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A MOment of bitterness

Discussion in 'PanOceania' started by Judge Dredd, Mar 13, 2019.

  1. Skoll

    Skoll Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    i dont disagree , im clarifying the other posters statement . I in fact think the second discount on hospitaller was unnecessary and was done to lessen the blow of the magister link, but that's a decision i dont agree with either

    @eciu i think santiago got cost adjustment , not a further discount prob some of their gear got recosted or re balanced.

    KoTHS def needs a discount and Teuton just needs the rework we keep saying it does. FK just suffers from being a beefy stat boy. Overall cost of cc needs to honestly drop, non frenzy units with CC get slapped in the face with an over-inflated cost for a stat with marginal utility
     
  2. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Teutons, yes, we both agree they need a fix.

    KotHS is a solo piece but he's good enough to roll with it, the rest of the package compensates. This is true for every HI solo bruiser in the game. Access to skills like FD2 on an attacking gunner is worth paying the premium for the armour much the same as people will pay the premium on a Hsien just to get the MSV2 on a big gun and good BS stat.

    FK's discount is he can get core link bonuses out of a LI link (and he doesn't have any inhouse competition in that role either unlike a Shang Ji).
     
  3. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    LoL.
    FK has hard competition from Santiagos. Basicly only FK who is somewhat "better/different" from santiago is FK ML.
    One could also make a theory that Santiago BSG was squatted to make a point of taking FK BSG also vialable.
     
  4. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that's my point there. Santiago can fill in for them but the FK has options the Santiago doesn't have.

    Personally my complaint about the FKs is Assault sucks, but that's less a complaint about the FK and more a complaint about CB need to rework Assault.

    Simply making it a common skill so fireteams can reliably perform it without fucking themselves over and removing the LOF requirement would go a long way to making it more interesting.
     
    #264 Triumph, Mar 23, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2019
  5. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Yes, very very narrow options (which is sad for this unit), which could be solved within Santiago unit (and allowing FK to be reworked a la Montesa or KotHS).
     
    Judge Dredd likes this.
  6. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    To be fair the other half of the problem is the Santiago Spitfire profiles should not be a flat wildcard and should've had limited links it could access. If you make something a wildcard and then give it multiple point and SWC discounts + make it a gunner it's a nobrainer you're gonna run into the problem that it starts encroaching on other model's territories.

    Assuming the Santiago stays as is they just need to go over the FK and give it different gear options to increase the number of viable profiles. Start doing things like allowing it to access HMGs, Grenade Launchers, Heavy Flamethrowers, Drop Bears etc he'll have less issues because the base statline is fine when applied to cheap core link bonuses.
     
    Skoll, AdmiralJCJF and eciu like this.
  7. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    and this is exactly the problem of FK.

    Personallt I would go for Veteran +Number 2 plus some gear but either solution could work.
     
  8. fari

    fari CRISTASOL, EL LIQUIDO DE LOS DIOSES

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    Basic Sergeants are overpriced. Or maybe Securitates are underpriced.
     
    eciu and AdmiralJCJF like this.
  9. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Actually they're pretty much much in line with most stuff. If you compare them against Celestial Guard they come out as close as you can get without making the points system more granular.

    Securitate could be mildly undercosted but I'm not really sure how many points Veteran is supposed to be worth.
     
  10. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    I think MO might work better with OS link with HRL and TO camo with a sprinkle of knights. Full HI links still feel better done else where.
     
    Tourniquet likes this.
  11. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    Securitate are undercosted. Compare them to Morat Vanguards.
     
    Lesh' likes this.
  12. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Actually yeah between Veteran and +1 WIP/BS they're definitely getting a discount.
     
    #272 Triumph, Mar 23, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2019
    Judge Dredd likes this.
  13. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

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    Morat Vanguards have like, PH 12 and CC 14 and so that's why they cost more than Securitate. Securitate aren't getting a discount, they have two stats over Alguaciles and Veteran L1, which all probably cost like 1pt each and therefore 13pts overall.

    Anyway. Father Knights seem pretty good IMO. The Assault Hacker is useful, the Missile Launcher is useful, and any profile with Nimbus Grenades is criminally underused I imagine but when it comes to taking on links? Nimbus Grenades are awesomely good.
     
  14. Deltervees

    Deltervees Crash Test Dumbass

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    The Dad Knight lost the nimbus in the update, sadly.
     
  15. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Which profile once more ?
     
  16. MrNailbrain

    MrNailbrain Relentless Optimist

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    The FK FO used to have Nimbus grenades. I used it all of once, and I love me some Father Knights.
     
  17. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    I know this exactly ;)

    Trust me I've complain about FK FO Nimbus long enough :)
    (and then been told it work against enemies dodge in CC ^^)
     
  18. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

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    Awwww that's lame

    They were good and useful
     
  19. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Curiosiry question when did you actually used Nimbus ?
     
  20. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

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    Nimbus is amazingly good against any fireteam and I take Nimbus wherever possible if I can.

    Sadly some factions have no Nimbus at all, and this is super lame! I think that they are great. All of the hoo-haa about that linked Kamau MSR and if you just chuck a Nimbus down and half that ARO Burst it's much much easier to deal with. Basically if you are coming across powerful linked AROs, or Overclocked REMs, Nimbus Zones are very useful.