1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

About FRRM in N4

Discussion in 'Ariadna' started by Urobros, Mar 13, 2022.

  1. Urobros

    Urobros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,792
    Likes Received:
    1,382
    Sadly, after the Fireteam rules plus changes and the profile update, I can't argue in favor of merovingia... Definitively they are only good to be in the box. Yes, we can now put a 112 in a Metros fireteam... "yep", to do what exactly? Sadly, I will stop even to try do some use of the frenchs. If someone manages to do something with them, I will be happy for it, and please, don't forget to let us know "how". Because I run out of hope for Merovingia with the changes.
     
  2. pumadriftcat

    pumadriftcat Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    7
    I've had success with FRRM at the start of this season running 0 links. Before the fireteam changes, a good shooty link can be a bit pricey, and some times I'd have to throw in my squishy Lt. The biggest problem with them is that they are all 1 wound models.
    I found myself running Knauf a lot because he basically functions as a haris, but at the cost of 1 infiltrating Moblot. I'd have to play him smart and try to pick off anybody that he could see. I rarely kept him on ARO duty, and left that to the Zouave sniper.

    I ran the Anaconda for a while, which worked until I rolled up against a Cutter. Duo'ing the Anaconda with Wolfgang was nice since you were bringing a CC guy to fend off any other d-charge wielding maniac looking to blow up your tag.

    After the Cutter experience, I figured that M5 is a must. It keeps your opponent in check and if they deploy poorly, they will have a bad time. Duroc and Margot can jump in where they need to be if you need to take out armor instead of spending orders to get guys into place. Margot's grenade launcher is as good as a pure Ghulam link spec-firing. Duroc can do the same with his grenades and not put himself in danger.

    When going 2nd, I'll try to look for a good opportunity to put my infiltrating Moblot on SF with the command token. -9 usually ends up eating more than 2 orders for your opponent.
    When going first, I like to do coordinate panzerfaust with 4 metros to take out their big ARO duty piece. You can sometimes throw Knauf into that coordination since his B3 drops to B2 when he is the spearhead.

    One of the biggest things to do is to just decline to ARO with your metro w/ panzerfausts when your opponent moves>discover them. Force them to spend the extra order to discover>shoot you instead, unless its a TAG that moves out into the open.

    Unfortunately I don't run them as often because some of missions are scaling up a cliff instead of an uphill battle, where vanilla can easily complete the mission objectives. IE. I guess I'll yolo roll for my infiltration on my opponent's side for Rescue or L&S.
     
  3. Urobros

    Urobros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,792
    Likes Received:
    1,382
    As probably you could see, the list I posted was that kind of "no links", but while I really like this kind of approach for merovingia, when I go into a tournament not always will have place to deploy that "list approach" or the missions requires something else, so I usually run one of that kind and another more "classic approach", which usually isn't too great but more or less can do the work. Right now, after the changes, you pretty much can't do something we could call "fireteam reliable", because the FRRM hadn't stronght fireteams for instance, only "meh fireteam", after the changes the "meh" mero-fireteams went beyond the "limit of playable". When I said playable I mean "to have an opportunity to do more than roll dices and wait for good or bad look", but mero don't have too many units which can be beneficed by an extra cheap fireteam. Of course, if you want to put them on the table, roll dices and nothing more, then we can still say that FRRM is playable. Maybe and I say only maybe, the general downgrade for fireteams, will made the "non fireteam base list" a little better, so we still can do use of this kind of approach if the missions are suitables for it and even to think about win some game.

    Duroc and Margot are, of course, a thing yet, even better now because the fireteams will have more problems fighting back this duo, but, still, too table and mission dependant to be "the weapon" you will need for every match. The weight of every battle can't be supported every time for a so narrowed options. Even the "non fireteam list" will suffer against players which would have confronted this kind of lists previously... and now you can't switch for a list with "other approach" beacuse it will be one not really good. This is why I'm not happy with the changes for FRRM and why I have little hope for them from now.

    FRRM will be for "romantic players" only, until some changes come.

    Best regards!
     
  4. surfimp

    surfimp Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    25
    I'm back to Infinity after a long (5+ year) break due to lack of local opponents. That situation has, happily, changed, but unfortunately I see that the situation for my favorite faction, the FRRM, has also changed, and not for the better.

    This thread was a bit of a rollercoaster, from the initial guarded optimism for FRRM in N4, to the eventual "shelve them" dismissal after the recent-ish Fireteams update.

    Is that where the story ends for FRRM, for now at least? Do they serve only as a challenge faction for now?
     
