO pieces. While the Mk4 HRL is a superb piece and now costs less SWC, and the Mk3 is a great hunter (and a proper choice against the Mk4 HMG), a Total Reaction bot with Climbing Plus and 360º visor that now can go prone is a great defensive choice, that also is nearly as hard to remove from the table than the Mk4 (and has better Burst).
    Problem with those 'bots is BS11 + PH10 => Smoke combo from cover outside of good range makes them roll BS with -12 (autofail, since their BS is 11) or dodge at PH10 (the -3 to dodge to remotes is gone, at least!). With the Apsaras, they go to BS 13 (the WIP 14 is not as interesting, since the discover rolls will be made by other units, but it can counter an enemy hacker trying to Carbonite through a repeater) and can also get Supportware for Marksmanship (but personally I don't like the idea of the EVO with S4 and 15pts sitting there doing nothing, frankly), while the Apsaras can go around keeping tabs on enemy AD troops. She's not a superb fighter, but with a BS13 SMG she can go Suppresive Fire and cover an enemy approach.

    This being said, I fail to see a competitive use at this time for the remdriver skill, due to all the limitations (dies with the buffer or the remote, can't be changed, etc...), aside from the cheapo 12pts ones in all vanilla armies (the melee one is hilarious, specially for the Lunokhod's D-Charges). The Apsaras is better, if you are going to use her, in the Zayin because, simply speaking, a single dakini HMG won't cut it, linked or not, now that the Yadu NCO with HMG costs 1.5 SWC and can make a nice offensive Haris with Parvati and a Deva Sensor (for the hunt of markers, because it's cheaper than the Spitfire with MVS2); and the Dakini is more prone to be totally killed than the Zayin (hackers, warbands, etc...).
     
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  18. Sigeric

    Sigeric Irregular WB

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    Indeed. A couple of days ago I tried an Atalanta+Chain Myrmidon for smoke dodge and a Zayin+Apsara as ARO pieces. Atalanta was MVP, hands down. The girl blasted an Aquila HMG in reactive and put a wound on a Jotum, meanwhile the Zayin died to that same Jotum next turn. Luck aside (this is the same game my Achilles v2 died from a SINGLE rocket ARO from a Helot) I need more games before I can draw a definitive conclusion on the matter, but I feel the Zayin+Apsara is not worth it at a competitive level. The whole thing is marginally worse than having a Sin-Eater, and if and when your opponent deals with it, the Apsara is just an expensive cheerleader. If the profile was a specialist operative, then I could at least march her forward and try to do objectives with a more or less disposable trooper. As it is, she's just on guard duty. I think I prefer the Mk4 HRL and M5 FO instead.

    On another topic, I'm realy liking the danavas for their general utility and the fact that they carry pitchers. A shame no profile in Aleph has a deployable repeater (on a Naga it would be so nice...), but goes very well for pushing alongside a myrmidon spitfire. I want to try that duo plus a deva spitfire in group 1, and see if Penny can do her thing in group 2 with 5 orders+impetuous.

    Oh, and one last thing: does the deva lt. with triangulated fire also have sensor, or it's one of those not-stealth-for-the-sphynx, not-hidden-deployment-for-mk2 kind of deal?
     
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  19. kinginyellow

    kinginyellow Well-Known Member

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    it appears to be correct that the deva Lt does not have sensor. I dislike it greatly but that is my understanding of it.
     
  20. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    I sure hope it's a typo, because frankly it makes the Lt Deva completely obvious, making him quite useless...
     
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