    Urobros and csjarrat like this.
  5. csjarrat

    csjarrat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,747
    Likes Received:
    1,845
    Basically yeah, there's some basic tools in there that can achieve an objective but you're effectively comitting yourself to either a 5 man loup or briscard team if you want to win a shootout, with knauf and chasseurs and mirage 5 most probably.
    There's not really anything else to the faction for winning face to faces; the old mix team for ITS with the moblot pointman, algy hacker and metro specialists isn't going to work very well now the BS has been slashed
     
    surfimp likes this.
  6. surfimp

    surfimp Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    25
    Don't threaten me with a good time! ;)

    I've picked up a friend's Invincible Army collection to give me a more competitive option, so I won't feel too bad rebuilding my (sadly sold off years ago) FRRM faction for... romantic purposes, as Urobros puts it.
     
    burlesford and csjarrat like this.
  7. csjarrat

    csjarrat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,747
    Likes Received:
    1,845
    I'd you can leverage a good attacking push they'll do fine, they just aren't equipped to survive one and your key problem solvers will be the same 4 models in every list so it's probably good you've got a second faction to play
     
    surfimp likes this.
  8. Urobros

    Urobros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,792
    Likes Received:
    1,382
    You can play with then if you are (or the TO are) picking the missions to "control zones" like Front Line, Supremacy, etc. In that case list with "nobody at home approach" could do the trick, but nothing more. But this on the "Competitive side".

    For "fun games" with friends you can play whatever you want.
     
    chromedog and surfimp like this.
  9. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    4,272
    Likes Received:
    9,662
    Bit of a necro, but I don't want to create a separate thread just for some random wishlisting and theorising. I'm thinking about picking FRRM at some point in the future, and after looking at the real life inspiration - Rapid Reaction Force - and reading about French military history, doctrines, and practices I've had a few ideas about what I'd like to see:

    Spahi - historically these were light cavalry units, recruited from French colonies in northern Africa. They'd make for a good basis of French bike units, but - to differentiate from other Ariadna bikers - I'd love to see such a unit reflect French approach to reconnaisance; recon units are actually expected to fight, which is why they make use of vehicles like ERC Sagaie, or, more recently, EBRC Jaguar. Therefore, FRRM bikes could be actually light HI units, with NWI and Shock Immunity, armed with AP Spitfire, Autocannon, or rapid fire GL, and access to Sensor, FO, or Hacker with Spotlight only.

    Tirailleurs - it was a term used for French skirmishers, or, around WWI, infantry units recruited from colonies. This would make it a perfect name for Wulver skirmishers; FD, optimised for CQB, working well with FD Zouaves who are more fragile and provide long range firepower.

    Para-Commandos - I'd make them the first true Ariadna Combat Jump unit. The model from Kosmoflot box certainly looks the part of a HALO/HAHO paratrooper.

    Hussards - 1st Parachute Hussar Regiment is an airborne cavalry unit, which also was a part of the Rapid Reaction Force. These would make a good pure Parachutist replacement for Para-Commandos, with no Mimetism, but some more versatile weapon and equipment kit, maybe access to Docs/Engineers.

    Rimailhos - Rimailho 1904TR was a 155 howitzer and one of the first modern French heavy artillery pieces. Rimailhos would be FRRM's SHI, counterparts to Blackjacks and Ratniks, but more focused on long range fire support with weapons like rapid fire Autocannons, MLs, HRLs. No close range weapons, but with access to Guided BS Attacks, and with ARM 4 to maintain 4-4 speed.
     
    SpectralOwl, Urobros and Jumara like this.
  10. Jumara

    Jumara Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    64
    That would make the "current" HI the Moblot's extremly sad as they do NOT even get Dogged and only have as much ARM as a USARF Grunt.

    But these are great ideas lets hope 2023 is the year of Merovingia!
     
    Stiopa likes this.
  11. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    4,272
    Likes Received:
    9,662
    In case of any real rework of the Merovingia I'm pretty sure Moblots would get a rework as well. Even simply giving them Dogged or NWI while keeping BS Attack (Shock) would make them good, especially with a modern fireteam structure.
     
    Urobros and Jumara like this.
  12. colbrook

    colbrook Grenade Delivery Specialist

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    9,327
    Likes Received:
    17,131
    Cavalry don't generally map onto bikers, they become armoured units, bikers are motorized infantry. Spahi could be a good basis for a second TAG, possibly something lighter than the Chernobog but more heavily armed than the Anaconda, or with Mimetism and Forward Deployment to represent that it's a recon unit.

    I still like the idea of a unit with an elite statline that brings in equipment and skills not usually found in Ariadna thanks to Merovingia's relative wealth and trading links. This hypothetical Foreign Resourced Operator Group could be Sectorial unique with things like Hidden Deployment, multi weapons, Mimetism-6, Super Jump, etc, but not all on the same profiles.
     
    Jumara and Stiopa like this.
  13. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    4,272
    Likes Received:
    9,662
    I know, bit of an oversimplification on my part. If I'd have to choose between the concept and name I'd definitely keep the concept and leave the name for something else. Recon TAG sounds good.
     
    Urobros likes this.
  14. SpectralOwl

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    1,903
    Likes Received:
    3,165
    A lot of what MRRF has already remains solid even into N4, but the gaps in its design are growing ever more apparent with each passing update. My wishlisting tends to focus on fixing up a few areas of increasingly major shortcomings:
    1.) Firepower. MRRF is chronically undergunned, and it had trouble dealing with armour and harder defenses even back in mid-N3. With the current power creep, it can be ludicrously difficult to deal with certain opponents (if you see an Avatar, you're dead). The whole faction leans almost entirely on the lavishly-updated Mercs to fill this gap, and Knauf and WolfWolf McWolfington aren't enough to carry the firefighting capability of an entire Sectorial.
    2.) Cost. MRRF has some of the game's most fun and cheap Infantry and Skirmishing, but almost no top-end options to splash those savings on. You're down once again to the same set of fancy Characters just to fill the "elite" side of your list.
    3.) Scoring. ITS has left MRRF way behind with the shifts to what scores in many missions. In particular, the supposedly-better-than-usual Hacking presence needs to be made into something useful and there needs to be a solution to Looting and Sabotaging who doesn't even sound like "wolf".
    4.) Links. MRRF Fireteams are almost counter-productive given almost everything that makes the Sectorial great is hidden under Camo. They need to be made a bit more useful and less vulnerable.

    @Stiopa 's suggestions are pretty good for these- a fast anti-armour bike/recon TAG would be a very useful option that synergises well with MRRF's defense in depth, and a FD Warband-like option to help cover Zouaves would be great too- though I wouldn't make them Wulvers; fluff-wise Merovingia has far less of them than the other Ariadnan nations and Ariadna as a whole already has plenty of Dogface units to choose from. More AD between Para-Commandos and M5 wouldn't hurt either, but super-heavy infantry runs a bit counter to MRRF's fluff and design space of not having the usual fancy Ariadnan toys (Antipodes and Teseum) and instead doubling down on the tricky infantry. We do need something linkable with a big fire-support SWC gun though, if only to bust Gammas and TAGs set up as roadblocks.

    My personal addition for an MRRF new unit would just be a LT option who doesn't stand out like a sore thumb for being a plain rifleman in a 15-trooper list where you can damn well afford better. Camo, Decoys- I don't care, just get me a way to not guarantee the death of my LT against Impersonators without spending 20% of the available army on useless shell game Rifle Metros.
     
    Jumara and Stiopa like this.
  15. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,361
    Likes Received:
    4,101
    Especially given Spahi were originally heavy shock cavalry in Ottoman service. The French, apparently, adopted the name for their colonial troops in a later era.

    As for the "LT unit" - how about an unit with Holomask? Haqq have that with Hafza, and Ariadna - especially, Merovingia - had, tradiotinally, good realtions with Haqqislam.
     
    Savnock and Stiopa like this.
  16. Jumara

    Jumara Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    64
    I would like to see more E/M or Adhesive Weapons options insted of any Ap HMG or similar to emphasize the Tech trading MrrF does. It would jack up the price and get you Anti Armor capabilitys without pushing into other Ariadnan faction spaces.

    (If one of the Moblots would for example had an E/mitter (+1B) or E/Marat or Riotstopper of some sort in exchange for there Light Shotgun. or even some Blitzen as an option in the faction.)

    Also Para Mines is an unexplored space that could "save" the French in there Anti armor struggle but that would be real nasty.

    Furthermore I was sad that the Chasseur Ap Sniper has left, it was at least some kind of tool to get Hi's and stuff, right now the Merc Charakters have to fill in and I do like them but having no other options is not to my liking.
     
    Savnock and Stiopa like this.
  17. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    4,272
    Likes Received:
    9,662
    @SpectralOwl I mostly want to see FRRM SHI for the Rule of Cool. I like those S5's ;) And it wouldn't fit the army less than say, Shakush fits Hassassins.

    @Jumara there's some decent E/M in form of mines on Zouaves or Moblots, and Dozer with Blitzen. But additional Blitzen or E/Marat wouldn't be amiss. For Riotstoppers, I feel it would be a good addition to Loup-Garou kit, if not for the way they've buffed Immunity (Total) -_-
     
    Jumara and Savnock like this.
  18. Savnock

    Savnock Nerfherder

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,584
    Likes Received:
    2,676
    This is an excellent idea. Ariadna with holomask tech gives the French a slightly-more-advanced tech tool that Kosmoflot doesn’t already have.

    ISWYDT.
     
    #38 Savnock, Nov 28, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2022
    colbrook and Stiopa like this.
  19. Jukebox3113

    Jukebox3113 Highlander

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    37
    Loving all these ideas! Want to add a bit of my own. Just spitballing.

    Zouaves I think have most potential for updateing. Mimetism -3 would go along way for these guys as a whole but I also think holoprojector would possibly be even better! It certainly would fit with the defensive theme.

    Briscards need climbing plus. They are mountain soldiers after all.

    Loup garous need a spec option. And i think breaker pistols wouldnt be out of the question either since that gets around total immunity so it be on theme.

    I agree that Moblots getting dogged or nwi is needed and should at least count as metros if not briscards (as they are actual soldiers)

    Kaplans would be fun additions to the army as well as a O-12 unit (maybe blue coats to go with police theme)

    As for new units. Another camo skirmisher would be great!! Especially if they had neat tools like jammers and a perimeter deployable such as crazy koalas would fit them great as the french already have a good relationship with the nomads.

    Now that mekaniks and elektroniks are a thing lets get those. And i like the idea of a size 5 long range unit or even a Mul that loses guided but gets a PAC +1B and light riot stoppers.
     
    Savnock, Jumara and Stiopa like this.
  20. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    4,272
    Likes Received:
    9,662
    I feel Mimetism is used like a crutch too often on newly introduced or reworked units. I'd like to see it used more sparingly.

    Regarding Zouaves, I'd start by allowing them to form Duo and Haris links. Ability to field well armed teams right in the midfield sounds like a very FRRM thing to me. Now, I'd change their loadouts a bit:
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust, E/M Mines
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust, E/M Mines (Minelayer)
    • Boarding Shotgun, E/M GL
    • Rifle, Light Flamethrower
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust, Flash Pulse (FO)
    • AP Spitfire (Sapper)
    • AP Marksman Rifle (Sapper)
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust, Medikit (Paramedic)
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust, E/M Mines (Lieutenant)
    This makes them a formidable forward screen, which can dish out a lot of hurt, can take back some thanks to Dogged, and gives off vibes of a grizzled trench warfare specialists.

    Next, Metros. I'd like the standard, non-infiltrating options to look like this:
    • Rifle, D-Charges
    • Rifle, GL
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust
    • Rifle, Flammenspeer
    • HMG
    • Rifle, D-Charges, Medikit (Paramedic)
    • Rifle, D-Charges (Lieutenant)
    • Rifle, D-Charges (Mimetism -3/Forward Deployment +8")
    • Rifle, GL (Mimetism -3/Forward Deployment +8")
    • Rifle, Panzerfaust (Mimetism -3/Forward Deployment +8")
    • Rifle, Flammenspeer (Mimetism -3/Forward Deployment +8")
    This would give them some more firepower while keeping the theme of lightly armed support infantry without really heavy weapons or specialized training. And the ones with Mimetism/FD should be able to join Zouave links, introducing some options and tradeoffs.

    Moblots:
    • NWI to make them properly durable
    • Wildcards with (Metros) and (Zouaves) Keywords, to allow them to bolster their fireteams
    • Number 2, to reinforce the above point
    • FD instead of Infiltration
    • FD loadout with BSG/Panzerfaust
    • Blitzen instead of E/M Mines - they don't have the time to plant mines, but some spot E/M option wouldn't be amiss
    And getting back to Mimetism - it'd be completely in character for Briscards, as well as the Climbing Plus @Jukebox3113 already mentioned.

    edit: I'd also like to see FRRM command structure reinforced. They're one of the most cohesive and professional sectorials in Ariadna, and their C&C should reflect that. So, good Lt options (at least one with +1 Command Token), CoC, NCO choices.
     
    #40 Stiopa, Dec 1, 2022
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2022
    Savnock, csjarrat and Jukebox3113 like this.
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation